TROGDOR! Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Here's an update- I have the car for now as once I get it working right it'll be my ride to work (thanks James!). I got it to run! Sprayed some carb cleaner through it and played with the idle setting, and now it will start right up and run. However- the idle is very erratic, idling anywhere from 2000 to 3000 rpm. Below 2000 it will not idle, just sputters and dies. I tried driving it, and it runs fine above 2500rpm- anything lower and it runs either way too rich or way too lean- totally loses all power and dies, and when started again, runs so low that the tach doesn't register- with my foot to the floor. Then after 10 seconds or so it revs up and runs OK again. My bet is it's running lean as it wasn't acting like it was flooded- I never let it backfire (neighbors wouldn't like that at 8:30 AM) so I wasn't able to get the definitive answer. This was with that solenoid unplugged. Skip- the carb in your pic doesn't look too much like the one on James' car. According to the pics in the Haynes manual it looks like the EA81 Hitachi. Unfortunately this Haynes manual has no diagram of the EA82 carb- it jumps straight from EA81 to SPFI. I'm rather new to carburetors so I can't guess exactly what this solenoid is, but my guess- just from looking at the pics- is the ADS. The only difference I've seen between the old carb and the new is that the new one has 2 wires- a red and a black- going to this solenoid, where the old one only has a black. According to what I've read here, having the ADS unplugged would'nt seem to cause these problems I describe. Also, even when I was playing with the idle and had the car idling at 3000+ rpm, it never dieseled when I shut it down- not even once. Just shut itself off smoothly and quietly. This leads me to believe that this part is NOT the ADS. Any suggestions? I plan to swap all 3 wired parts later today if I can't figure anything else out. Here's a pic of the object in question. It is located forward and below of the choke. It's the object I'm touching with the screwdriver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 it sure sounds like an ADS problem to me, although I can't make it out in your pict. The red wire no doubt goes to a hot when the key is on source (the choke is a good place) the black needs grounded. I sent you a couple extensive emails, please check them. and if you have time get back to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_talk Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 I’m with Skip on this one, the function of the ADS is to close off the idle circuit when you turn off the key so that as the engine spins down it cant draw in fuel and run on. On most carbs the idle circuit effects the mixture up to about 3000RPM, I bet if you connect the ADS you low RPM problem will disappear. But I wouldn’t wire it to the choke, on my ’87 the choke only has power after the engine is running, you want the ADS open with the key on, the power wire for it is there in the 3-wire plug (car side), you just need to ground the other wire. Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 I agree with Gary, the choke is there and could be used as a test but.. why not use a test light on the connector from the body, find the proper battery feed. It has to be on that connector. Splice a spade connector on the red wire and plug it in. Ground the black wire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raverjames21 Posted February 18, 2004 Author Share Posted February 18, 2004 I hope you guys are right. I would hate for the car to have another problem, especially now that Steve needs it as his primary transportation. I will probably go help him out as soon as my food digests a little. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROGDOR! Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 OK... I did just what you suggested. I plugged the red wire from the ADS into the proper spot in the plug, and grounded the black wire to the frame. The car starts up easily and idles smoothly now, with no more loping- though at 1500rpm. If I let the idle screw out any amount at all the car will sputter and die the second it starts running without the help of the starter. It seems it is just unable to idle below 1500. When I try to drive the car, it bogs down at anything below 3000rpm- the second I hit the gas, RPM's drop to zero and it backfires out the tailpipe. Then, as soon as I push the clutch in, the RPM's jump right back up. It does this in any direction and (so far) any degree of incline. I fixed 2 vacuum leaks already and will search for more. Possibly this could just be something simple now. At least I'm making progress in the right direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Me still wonders if you have a duty solenoid controled feed back carb, with out the controls Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROGDOR! Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Went to check for vacuum leaks and now the car won't even start. Cranks and cranks but will not run on its own. I'm running out of ideas and the situation is looking dire. If I don't get this car running today I WILL lose my job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Where is the old carb? Will it start with a shot down the carb thoat? We have to find out if for some reason you and James (when he had this no start problem) are loosing fuel or spark. A shot in the throat and it fires tells us fuel. Then we find out if the fuel pump is ticking Wasn't it running atleast with the old carb? I'll email ya also Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROGDOR! Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 It had been running with the old carb (sort of- the float was bad and it wouldn't take turns), then eventually wouldn't start. Spraying down the throat did nothing. This one had been running great earlier today- no trouble getting it started- now nothing. The fuel pump is running, I can hear it. Found a way to get to work tomorrow, so at least I bought myself some time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_talk Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Don’t give up yet Steve Before when it was starting, did the engine get to operating temp? Is the choke connect/adjusted? The back fire is typically a sign of a lean condition, these emissions carbs run VERY lean and will not start or run cold without the choke, especially at low RPM. How long has it been since this carb was running, sounds like some of the smaller passages (idle and mid circuits) could be plugged up. If so, carb cleaner may help but a good teardown cleaning may be the only solution. You may be on the right track checking for vacuum leaks, try the spray around with WD40/starter fluid. Even if the engine is warm try propping the choke mostly closed, if this helps the start/run it would confirm the lean condition. Then you have to figure out why... to much air (vac leak), or to little fuel (carb trouble). If it will run a higher RPM I doubt it’s a fuel pump or float level problem. And I do wonder about this feedback carb that Skip mentioned, I wonder just how the system works and what is the default (power off) position of the solenoid, rich or lean? Just some thinking out loud Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_talk Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Check your fuses, with all the messing around with wiring you may have grounded something at the wrong time and popped one. (I did it two days ago working on my choke) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Have you done a basic coil wire to ground check for spark when it's in a no start? Could it be flooded? And the plugs are now gas fouled beyond firing? Pedal to the metal crank crank crank?? Lots of questions but we are trying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROGDOR! Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Yes, got cranking while the pedal is to the metal. Nothing, not a thing. Will check coil and plugs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_talk Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Yep, with a no start its back to basics. Fuel Spark Compression Timing (ignition & cam) Assume nothing, check everything Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TROGDOR! Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 GOT IT!!!! IT'S ALIVE!!! ALIVE!!! MUAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! Turns out the coil was bad, but the plugs were still good. Swapped in the coil with a known good one and she fired right up. Tried to drive it, and boom- bogging down again. Swapped all the wired components with those from the old carb and tried again- idling at 5000. Turned the idle down, tried again, idling smooth and level at 1000. Took her for a drive and she's running better than she has in the past year!! No more rough/no idle, no more running rich, no more stalling on turns- it's cured!!! BIG thanks to everyone for your help!!! Sorry I sounded like a whiny little biotch at times, I really was freaking out. THE RED BEAST LIVES AGAIN!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skip Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 A hearty "WELL DONE SIR LOIN!!" Congrats and persistances pays, very glad to read it." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raverjames21 Posted February 18, 2004 Author Share Posted February 18, 2004 Thank you Steve for your determination in getting my car running. I would have given up long ago. Time for new plugs! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All_talk Posted February 18, 2004 Share Posted February 18, 2004 Good Work, Determination Wins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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