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W series Toyota trans adaptors


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#126 mellow65

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 01:04 PM

you are correct about turbo pull style aplications, but on the LS 1 Chevy, they changed back to push style after trying pull style, its a cool idea, but not practical, kinda like reverse cooling
the pull style was also engineered around the main bearing , in particular the thrust main bearing, if you are going to change from push style to pull style you should be sure your crankshaft main thrust bearing will support the movement



as much as i can't believe subaru would change much on the thrust bearing because they basically hate to change anything, you do bring up a good point. at trip to subaru and ask if the parts are even different would be a start or at least touch them both and see if they are different.



"Go over to legacy central and talk to red devil about his NA push style clutch in his twin charged legacy wagon. "

that dude is nuts!for sure.....:eek:cheers



right, well the 400+ awd wheel hp via the NA push clutch has to say something. and if i remember right, that was like a $300 clutch that he had made.

and he uses that for drag racing, i can't picture anyone ever making that kind of power and being able to put it to the ground of a rwd subaru.

when i did my rwd in my lego for a couple weeks it was hell getting going some times. i got stuck on a small wet hill. that rear suspension never was meant to take all the power and doesn't know how to transfer it to the ground properly. aka, squat, weight transfer, things subaru never really designed into the rump roast end of the legos+

Edited by mellow65, 28 November 2010 - 01:11 PM.


#127 Buick350X

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 01:33 PM

lets have some fun >;o)
one of your fearless members asked me about a bellhousing to mate the Sub engine to a purely RWD unit, preferably the Toyota W series transmission, I thought it was a neet idea


Pure genius, if you are in need of an apprentice / slave long as I learn something I have no problem working for fun BS’in in the garage. I got one of them screwed up brains where I only learn by doing. Probably 75% prepared for the things you do but lets say 50% to be safe, hours are flexible as I do what you would probably call hack work making [steel] parts for motorcycles no ones makes and do small parts powder coating. Which is enough to keep me off the street and out of trouble but not enough to have more then a 10x10 shed as a workshop. Though I have a good eye, allot of times all I have is a pic off the Internet to copy a part.

Only helped build a trans adapter once and did mostly muscle work and it would be hack work also, but buddy wanted more gears so we put two cheap 4 speeds end to end in his Ford truck, some endput and input parts, a few junk clutch center and a $100 welder, but the sucker was strong, was neat shifting gears in reverse. [We did roofing then and wanted a cheap way to crawl around new construction houses safely, to use the truck as our starting platform when it was a mud pit.]

I stay out in Oregon by Maumee Bay State Park right now.

#128 bill hincher

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 02:19 PM

Pure genius, if you are in need of an apprentice / slave long as I learn something I have no problem working for fun BS’in in the garage. I got one of them screwed up brains where I only learn by doing. Probably 75% prepared for the things you do but lets say 50% to be safe, hours are flexible as I do what you would probably call hack work making [steel] parts for motorcycles no ones makes and do small parts powder coating. Which is enough to keep me off the street and out of trouble but not enough to have more then a 10x10 shed as a workshop. Though I have a good eye, allot of times all I have is a pic off the Internet to copy a part.

Only helped build a trans adapter once and did mostly muscle work and it would be hack work also, but buddy wanted more gears so we put two cheap 4 speeds end to end in his Ford truck, some endput and input parts, a few junk clutch center and a $100 welder, but the sucker was strong, was neat shifting gears in reverse. [We did roofing then and wanted a cheap way to crawl around new construction houses safely, to use the truck as our starting platform when it was a mud pit.]

I stay out in Oregon by Maumee Bay State Park right now.


You got a sister?

#129 Buick350X

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 03:04 PM

You got a sister?


I fear the reason behind that question ;)

Yes married and not handy in the shop.

I can PM you more info if you want to know more about the things I do.

#130 bill hincher

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 07:05 PM

I fear the reason behind that question ;)

Yes married and not handy in the shop.

I can PM you more info if you want to know more about the things I do.


there was an old tool commercial with two guys on a roof and the one guys wife comes home with a skill saw and some hammers and shows her husband what she had done, after the wife got done telling her husband she wanted to get him more tools , the other guy asked him if 'she had a sister' because he wanted a gurl just like he had, it was all in good fun >;o)


I own and run an import car repair shop during the day, I do mechanical work and all the bookwork/taxwork involved
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my shop is where I go to relax and build things
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I mostly stay alone, because stuff I do requires so much thought and I block everything thing esle out
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I build complete cars too from frame work to electrical to paint, I do it all , by myself, just to enjoy it
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Thats why this stuff takes so long, I am usually building 3 projects at a time over a variety of stages
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Edited by bill hincher, 28 November 2010 - 08:32 PM.


#131 Numbchux

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 09:42 PM

No really how much power you thinking you goiing to make that push style clutch isn't going to take?

Go over to legacy central and talk to red devil about his NA push style clutch in his twin charged legacy wagon.

You're thinking the pull style is a superior clutch pressure plate, its just a different style, and the NA push clutch can be made and for about the same money to hold damn near as much power as you think you can make.


a LOT more than the devil ever made.


you are correct about turbo pull style aplications, but on the LS 1 Chevy, they changed back to push style after trying pull style, its a cool idea, but not practical, kinda like reverse cooling
the pull style was also engineered around the main bearing , in particular the thrust main bearing, if you are going to change from push style to pull style you should be sure your crankshaft main thrust bearing will support the movement


All turbo transmissions use a pull. so off-the-shelf clutch kits are mostly the other kind. There are options, just not a ton.



Read my post again. I do NOT think that one design is inherently superior than the other. Just that most options are designed for pull-style.

I am more than aware what is possible. I was just hinting that this will be a big power build. Suffice it to say Ziptie is thinking of building something for Baja.

#132 mellow65

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Posted 28 November 2010 - 10:32 PM

so your saying off the shelf stuff is going to hold a LOT more then devils making?

sure, i guess for a couple grand you can get some crazy clutch.

but real world is Bill didn't want to work with pull type clutch. push is easy, its simpler to make, a simple threaded hole for a pivot ball verses tons of extra machining to make a pull style clutch work.

for a older gent making some damn nice things in his shop and not charging us thousands dollars to do it, i learn to smile, say thank you Bill, and not worry about crap like this. deal with what you have been given. if you still want a pull style clutch, run a 6 speed, weld the center diff call it good.

or have Bill make you what you want, i'm about 1000% sure it wont be any where as cheap as this is going to be.

#133 Numbchux

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 12:37 AM

I had another attempt to tell you what I meant by that post. But since you're just skimming through the thread looking for stuff to fight about, I decided not to bother.

I was just throwing out a teaser that we have a big-hp RWD project on the drawing board. (see the period? That's all. end of thought. don't try to read between the lines)







Bill. Keep up the amazing work! I'll be watching closely, and if things go in that direction, I'll be in touch!

Edited by Numbchux, 29 November 2010 - 12:40 AM.


#134 mellow65

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 12:50 AM

dude i read all your postings,

you're saying it's going to be a challenge to find a suitable push style clutch, many people are telling you it's not going to be.

Bill knows there was a pull style, it's the first question he asked me when i talked to him on the phone the first time, with an almost painful sounding "please don't let it be a pull clutch, please don't let it be a pull clutch" sound when he asked. But if he's not to concerned, I wouldn't be.

i'm just saying, don't worry about it, there is tons out there in the way of clutches, even for your billion HP baja monster. :grin:

#135 Numbchux

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 12:52 AM

you're saying it's going to be a challenge to find a suitable push style clutch


:rolleyes:


This is hopeless. I'm done.

#136 mellow65

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 12:58 AM

:rolleyes:


This is hopeless. I'm done.


sweet online forum victory, LOL:lol:

nothing is sweeter :lol::lol::lol:

:grin::grin::grin::banana::banana::banana:

no worrys man, i am hopeless. :)

#137 bill hincher

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Posted 29 November 2010 - 08:39 AM

now comes one of lifes leasons we can all learn from

The reason McDonalds resturants are so succesful and VW bug worked so well was because the menu was short!

mellow and me talked about a bellhousing designed and built for an entry level, regular guy that wants to do something a little different at a decent price with parts he can get at any parts store or junk yard and have some fun, end of story.

If you want a high level / pull style/ exotic clutch, no problem, it costs about $5000.00 for me to develop and build a special bellhousing with one purpose, i have no problem with that, E-mail me, get you facts together and I will build you one

But dont change the rules in the middle of the game

#138 WoodsWagon

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 10:51 PM

If you're making huge power, you can afford to spend the money to get an adequate push type clutch built for you. You may need to play around with the right combo of hydraulic master/slave bores to get one that you can operate without wearing your leg out but that isn't a drawback to this design.

Bill, what you're building is great and I don't want you to feel for a minute that anyone is criticizing your design, which I don't believe was Numbchux's intent, but it came across that way.

#139 Numbchux

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Posted 08 December 2010 - 12:22 AM

Bill, what you're building is great and I don't want you to feel for a minute that anyone is criticizing your design, which I don't believe was Numbchux's intent, but it came across that way.


OF COURSE that was not my intent!! Really? was I that unclear with this??

I was just throwing out a teaser that we have a big-hp RWD project on the drawing board. (see the period? That's all. end of thought. don't try to read between the lines)







Bill. Keep up the amazing work! I'll be watching closely, and if things go in that direction, I'll be in touch!



#140 bill hincher

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Posted 08 December 2010 - 07:24 AM

all my work is constantly in progress, it evolves into a final form, I will probably add the cable control clutch at some point and I remain flexable to new idea's all the time

there is the rough casting, I gotta test machine it yet, but I wanted to show some progress, I am just now finishing some details on the T 5/Mits bellhousing that I gotta finish

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the pattern I built is on the left, the new casting on the right, its the only time the pattern will ever be used, its put on the shelf now and the new casting becomes the new pattern for repeated use
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I will clean this up and detail it out for weight and strength
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I will cut an undersized starter pocket before re casting
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#141 mellow65

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Posted 08 December 2010 - 11:51 AM

you know that feeling when you were a kid and it was christmas morning and you running towards the tree and your eyes lighten up with sight of presents.

yeah, it was pretty close to that looking at bills last post.

awesome awesome awesome :banana::banana::banana::banana:

#142 bill hincher

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 06:55 PM

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Edited by bill hincher, 10 December 2010 - 06:59 PM.


#143 mellow65

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 08:25 PM

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quite possible the most beautiful picture i have ever seen.

don't tell my girlfriend. :lol:

random question bill, what did you get that motor out of?

it's got a factory oil cooler on it, the thing sandwiched between the oil filter and block.

#144 WoodsWagon

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 11:26 PM

Probably a 99 forester, would be 8 bolt bellhousing, oil cooler, and big cyl bore.

#145 bill hincher

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Posted 11 December 2010 - 12:16 AM

quite possible the most beautiful picture i have ever seen.

don't tell my girlfriend. :lol:

random question bill, what did you get that motor out of?

it's got a factory oil cooler on it, the thing sandwiched between the oil filter and block.


I donno, I called the local junk yard I deal with and asked for a Sub core, so he sent me this
I bought another one off E bay to get the 8 studs , so I will not be using this one anymore

#146 monstaru

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Posted 22 December 2010 - 02:04 PM

so ,technically, this will adapt early "G" series 4wd trannies as well?they are the same 9 bolt design as the "W"s yeah?sorry, i am cross reading everywhere for this.....cheers, b

#147 bill hincher

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Posted 22 December 2010 - 04:18 PM

so ,technically, this will adapt early "G" series 4wd trannies as well?they are the same 9 bolt design as the "W"s yeah?sorry, i am cross reading everywhere for this.....cheers, b


from what information I have gathered, the W series Toyota 5 speed ( W 55-59 non turbo) is the same input length at the pre '96 R 151 and 150 which was built for the v6 truck and 22re turbo engines in 4wd and 2 wd

then after '96 R 151 and 150 was built for the V-6 truck but an inch was added to the input shaft length
so here is the deal

w-55-59 and pre 96 r 151 and r 150 = 6.5 inch input shaft

r 154 Toyota Supra turbo trans = 7.25 in input shaft

after 96 r 151 and r 150 V-6 Toyota trans = 7.50 input shaft

so I should be able to build my W 55 bellhousing to accept the pre' 96 R 151 and r 150

And i should be able to add 1 inch to my R 154 bellhousing to accept the after 96 r 151 and 150 trans

#148 bill hincher

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Posted 22 December 2010 - 04:31 PM

sorry about being late with information on the bellhousing, but I been working out the details on the engine swap and motor mount location on the Starions


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i got to square the engine not only up and down but also sideways and the angle of the engine , so there is no twist, then the mounts can be built


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I did this because I need to work out the remote shifter to fit the trans for the Subaru conversions, they will go hand in hand

Edited by bill hincher, 22 December 2010 - 04:51 PM.


#149 monstaru

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Posted 06 January 2011 - 08:24 PM

i have had the ************ in my garage a couple of times now.currently no.BUT, am working furiously to make this happen.please don't fizzle out , please.:-pcheers, b

#150 bill hincher

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Posted 06 January 2011 - 10:57 PM

I do apolagize freind,
I am sorry for my delays, I got a lot of pressure to develop the TKO option for some other engines and its like a good book that I just couldnt put down,
I wont let you down, I just need to rest a little between stages while building the bellhousing, I need to think out what I need to do next while thinking 2 or 3 steps ahead ,like playing chess

soooooooooooo while I was building the Sub set up, I worked out the problems for my T 5 and TKO set up on the Mits engines, and while I work on the Mits engine set ups, I think about the Sub, I been feelin kinda guilty so I better get back to the Sub >;o)


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this will fit either the T 5 or the TKO toe either the first or second gen narrow block 4G63 or the 4 through 9 EVO engines

Edited by bill hincher, 06 January 2011 - 11:04 PM.





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