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voltage jumping to 18v?


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27 replies to this topic

#1 True2Blue

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Posted 10 May 2010 - 01:58 AM

dash check lights stay on. 'brake fluid' 'brake light' and 'battery/charge' they were flashing on and off today but the ru was running fine. the rpm's had no effect on the the flashing. everything i can think of seems tight. id rather not rip the dash out, but if i have to....

anyone have a semi pinpoint idea? ill volt meter it in the morning and see whats up...

it does charge at 13-14 volts
nothing else was on while it was doing this...

#2 Ross

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Posted 10 May 2010 - 03:08 AM

So are you saying that the dash gauge reads 18V but you've independently measured the battery voltage to be 14V?

#3 True2Blue

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Posted 10 May 2010 - 03:52 AM

So are you saying that the dash gauge reads 18V but you've independently measured the battery voltage to be 14V?


sorry yes thats what i mean

#4 bheinen74

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Posted 10 May 2010 - 08:13 AM

Your alternator voltage regulator has failed. Your battery is measuring max, 14v, it cannot really get a higher charge. Alternator is putting out 18v, it is cooking your battery, and all other electrical components in your car are at great risk of over voltage, and failure too. You need to get a different alternator asap, before you damage everything. You may have already damaged the battery too.

#5 GeneralDisorder

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Posted 10 May 2010 - 10:59 AM

You have probably cooked the poor 55 amp thing with all that stereo gear. Very likely.

GD

#6 True2Blue

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Posted 10 May 2010 - 06:53 PM

reads 14.3 at idle and goes up with the rpm's stops at 17.6-18

#7 GeneralDisorder

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Posted 10 May 2010 - 09:09 PM

The alternator is cooked man - what more information do you need? STOP running the engine. You are going to further cook your wireing and electrical system components. Not to mention damage the battery.

GD

#8 TheSubaruJunkie

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Posted 10 May 2010 - 10:35 PM

I wonder what all your stereo equipment thinks about recieving 18v??

If I were you, i would turn everything up SUPER loud and then run the engine at 6000rpm until you see smoke.

#9 True2Blue

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 12:36 AM

the subaru is parked. has been till the clutch arrives.. ^ you should quit breathing


i dont need more info to tell that its cooked..


GD what would cause this? too much draw? cause i dont bump the stereo all the time

Edited by True2Blue, 11 May 2010 - 12:39 AM.


#10 bertaru

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 12:46 AM

I dont know, But i had this problem as well and i had a fuseable link acting up on me. It was the black 1.85 (16AWG) one. I replaced it and all was good. I had the 18v and everything. The Link was just degraded and not making good connection. I would have to get under the hood and fiddle with it. When i heard the fuel pump relay kick on, i knew it was working then i would start my wagon, But when i hit a bump, the link would disconnect and the meter would go up to 18v and i knew if i turned off the car it wouldn't start again until i fussed with the link. By the way, I couldn't find a good replacement so i made the link myself. the link should be 4 wire gauges smaller than the wire its protecting. and remove the vinyl insulation and replace it with a cloth type sleeve for heat reasons..

#11 True2Blue

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 12:54 AM

thank you! ill check that out tomorrow before i drop the tranny. im still gettin a new alt...

#12 eulogious

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 04:00 AM

You need to upgrade the your charging system man! Your JL amp fused for 100 amps by itself. The little alt can only do so much, that's almost twice what the alt is rated for. I would look into getting another little battery as well. Something like this...

http://www.ragebatte.../SLA-17-12.html

Wire that in and it will help, it has low internal resistance and will act as a cap, kinda. But it will help, because when your amplifiers draw more than 55amps, the power draw comes from your battery, and since you are drawing the maximum off your alt, your alt can't charge the battery and you continue to drain the battery. Then even when you are not bumping the music super loud, your alt is still working 100% to charge the battery that it really never gets a chance to do, since you are always drawing from it. So adding in another battery will help save the 55amper from having to stress so much charging your battery(s). I would also go with a red top optima as well. It will last a little longer... Of course adding another battery in will add more to the charging system since it has to charge it, but with a SLA battery, it doesn't really take much to charge them, but it is something to think about as well.

After your EJ swap, you need to upgrade to alt to alteast a 90amp, if not a 160amp for your system. Even with a 160amp, you would probably still be pulling more than that with your setup. I would go look at all your fuses on your amplifiers and add them up. That's how many amps you need your alt to be at a MINIMUM to run your setup. And that doesn't even include the load of the car itself... But you need to fix this, your you will be blowing your alts all the time, even after the swap!!

I am going to be getting the maxima alt here soon, my charging system is going to need upgraded soon as well.

#13 True2Blue

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 06:23 AM

i have the optima yellow top.. the red top is "better"?

i can run dual yellow tops and napa said they make custom alternators up to 320amp

ill see how this goes.. im focusing on the clutch tomorrow then alternator.. money is runnin thin now..

#14 eulogious

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 06:40 AM

Totally understand that for sure. The red top is just the "upgrade" to the yellow top. It's got better specs, that's all.

I wouldn't run double yellowtops, overkill for sure. The only reason you would run a second yellow top is if you are going to be running your system with the car off a bunch, for competitions and what not. Don't let anyone fool you into thinking double batteries is going to help your car run better and save your electrical system from your car stereo. It won't. That's just the NAPA salesman trying to get another $150 from you :rolleyes: The only reason I suggested the little battery is because it would help your system out SOME (like a cap) temporarily until you get a new/bigger alt, and it doesn't cost alot to add and you don't need an isolator for it to work.

Your alt is going to be the biggie for you. Your single yellow top should be fine, but I would let it sit on a charger for a while before throwing it back in your car. If you put a battery that is low on charge back into the car, you can fry a new alt because it will run 100% all the time trying to charge the dead battery that it can't charge. Ask me how I know this :rolleyes: Get it back up to speed and then throw it back in.

320amps is a little overkill for sure, but you get the idea :) I think you would probably be fine around the 200amp mark. But then if the price is right, buy BIG!!

Obviously if your car doesn't run/move then you should fix that first, then worry about the alt :)

#15 True2Blue

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 07:20 AM

[quote name='eulogious']Totally understand that for sure. The red top is just the "upgrade" to the yellow top. It's got better specs, that's all.
[/QUOTE]
Wrong the red top is one step up from an everyday battery. the yellow top is the deep cycle made for boats and stereos. i did my research on that one in iraq. we use red tops on our generators.
[quote name='eulogious']
I wouldn't run double yellowtops, overkill for sure.
[/QUOTE]
i know. but my amps pull ALOT, plus another 320w is goin in and i have 6 extra lights. those day lighters pull alot i can see the voltmeter drop when i turn them on.
[quote name='eulogious']
The only reason you would run a second yellow top is if you are going to be running your system with the car off a bunch,
[/QUOTE]
you got it.. Camping..............

[quote name='eulogious']
Your alt is going to be the biggie for you. Your single yellow top should be fine, but I would let it sit on a charger for a while before throwing it back in your car. If you put a battery that is low on charge back into the car, you can fry a new alt because it will run 100% all the time trying to charge the dead battery that it can't charge. Ask me how I know this :rolleyes: Get it back up to speed and then throw it back in.
[/QUOTE]

its sittin around 12 right now. like 11.4 or so might have been cause the door was open

[quote name='eulogious']
320amps is a little overkill for sure, but you get the idea :) I think you would probably be fine around the 200amp mark. But then if the price is right, buy BIG!!
[/QUOTE]

i know i said up to 320 gimme some credit.. i was thinkin 180 so i dont burn stuff up but still get that charge.. i worked with the 24v 280amp alternator systems ALOT in iraq.. never seen an alt. charge more than it was designed for..
[/QUOTE]

Obviously if your car doesn't run/move then you should fix that first, then worry about the alt :)[/QUOTE]

tomorrow is hammer time :)

Edited by True2Blue, 11 May 2010 - 07:23 AM.


#16 True2Blue

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 07:39 AM

i found this

http://www.qualitypo...php?category=21

HELPFUL:)

#17 eulogious

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 07:42 AM

Wrong the red top is one step up from an everyday battery. the yellow top is the deep cycle made for boats and stereos. i did my research on that one in iraq. we use red tops on our generators.


Well you are correct about the yellow top, and that is not what you want for loads the pull alot off the battery ... The red top has better specs, CCA, discharge, ect, it will deliver it power better than the yellow top and quicker, but that's besides the point, you have the yellow top so this argument really is a moot point :)

i know. but my amps pull ALOT, plus another 320w is goin in and i have 6 extra lights. those day lighters pull alot i can see the voltmeter drop when i turn them on.


Double batteries won't help you, only your alt... see my previous post. This is a fact. Research it if you don't believe me. Dual batteries will not help you will heavy draws on your system, they only help when your car is off, so you don't drain your starter battery. That's the only thing they do. You install a battery isolator that switches to the non-starter battery when the car is off, and run the stereo off the non-starter battery instead of the starter batter. You will not utilize both batteries all the time, in fact NEVER!!! That's why they call it a battery isolator. It isolates the batteries from each other. A fully charged yellow top should do you just fine. If you drain a fully charged yellow top, you are not doing enough activities while you are camping :) (I kid of course) And if you are running 200amps with your car off, you got issue man!

you got it.. Camping..............


If you were to use anywhere near all your power near my camping site, I think you would have a BIG problem, so again, why the double batteries? You also said that you weren't going to be blasting it at the campsite, so why the double batteries again? Just tyring to save you money man. You don't need 2 batteries!!! It's a myth!! Oh, and just to quote you from another thread :)

and rob... come on man............ i wish people would think that im a decent kind person for just one minute.. i wont go to a packed camp sight and BLAST music.. i will if there's not many people around. and i will ask before i blast if i am close to them, i don't want problems. that, and im not an *********************.


its sittin around 12 right now. like 11.4 or so might have been cause the door was open


Voltage is misleading. It's the amp draw you need to worry about(CCA really), and you can't really measure that with a DMM. Trust me man, you will want to charge it to be on the safe side. Better safe than sorry :)

i know i said up to 320 gimme some credit.. i was thinkin 180 so i dont burn stuff up but still get that charge.. i worked with the 24v 280amp alternator systems ALOT in iraq.. never seen an alt. charge more than it was designed for..


VR went out on your alt. When the VR goes out, the alt can't decided what voltage the system needs and just gives it what ever. The VR is what tells the alt to apply more amps when the system dips to compensate for the voltage/amp drop. Same symptoms on any thing that has a VR in it. 24v generators are no different. Military stuff is probably a little higher grade then consumer stuff, so that's most likely why they didn't fail on you in the military.

tomorrow is hammer time :)


Good luck with that dude! Tell us how it goes!

#18 eulogious

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 07:43 AM

i found this

http://www.qualitypo...php?category=21

HELPFUL:)


Give you some more options for sure!

#19 True2Blue

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 09:05 AM

got cha.. the camp thing with 2 batteries......

OKAY i wont be bass'n it up. camping usually lasts a weekend.. i dont wanna run my car every 2 hours to recharge the battery.. just because its not blasting music doesnt mean it wont die.. i have a 600watt power inverter on it as well...

im not going to buy another battery maybe another cap at most.

as for the red top input.. good info on ur part about the discharge and charge rate..

im not always bumpin my subs (i feel that i have to make this clear for some reason) the videos of it flexing to roof are to show its limitations thats not how i always listen to it.. and i dont go camping around a ton of people once in a great while ill go somewhere where ill have to pay to stay other than that 'kiss my rump roast' its noon and im crankin up the tunes. (almost no bass).. ive never had a complaint. down on white river people actually came over to hang out for the night (my suby was cranked up by a crate fire)

id like to stry away from "if you came to my area with your music playin like that you wouldnt be happy" talk

im not in your area and if i was really disturbing someone id leave, if mr macho has more to say faster than i can leave.. im sure the SR9 will take care of it all..

lets stay on track.

140-180amp is what im looking at as of now
another cap for the 2 smaller amps. ill leave the big cap for the big amp

after that it should be okay

#20 eulogious

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 09:53 AM

got cha.. the camp thing with 2 batteries......

OKAY i wont be bass'n it up. camping usually lasts a weekend.. i dont wanna run my car every 2 hours to recharge the battery.. just because its not blasting music doesnt mean it wont die.. i have a 600watt power inverter on it as well...

im not going to buy another battery maybe another cap at most.

as for the red top input.. good info on ur part about the discharge and charge rate..

im not always bumpin my subs (i feel that i have to make this clear for some reason) the videos of it flexing to roof are to show its limitations thats not how i always listen to it.. and i dont go camping around a ton of people once in a great while ill go somewhere where ill have to pay to stay other than that 'kiss my rump roast' its noon and im crankin up the tunes. (almost no bass).. ive never had a complaint. down on white river people actually came over to hang out for the night (my suby was cranked up by a crate fire)

id like to stry away from "if you came to my area with your music playin like that you wouldnt be happy" talk

im not in your area and if i was really disturbing someone id leave, if mr macho has more to say faster than i can leave.. im sure the SR9 will take care of it all..

lets stay on track.


I just want to state, I am just being the devil advocate. I am also trying to save you from buying things you don't need since money is tight :) I have asked myself these same questions recently and did lots of research. I am not trying to accuse you of anything, just giving you the other side of the picture. I used the camping example more to point out that you even said you weren't going to be bumping, so why get another battery?, that's all man. I have been up to your place, your a good guy and I know you wouldn't be bumping and all that ;) Not trying to rehash old things, and that wasn't my intention. Sorry. Back to the topic...

140-180amp is what im looking at as of now
another cap for the 2 smaller amps. ill leave the big cap for the big amp

after that it should be okay


That would be exactly what I would do. That will give you plenty of juice, and not kill your charging system, but still leave you plenty of power for other things.

I know that I found a place that will rewire a maxima alt to 160amp for $245 I believe, so that might be a cheaper route to go...

#21 eulogious

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 10:34 AM

I should add that you should consider the little battery I mentioned earlier. Here is a thread I started at a car audio forum asking about it, and answers some questions about the usage. That little battery and your yellow top might be all you really need for listening to music while camping and stuff. Here's the link, but for $40, it might be a worthy thing to buy to help you out. That and you don't have to buy anything else to wire it in. SLA batteries just need a steady voltage of about 13.8 to stay charged, so you should be good on that front as well...

http://phoenixphorum...ry-vt14145.html

Let me know what you thing dude. I think I am going to get one to help my system out...

#22 Yo'J

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 12:22 PM

I just want to add, I've heard the battery isolators aren't as good as the solenoid type for running a second battery and can result in fire. I got one sitting here if you want it, i'm gonna use the solenoid. Just what I was told. I love the small battery thing and I'm looking to do the same thing for the camp site.

I've been really happy with small shops like Acme auto electric on aurora ave. for alts. They do all sorts of custom stuff and just do electric and rebuild all their own alts for the same price as napa with a better product and warrenty.

#23 eulogious

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 12:57 PM

I just want to add, I've heard the battery isolators aren't as good as the solenoid type for running a second battery and can result in fire. I got one sitting here if you want it, i'm gonna use the solenoid. Just what I was told. I love the small battery thing and I'm looking to do the same thing for the camp site.

I've been really happy with small shops like Acme auto electric on aurora ave. for alts. They do all sorts of custom stuff and just do electric and rebuild all their own alts for the same price as napa with a better product and warrenty.


I was referring to the act of isolating, not a particular way of isolating… You must have the diode isolator. There is nothing wrong with the diode type, infact they will basically last forever because it's a diode and has no moving parts, unlike the solenoid. The real downside to the diode isolator is the .5 - .7 volt drop caused by the diodes themselves. That voltage loss can mean less sound out the speakers, and some people might care about that. The diodes are no more of a risk than the solenoid at causing a fire, and truthfully, the solenoid failing and causing a short, resulting in a fire is more likely than the diode failing and causing a fire. But there is still risk with either one…

That alt places sounds interesting, you got more details on them?

#24 GeneralDisorder

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 01:04 PM

The diodes are no more of a risk than the solenoid at causing a fire, and truthfully, the solenoid failing and causing a short, resulting in a fire is more likely than the diode failing and causing a fire. But there is still risk with either one…


This is why they invented the circuit breaker. Fuses too!

GD

#25 eulogious

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Posted 11 May 2010 - 01:10 PM

This is why they invented the circuit breaker. Fuses too!

GD


You do bring up a very good point that wasn't addressed that should prevent fires, FUSES!! I have been up for over 24hrs, the mind isn't quite as sharp as it should be… If you fuse everything correctly, then there should be very minimal risk of fire!! Good call GD ;)




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