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Guest Message by DevFuse
 

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86 3door Runabout:FWD<FT4WD, 4 lug<5lug, EA82 carb<EJ22 or ER27 swap, rust removal


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198 replies to this topic

#51 MilesFox

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 12:04 AM

Doing the electrolysis thing. These are xt6 backing plates. The one on the right is treated. the other one is cooking overnight. The forst one bathed for about 6 hours.

The last picture is the one currently soaking
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#52 TheLoyale

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 12:16 AM

WOW thats working awesome!

#53 MilesFox

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 10:29 AM

I'm afraid the green stuff is copper sludge of some sort. The metal candle holder i used had great surface area, but it does have some sort of rusty brassy plating. I hope i am not poisoning myself.

I should use an old saw blade if i had one

#54 xbeerd

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 10:42 AM

hmm, thats awesome. i forgot about electrolysis, i may have to do that to my backing plates once it warms up a bit. you think this would hurt the brake hub if i did them too?

#55 xbeerd

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 10:43 AM

I hope i am not poisoning myself.


i guess we'll find out if we stop over and your layin on the floor. :dead:

#56 TheLoyale

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 11:09 AM

Well if you don't get the stuff on your skin, you should be ok. Don't breath the fumes.

Backing plates, everyones talking about backing plates. Mine have long crubbled away.

#57 xbeerd

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 11:12 AM

Well if you don't get the stuff on your skin, you should be ok. Don't breath the fumes.

Backing plates, everyones talking about backing plates. Mine have long crubbled away.


i think mine are about 15% gone. but i did POR15 what i could of them, im gonna replace the rear brakes in spring (finally, got the shoes last year. LOL) i'll investigate farther then. see whats worth doin.

#58 xbeerd

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Posted 15 February 2011 - 11:14 AM

shouldnt be TOO bad for ya...

The fumes and dust cause irritation of the upper respiratory tract. Inhalation of copper fume results in the irritation of the upper respiratory tract. Contact with copper fumes will also cause irritation of the eyes, nose and throat.

One of the cheif industrial exposures to copper from which there are potential health effects is the fume. Fume exposures occur in copper and brass plants and in welding copper containing metals. Copper dissolved from the wire used in certain intrauterine contraceptive devices has been shown to be absorbed systemically. An appreciable fraction of the copper dissolved from the tubing commonly used in hemodialysis equipment may be retained by the patient. Copper bracelets are worn as a folk remedy for rheumatic disorders; there is no good evidence to justify such a practice. Study of the literature describing symptoms occasionally observed in copper and brass workers does not allow one to conclude that copper intoxication is occupational disease. Such symptoms are due to poor working conditions, presence of arsenic and lead as impurities. Sources of exposure are from fume, from copper ore smelting & related metallurgic operations, from welding, & from dusts of copper metal & copper salts in copper metal workers & copper polishers. A partial list of occupations in which exposure may occur includes: asphalt makers, battery makers, electroplaters, fungicide workers, gem colorers, lithographers, pigment makers, rayon makers, solderers, wallpaper makers, water treaters, & wood preservative workers. Acute GI disturbances may result from accidental ingestion of food or beverages contaminated by copper released from copper vessels, from hot water geysers. Many cases of poisoning result from the use of copper containers for food or drink. In recent years extracorporeal hemodialysis has been a source of copper poisoning.



#59 MilesFox

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Posted 17 February 2011 - 09:38 PM

Back at it agian. I have been cookong the subframe tube over the last 2 days.

Today i got into the shop and grinded off the rusty spots under the car. The undercoating is a lot to remove. I am only removing the undercoating where it is obviously rusty. my plan will be to por-15 the rusty spots, and re-spray the whole underside with new undercoating, tis time above the gastank and exhaust shields, and behind all the brake fuel lines. Once i finish this, i can reinstall the suspension and tank, and do the rest of the un-rusting from there.

I have already removed the seats ad rear carpets in the anticipation of possibly welding.

more eloctrolysis setups
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Close up of electrolytic action
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electrocuted rust scales flake off with a wipe of a rag or finger after soakingPosted Image

The following pictures is my work with a wire wheel. The white spots are either bare metal reflecting the light, or where the rust had turned white from the naval jelly. What looks like rust is actually the brown paint, or dust on the undercoating.
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left cargo hold in rear fender
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Right cargo hold
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I was able to peel up the body caulk where the rusty seams are. I will be using a heat gun to get the rest up. Moisture had worked its way from the pinch seam under the car, and into the body caulk, rusting the seam from the inside. Wothout the body caulking here, there would actually be open spaces to the outside by the layers of the original body stampings that make up this part of the car.

#60 MilesFox

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Posted 19 February 2011 - 12:35 AM

So far today I cleanud up the underside and welded in a patch, and por-15'd. I have one more spot to patch. I will be reconditioning the hard lines assembly, spraying undercoating over the POR 15, and installing the hard lines after this is done. Same with the gas tank, as the original undercoat did not go above the gas tank.

I applied the por-15 to all the body seams first, letting it soak in between the laters, and then painting the rest. I was able to paint all you see with a single baby food jar of paint, and a foam brush.

The electrolysis on the suspension tube frame was to my liking, and i welsded up all the seams to prevent moisture between layers, and for strenght. I would weld end caps to it and fill with some kind of oil to absorb into the inside's rust flakes, and stop oxidization

What oil could be recommended?

Posted ImagePosted Image
Welded patch
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Seam weld on tube frame
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#61 TheLoyale

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Posted 19 February 2011 - 12:44 AM

Wow, looks nice. Did you get the Gloss or Semi-gloss POR?

As for oil, I think hydraulic oil would work and hold up well.

#62 MilesFox

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Posted 19 February 2011 - 09:50 AM

That is cglossy por-15, a bit shiny. I got a can of 3m undercoating that will be sprayed over it.

for the suspension parts, i will pant them rustoleum satin black

#63 TomRhere

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 06:23 AM

Looking good...
You can come over here and do the BRATs for me. :)

As for an oil to use in the rear cross tube, I recommend using ATF. It will "stay" on the metal better than any other oil.
I don't think you'd need to fill it either. Just pour a quart in and roll the tube around to insure coverage, drain out excess.

#64 1982gl4

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Posted 20 February 2011 - 09:25 AM

I use bar and chain oil to undercoat all of my stuff, that works pretty well. Great progress! Keep up the good work!

#65 MilesFox

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Posted 24 February 2011 - 10:53 PM

Going back togethetr now. I had the brake line looms apart, electrolyted, por15'd, and reassembled with syl-glide in the clims.
Ummy-Nummey ooey-gooey 1986ness going on here factory fresh!

The car is ready to receive the gas tank. I am grinding it down to por15 and undercoat the top of it, and replace the sending unit nuts with stainless steel

The suspension is assembles, but the bolts are not torqued. I need to find my brake parts laying around, while i install the backing plates, and the hubs at least to let iof off the jacks once i torque it.

I undercoated the bushings and the tight spots of the suspension tube and trailing arms. I slathered anti-seize on the bolts threads, heads, nuts, and inside the bushing sleeves.

I am stealing the stainless steel factory fuel clamps form under the hood of an xt6 to use in place of the screw clamps.

I am going to make the car driveable once i replace the flexible rubber brake lines, and then tackle the inside of the rear quarters, wheel wells, and drive the car between before doing the front, as i need to find 23 spline doj's to throw on the xt6 axles.

http://https://picas...268651858845842

Edited by MilesFox, 24 February 2011 - 10:56 PM.


#66 MilesFox

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Posted 24 February 2011 - 11:04 PM

less rusty and seam welds
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5 lug hubs before electrolysis
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exhaust shiles after electroloysis
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por15 suspensions and brake lines
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#67 TheLoyale

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Posted 25 February 2011 - 12:10 AM

Looking awesome! That trailing arm is coated so thick it will never rust! :banana:


I will give you your Flip back saturday.

#68 TheLoyale

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Posted 27 February 2011 - 02:27 AM

Here is some video of what has gone on with the 3-door.




#69 dhise

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Posted 27 February 2011 - 10:46 AM

Looks like it'll last another 25 years no problem! It takes some work to keep them from rotting away here in the rust belt.

#70 MilesFox

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Posted 27 February 2011 - 11:04 AM

Here is some video of what has gone on with the 3-door.



Please enjoy the video. Caution: video may contains incidental language for you family folks out there.....

Washing soda, or baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) for the electrolysis dunk. I used a generic store brand, but arm and hammer is recommended. From there, i used a knotted wire brush for the angle grinder to knock down flakey rust, and a flat screwdriver and chisel to get some of the nastier flakes off, and a wire brush by hand to finish before paint.

POR 15 from a quart can, dispensed with a scoop into a baby food jar to paint form the jar. I use the disposable 1" foam brushes for each application. I used the glossy paint, but i would recommend the satin finish for the suspension components. Por 15 is paintable, and should be painted on anything that will be exposed to UV sunlight
Posted Image POR-15® is a high-tech, high performance rust-preventive coating designed for application directly on rusted or seasoned metal surfaces. It dries to an incredible rock-hard, non-porous finish that won't chip, crack, or peel, and it prevents rust from recurring by protecting metal from further exposure to moisture.
Use it to coat rusty frames, floor pans, farm equipment, marine equipment, or even a heavily corroded battery tray.
POR-15® is sensitive to UV light (sun) and must be topcoated for prolonged exposure to sunlight.
Topcoating is not required for areas not exposed to sunlight.


Pint............ $29.95 Quart......... $44.95 Gallon........ $143.00



3m rubberized undercoating, and permatex undercoating. The permatex is more cost effective. I used the 3m in the area around the brake lines and suspension mounts, and the permatex above the gas tank. There are 2 formulas of permatex, one is rubberized, and the other is 'paintable'

I used the 2nd product also on the intricate areas of the tailig arms and subframe components, and on the faces of the rubber bushings

http://multimedia.3m...s6EVs6E666666--
3M™ Rubberized Undercoating, 08883, 19.7 oz Net Wt, 6 per case
3M Id : 60-4550-5115-5
GTIN(UPC/EAN) : 0 00 51131 08883 2
Posted Image Aerosol
Black
Heavy liquid
Aerosol Can
24 Fluid Ounce (US)
30 Minute
24 Hours @ 75 Deg F
Synthetic Polymer
1 Hour
Medium to Coarse
http://www.permatex....hotos/81833.jpgPosted ImagePosted Image Permatex® Heavy Duty Rubberized Undercoating
Now with an improved formula! Rubberized for maximum durability; seals, protects and insulates. Excellent professional blend all-purpose coating. Ideal for home or shop use. Level 3*

Suggested Applications: Automotive frames, rocker panels and wheels. Other uses include sealing gutters, roofs, drain systems and tree pruning
Item #Container SizePackPart #MSDSTDS8183320 oz. aerosol can, 16 oz. net. wt.12135EAPosted ImagePosted Image *NFPA Fire Code 30B Posted Image



http://www.permatex....hotos/80072.jpgPosted ImagePosted Image Permatex® Undercoating
Protects fenders, frames, fuel tanks, door panels, rocker panels, hoods and firewalls against moisture, road salt and corrosion. Won’t sag or drip. Sound-proofs and insulates. Body shop proven. Level 3*

Suggested Applications: Wheel wells, rocker panels, frames and underbody, body repairs, rust holes, tree pruning, driveway cracks, minor roof repairs, post preserver

Anti-seize compound. I have a can of industrial grade copper colored stuff. I use it for my build on the bolt threads, captive nuts, bolt shanks, and on the heads of the bolts, and inside of the bushing sleeves. I can't think of the brand i am using, but its in a quart can, and i have it leftover from my job at u-haul. I also used this compound on the brake line fittings. I was going to use teflon thread tape, but couldn't find it right away. sure enough, i found it after using the anti-seize

Syl-Glide silicone grease. Normally used on brake caliper slides and boots, i am using this stuff on the plastic clips that mount the brake and fuel lines, and on nipples of the fuel lines for the rubber hoses

Posted Image
Sil-Glyde is a silicone based brake lubricant recommended for the entire brake assembly and is compatible with rubber. It is moisture-proof and heat resistant to +600 degrees F, which means it won't burn-off like other brake noise products. Using AGS brake lubricant is one of the keys to eliminating disc brake squeal.

naval jelly or equivalent rust dissolver gel (phosphoric acid), for treating areas that cannot be accessed with a wire wheel or brush. I used this product to get at hard to reach rust, and also to apply to bare metal that has been prepped to seal out flash rust, between the treatment and the paint application the next day.
http://lh3.googleuse...50ww4Q1i-UMpRGF
$4 online, $7 nearby
This rust dissolver has been known and trusted for years. It's ideal for heavily rusted items as it dissolves rust, taking it down to the bare metal. Simply brush on , watch the rust dissolve and then rinse off. Use this product on automobiles, antiques, patio furniture and more. - Easy to use - Helps restore metal items by dissolving rust - Trusted for years - Industrial strength
Add to Shopping List




Harbor freight welder with .035 wire and tip, and scrap metal from a furnace access panel to patch the rust holes under the car

#71 MilesFox

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Posted 31 March 2011 - 10:57 PM

I now have wheels and brakes. I got a new battery. Car drives at this moment.

I will be starting a trans and frontend swap very soon

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Edited by MilesFox, 31 March 2011 - 11:05 PM.


#72 1982gl4

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 05:08 PM

Looks like the xt has lived out it's days :eek: The Runabout is looking good! Can't wait to see it with a full five lug!

#73 MilesFox

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 05:17 PM

the rear part of the xt will remain for the purposes of a jug to modify a legacy rear suspension in it, and if it works, i can just bolt it to my 3door!

#74 1982gl4

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Posted 01 April 2011 - 06:00 PM

That's such a good idea! I definitely want to know how that turns out. I would love to do something like that to my Brat someday after I finish up the current swaps.

#75 MilesFox

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Posted 04 April 2011 - 10:52 PM

I pulled the whole running gear from the car. There is rust on the framerails and some corrosion by battery acid. some clever work will result.


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