Jump to content


Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, my lurker friend!

Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, an unparalleled Subaru community full of the greatest Subaru gurus and modders on the planet! We offer technical information and discussion about all things Subaru, the best and most popular all wheel drive vehicles ever created.

We offer all this information for free to everyone, even lurkers like you! All we ask in return is that you sign up and give back some of what you get out - without our awesome registered users none of this would be possible! Plus, you get way more great stuff as a member! Lurk to lose, participate to WIN*!
  • Say hello and join the conversation
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get automatic updates
  • Get your own profile and make new friends
  • Classifieds with all sorts of Subaru goodies
  • Photo hosting in our gallery
  • Meet other cool people with cool cars
Seriously, what are you waiting for? Make your life more fulfilling and join today! You and your Subaru won't regret it, we guarantee** it.

* The joy of participation and being generally awesome constitutes winning
** Not an actual guarantee, but seriously, you probably won't regret it!

Serving the Subaru Community since May 18th, 1998!

Guest Message by DevFuse
 

Photo
- - - - -

Mock up in solid works, Subaru R160 Locker


  • Please log in to reply
171 replies to this topic

#51 WoodsWagon

WoodsWagon

    Formerly 91Loyale

  • Members
  • 3,945 posts
  • NH

Posted 15 May 2012 - 07:19 PM

Why is there a flat section with no teeth? Shouldn't there be teeth all the way round?

#52 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 15 May 2012 - 07:35 PM

Why is there a flat section with no teeth? Shouldn't there be teeth all the way round?


I was wondering about that too! In the powertrax locker I have it has the same thing, I was copying it and relized why is it there...

Yeah looks like its time to edit it. Xnay on the flat section.

#53 czny

czny

    USMB is life!

  • Silver Subscribers
  • 336 posts
  • Azusa, California

Posted 15 May 2012 - 07:49 PM

Getting ready to do the spring/pin holes. Now in the spartan locker, they use a cup type pin that the spring sits in, is that what you talking about? :)

Refuting to this Posted Image

And how the Center chunk it dosnt actually sit all the way in it it's kinda hallowed outward.


Yes, those are what I was referring to.
The bores for pins are cross-drilled thru the outside of the clutch center body. One to use a wire to hold the load pins in for assembly, drilled in line with the groove in the pin with the pin fully compressed flush with the face. Another hole from the outside for lubrication near the bottom of the pin bore.

The hollow thru the middle of the "center chunk" was for a cup shaped c-clip retainer for the c-clip on chevy PU axles. Not needed for an R160.

The wide groove in the clutch face of the "center chunk" isn't needed for the R160 either. That was to permit loading the c-clip into the groove on the axles with all the pieces inside the carrier. You could run clutch teeth all the way around for the R160. More clutch engagement = more strength.:grin:

Edited by czny, 15 May 2012 - 07:51 PM.


#54 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 15 May 2012 - 09:07 PM

Posted Image
Ahhh makes Sence! Top for lube bottom for wire pin holder!


Center chunk notch groove in prosses of being fixed.

As for the hole in the center chunk, yeah that's true! Is there going to need to be a "spacer" for it though? and does that spacer have anything to do with the crosspin?

And seeing as I don't want to change the axel stubs any, I'm going to have to figure something out with the bolt that attatches the outer coupler to the axle stub.

This project has made me think like no other haha. I like it! :)

#55 czny

czny

    USMB is life!

  • Silver Subscribers
  • 336 posts
  • Azusa, California

Posted 15 May 2012 - 10:14 PM

The nuts for the splined stubs have to be clear of the cross-pin so they can rotate freely with the outer clutches.
Cylindrical with a obtuse tapered end to mate with tapered reliefs inside the outer pieces using friction would be an easy way.
:DJust a suggestion.

Wait until it comes time to build the tooling for this project!

#56 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 15 May 2012 - 11:56 PM

Ever since I got home from class ive been non stop thinking about this project. :)

Okay, picture time haha.

Now due to this,

Posted Image

It being so close to the cross pin, (and I don't want to change the axel pin length) I am going to have to make the center coupler with a whole to slide down into the outer coupler. It's going to be a tight fit.


And is this little gap changing anything that I should do? When the cross pin sits on it it's not flush with the center "C"..

Posted Image

I think I've become a solid works and project junkie haha :drunk:

#57 WoodsWagon

WoodsWagon

    Formerly 91Loyale

  • Members
  • 3,945 posts
  • NH

Posted 16 May 2012 - 04:55 AM

And seeing as I don't want to change the axel stubs any, I'm going to have to figure something out with the bolt that attatches the outer coupler to the axle stub.

Use the spring clip retainer axles. They just push in from the outside and the clip expands once it clears the splined portion of the bore to keep the axle from coming back out. You can use the 90-94 legacy stubs to run earlier CV's or use 95+ stubs with integrated CV cups.

I've broken a few of the bolt in stubs with a stock clutch type LSD, they are definitely a weak point. Being hollow and having a rollpin hole drilled through doesn't do much for strength.

#58 Gloyale

Gloyale

    It's a sickness

  • Members
  • 9,008 posts
  • Corvallis, OR PNW

Posted 16 May 2012 - 09:53 AM

Use the spring clip retainer axles. They just push in from the outside and the clip expands once it clears the splined portion of the bore to keep the axle from coming back out. You can use the 90-94 legacy stubs to run earlier CV's or use 95+ stubs with integrated CV cups.


90-94 legacy stubs are the same bolt in type as the EA cars.

#59 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 16 May 2012 - 11:36 AM

Hmm that for sure true! It would be a lot stronger for solid stubs. But right now i think I'm going to stay with the bolt in ones. (probably in the future designing for the clip in) just so I don't have to deal with anything new from what I've already got.

And yeah Gloylae's right, I think they started making them and the end of 94-95 on till now. 00+ stubs I think are all clip in stubs.

Would be better for a solid stud though! Now can these solid stubs be swaped out easy for the bolt in stubs on an Ea diff?

Using the clip in stubs would also same another .25" on both sides from the bolt/screw needed. Which is what I'm kinda hanging up on... Not enough room in there.

Edited by Prwa101, 16 May 2012 - 11:51 AM.


#60 czny

czny

    USMB is life!

  • Silver Subscribers
  • 336 posts
  • Azusa, California

Posted 16 May 2012 - 06:29 PM

You know the assembled gap between the center chunks only has to be 2x the depth of the clutch teeth + say .015-.020" for lubrication/safety. If that helps gain you some needed space then good.

After all, you're designing the prototype & changes can be made as needed later. If it was me I'd use something like 4142 or 4340 steel unhardened for the first one, run it, tear it down & inspect for problems. Can always go for tougher, easy to machine steel alloys afterward. Chop, cut & rehash.:Flame:

#61 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 16 May 2012 - 06:52 PM

You know the assembled gap between the center chunks only has to be 2x the depth of the clutch teeth + say .015-.020" for lubrication/safety. If that helps gain you some needed space then good.


This is so good info!! I wasn't sure how much I should leave between there. :clap:

After all, you're designing the prototype & changes can be made as needed later. If it was me I'd use something like 4142 or 4340 steel unhardened for the first one, run it, tear it down & inspect for problems. Can always go for tougher, easy to machine steel alloys afterward. Chop, cut & rehash.:Flame:


That what I was thinking as well! It's show wear more too which could be changed and moded.

Now on another note. Should I be worried about someone stealing this idea? Since I'm putting up photos and things?

#62 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 16 May 2012 - 07:34 PM

Booooya!! :D

Just figured out the distince issue from the cross pin!! As I was calculating the center chunk, it would have to be .49" think for it to fit right so both sides can go in with the .28" springage, which the crosspin is .6" so it won't work. I figured out a whole another way! So the bold in stubs will work perfect! The ".14" helps a lot! The wonders of a pencil, and dreaming about the project last night! :D

-Prwa

Edited by Prwa101, 16 May 2012 - 07:37 PM.


#63 czny

czny

    USMB is life!

  • Silver Subscribers
  • 336 posts
  • Azusa, California

Posted 16 May 2012 - 08:04 PM

The center gap is at minimum .015-.020" with the clutches disengaged on both sides. That's another way to look at it.


prwa:
"Now on another note. Should I be worried about someone stealing this idea? Since I'm putting up photos and things?"

Just don't show your hand while playing poker.

"Keep it close to the vest.":)

Edited by czny, 16 May 2012 - 08:08 PM.


#64 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 16 May 2012 - 08:22 PM

The center gap is at minimum .015-.020" with the clutches disengaged on both sides. That's another way to look at it.


prwa:
"Now on another note. Should I be worried about someone stealing this idea? Since I'm putting up photos and things?"

Just don't show your hand while playing poker.

"Keep it close to the vest.":)


Haha! Well I'll keep my hand out of site then! Untill the last best are places :)

Hey, I would like to thank you a lot for helping me as much as you have and giving me that locker! really means a lot to know there are good people still in this world!! :)

#65 czny

czny

    USMB is life!

  • Silver Subscribers
  • 336 posts
  • Azusa, California

Posted 16 May 2012 - 09:14 PM

You are welcome.

I really want to see you succeed. They're more than a few that want to see you succeed. :popcorn:

And then there's.....do we really have to say.:-p

#66 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 16 May 2012 - 09:21 PM

Hahahhahaaha! I agee with that!! :banana:

#67 WoodsWagon

WoodsWagon

    Formerly 91Loyale

  • Members
  • 3,945 posts
  • NH

Posted 17 May 2012 - 02:13 AM

90-94 legacy stubs are the same bolt in type as the EA cars.

Really? I was pretty sure they could be used as conversion stubs for a newer diff in an older car. Pity that. I guess building a hybrid axle is the only way to go to clip in stubs then.

Now on another note. Should I be worried about someone stealing this idea? Since I'm putting up photos and things?

There's been plenty of chance for people to build these but even the big companies that manufacture them for other makes have had no interest in building subaru ones. All they would have to do is resize their CAD drawings to be the right dimensions to fit in a subaru diff instead of reverse-engineering them like you're doing. I think if someone is going to pull it off, it's going to be you. That's why there's so many of us rooting for you to succeed.

As long as you don't go posting the CAD files up on the net your pictures don't show anything more than a generic locker picture would. I wouldn't worry about it, and we love seeing progress pictures.

Edited by WoodsWagon, 17 May 2012 - 02:16 AM.


#68 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 17 May 2012 - 07:45 PM

Thanks WoodsWagon! Glad to hear there are so may people behind me! I know there's already more than 1500 views and this threads only been up for a couple weeks :)
And very true! I'm just surprised no one hasn't yet.



Well made a lot of progress today! Got both sides done, other than the splining and threads on the bolt stub. Just have the spring set up and splines left :)

And made a small addition to my computer I downloaded solid works on my computer today! Yeah! :D

Posted Image

#69 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 22 May 2012 - 10:36 PM

What do you guys think?? its all done, (maybe some fine tuning) some one poped there prototype in the 3D prototyper before i got done... so now i have to wait to print this baby out... might be printed out Thursday! :clap:


NOT BAD FOR BEING IN THE COMP LAB SINCE 9 THIS MORING..............

Posted Image

#70 czny

czny

    USMB is life!

  • Silver Subscribers
  • 336 posts
  • Azusa, California

Posted 23 May 2012 - 10:03 AM

Lookin' good there!

Did you copy the dimensions for the side gear splines(length of splines & chamfers), undercut(?) corner radius on the outside, etc from the R160 in this rendering?
It may be possible to use the old 'nut buttons' from the R160 for the stubs(?)

Good job!:popcorn:

#71 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 23 May 2012 - 05:52 PM

Lookin' good there!

Did you copy the dimensions for the side gear splines(length of splines & chamfers), undercut(?) corner radius on the outside, etc from the R160 in this rendering?
It may be possible to use the old 'nut buttons' from the R160 for the stubs(?)

Good job!:popcorn:


Amount of teeth are diffrent, but same chamfers, undercut, length. Teeth A little wider though due to change in amount of teeth. (major calculations there...) :banghead:

Bolt in stubs, had to design something to addapt to the bolt peice as its so small in there it wouldn't fit with out an addaptor. (havnt shown it because it's my BABY, and because it's a key to making the the bolt stubs work.) took me days to figure that out. (still may need some tweaking later) Lol. :banghead:

Printing starts tomarrow!! Get to see this baby in action before i get one made up in real steel!
:banana:

#72 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 24 May 2012 - 12:12 PM

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm :banana:

shes printing out RIght now!!! 10.15 Hours till shes done! but not going to get to see it till thursday :(



mmmm 43%
Posted Image

Edited by Prwa101, 24 May 2012 - 04:18 PM.


#73 JDMBenji

JDMBenji

    New User

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 3 posts
  • Sunshine Coast, QLD

Posted 27 May 2012 - 05:04 AM

Is this a mock up locker mate? Or is this coming into fruition? If you're producing them count me in!

#74 Prwa101

Prwa101

    Subaru Fanatic!

  • Members
  • 682 posts
  • Sandy, OR

Posted 27 May 2012 - 12:10 PM

Is this a mock up locker mate? Or is this coming into fruition? If you're producing them count me in!


It's simmaler to the spartan air locker and it will bult in to your r160 diff. Full design and going into production, (once I work the kincks out) and run a couple prototypes my self.

Sweet! Glad to see another man on board! :D

I should change the "mock up" part haha. Because I'm really planning on making these! :Flame:

#75 JDMBenji

JDMBenji

    New User

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 3 posts
  • Sunshine Coast, QLD

Posted 28 May 2012 - 12:07 AM

if you need any test pilots I would be interested ;) I'm in Australia is that makes any difference. Keep us posted! Cheers, mate!




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users