Jump to content


Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, my lurker friend!

Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, an unparalleled Subaru community full of the greatest Subaru gurus and modders on the planet! We offer technical information and discussion about all things Subaru, the best and most popular all wheel drive vehicles ever created.

We offer all this information for free to everyone, even lurkers like you! All we ask in return is that you sign up and give back some of what you get out - without our awesome registered users none of this would be possible! Plus, you get way more great stuff as a member! Lurk to lose, participate to WIN*!
  • Say hello and join the conversation
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get automatic updates
  • Get your own profile and make new friends
  • Classifieds with all sorts of Subaru goodies
  • Photo hosting in our gallery
  • Meet other cool people with cool cars
Seriously, what are you waiting for? Make your life more fulfilling and join today! You and your Subaru won't regret it, we guarantee** it.

* The joy of participation and being generally awesome constitutes winning
** Not an actual guarantee, but seriously, you probably won't regret it!

Serving the Subaru Community since May 18th, 1998!

Guest Message by DevFuse
 

Photo
- - - - -

Does Outback fuel pump turn on with key ON (not start)? Traveling out of state!


  • Please log in to reply
12 replies to this topic

#1 grossgary

grossgary

    Elite Master of the Subaru

  • Members
  • 19,800 posts
  • WV

Posted 01 June 2012 - 11:57 PM

2003 Outback H6 - do the fuel pumps operate for a second when the key is turned "ON" but the engine isn't started (like older Subaru's)?

My daily driver quit while driving down the road and when i turn the key to "ON" (before turning it to start) - the fuel pump doesn't "prime" like it does on most older Subaru's i've tried this step on?

So i'm assuming it's the fuel pump but i want to make sure?

When i try cranking the motor it does move some gas, so I'm not positive.

Traveling out of state so i don't have all my tools, pressure gauges, etc.

GD says it should "prime" like older Subaru's.....

#2 ccrinc

ccrinc

    The Subaru Whisperer

  • Members
  • 572 posts
  • Denver, CO

Posted 02 June 2012 - 08:29 AM

I'll check mine here in a few minutes and let you know!

#3 Fairtax4me

Fairtax4me

    Su bah roo'n

  • Gold Subscribers
  • 8,732 posts
  • Charlottesburg, VA

Posted 02 June 2012 - 09:45 AM

Yes it should. If you can get to an auto parts store rent a pressure test kit and see what it tells you.

For exactly this reason I always keep a set of tools in the car. Last time I didn't have my tools, I got a flat tire and then I couldn't find the lug wrench, because it somehow ended up in my tool bag.

#4 grossgary

grossgary

    Elite Master of the Subaru

  • Members
  • 19,800 posts
  • WV

Posted 02 June 2012 - 10:05 AM

yeah funny you say that - i "always" have my tools and OBDII scanner....and just got dumb for a second and didn't put them in the car this time.

***yes*** the car primes just like older subarus.

turns out it was that goofy fuel pump oring - the oring under cap gets squished out and causes it to bleed pressure off. replaced that oring for 99 cents and it's good to go.

it's really easy to fix and i'd recommend doing it if you have an H4 or H6 which share this same oring. the cap tabs can crack too but that cap is the same between H4 and H6 engines.

i'm doing it immediately when i get home to my other 2002 OBW as well.

#5 1-3-2-4

1-3-2-4

    Subaru Mike!

  • Members
  • 3,717 posts
  • Greenwich

Posted 02 June 2012 - 10:19 AM

Yes it should. If you can get to an auto parts store rent a pressure test kit and see what it tells you.

For exactly this reason I always keep a set of tools in the car. Last time I didn't have my tools, I got a flat tire and then I couldn't find the lug wrench, because it somehow ended up in my tool bag.


^same here.. I had my slave cylinder pop off the tranny (odd) and it ended up sideways with the pin about to pop off.. It was scary because the clutch got rock hard and then I heard a bang and it stuck to the floor..

It would of been a pain without the tool box because that pin was wedged pretty tight.

#6 ivans imports

ivans imports

    1000+ Super USER!

  • Members
  • 2,932 posts
  • lumby bc canada

Posted 02 June 2012 - 10:23 AM

yes it should turn on when key is turned on and when cranked chage pump if any doubt at all be very carfull as the plastic spigots are very *********ile and break easyly pump is under bum of ps rear seat

#7 ivans imports

ivans imports

    1000+ Super USER!

  • Members
  • 2,932 posts
  • lumby bc canada

Posted 02 June 2012 - 10:24 AM

funny they edited my spelling mistake thinking i was swearing love it

#8 1-3-2-4

1-3-2-4

    Subaru Mike!

  • Members
  • 3,717 posts
  • Greenwich

Posted 02 June 2012 - 10:50 AM

Yeah they did they switch to plastic??? I had to change the fuel filter on a dodge caravan and the stupid clips on that snapped one of those old brittle lines and it was $230 for a new fuel assembly with the pump and everything.. crappy design.

#9 Fairtax4me

Fairtax4me

    Su bah roo'n

  • Gold Subscribers
  • 8,732 posts
  • Charlottesburg, VA

Posted 02 June 2012 - 11:24 AM

Board software automatically edits out any 4 letter words.
************
************
***************
mother************er

:D
Oh, apparently it doesn't care about damn...

Anyway!
Gary where might this O ring be located? In the tank?

#10 grossgary

grossgary

    Elite Master of the Subaru

  • Members
  • 19,800 posts
  • WV

Posted 02 June 2012 - 08:59 PM

Gary where might this O ring be located? In the tank?

The fuel pump assembly comes out of the tank. It's a huge convoluted contraption and the pump makes up a portion of the entire assembly.

Next to the fuel pump on the assembly is a round (2 1/8" round) upside down reservoir. it has a metal cap on it (the cap faces down into the tank since this reservoir is upside down). this cap simply twists off like a soda cap. a cursory glance suggests the pump fills this reservoir which then pushes fluid up into the fuel lines that attach directly above it.

the metal cap has three metal tabs/fingers on it that grab plastic rectangular holds on the plastic cup. it's REALLY obvious when you see it so if all these words are confusing just ignore them. between this metal cap and the plastic reservoir is an oring - it's 2 1/8" ID x 2 5/16" OD....i think that's what it is anyway.

When I removed my pump the oring was "pushed out of the cap", with like a half inch or inch of it just hanging out of the cap. When removed the oring was notably too large to fit, it had expanded with age/gas contact I suppose. Some folks even suggest the expanding orings crack the metal caps...not sure which comes first...This is not a rare issue on H4 and H6's so I plan on doing it to my other 2002 OBW H6 as well since it's so easy.

i'll likely do my 2003 OB again as well since one of the tabs was broken and i'd like to make sure of the oring material.

So since my oring was pushed out - fuel pressure was simply bleeding out the cap back into the fuel tank without ever making it through to the lines....or very little into the lines.

One 99 cent oring later i was back on the road.

The fuel pump is super easy to remove: it can literally be pulled in 5 or 10 minutes and there's nothing tricky about it.

(2) 12mm bolts holding the lower seat cushion and pull the cushion out.
(4) phillips head screws hold the cover plate on.
(8) or so 8mm bolts holding the fuel pump into the tank.

#11 987687

987687

    Rally Suby!

  • Members
  • 3,550 posts
  • Northern Maine

Posted 02 June 2012 - 09:17 PM

Now you've gone and scared the crap out of me. hah.
I take my car on lots of road trips, this would suck. Is it likely to be the same design on my 98 leg?

I'll have to see the pump assy to make sense of what's going on.

Does any o-ring do off the parts store shelf, or are there different o-rings rated for gas that don't break down?

#12 Cougar

Cougar

    Elite Master of the Subaru

  • Members
  • 6,340 posts
  • Anchorage

Posted 02 June 2012 - 09:51 PM

The fuel pump assembly comes out of the tank. It's a huge convoluted contraption and the pump makes up a portion of the entire assembly.

Next to the fuel pump on the assembly is a round (2 1/8" round) upside down reservoir. it has a metal cap on it (the cap faces down into the tank since this reservoir is upside down). this cap simply twists off like a soda cap. a cursory glance suggests the pump fills this reservoir which then pushes fluid up into the fuel lines that attach directly above it.

the metal cap has three metal tabs/fingers on it that grab plastic rectangular holds on the plastic cup. it's REALLY obvious when you see it so if all these words are confusing just ignore them. between this metal cap and the plastic reservoir is an oring - it's 2 1/8" ID x 2 5/16" OD....i think that's what it is anyway.

When I removed my pump the oring was "pushed out of the cap", with like a half inch or inch of it just hanging out of the cap. When removed the oring was notably too large to fit, it had expanded with age/gas contact I suppose. Some folks even suggest the expanding orings crack the metal caps...not sure which comes first...This is not a rare issue on H4 and H6's so I plan on doing it to my other 2002 OBW H6 as well since it's so easy.

i'll likely do my 2003 OB again as well since one of the tabs was broken and i'd like to make sure of the oring material.

So since my oring was pushed out - fuel pressure was simply bleeding out the cap back into the fuel tank without ever making it through to the lines....or very little into the lines.

One 99 cent oring later i was back on the road.

The fuel pump is super easy to remove: it can literally be pulled in 5 or 10 minutes and there's nothing tricky about it.

(2) 12mm bolts holding the lower seat cushion and pull the cushion out.
(4) phillips head screws hold the cover plate on.
(8) or so 8mm bolts holding the fuel pump into the tank.


Thanks for the informative post Grossgary. This should help a number of folks. I have to wonder if the O-ring issue is due to gas additives like ethenol.

#13 Fairtax4me

Fairtax4me

    Su bah roo'n

  • Gold Subscribers
  • 8,732 posts
  • Charlottesburg, VA

Posted 03 June 2012 - 01:28 AM

I may have to look into this on my car. It doesn't like to start right away sometimes (takes 4-5 seconds of cranking before it fires then it sputters and chugs for a few seconds before finally setting up to proper idle speed). I always kinda figured it seemed like fuel pressure wasn't building fast enough, but haven't ever had a gauge on it when it happened.
Seems to run fine otherwise, and pressure is good once running (have checked that a few times, and even just a few days ago was at 28psi idle and up to 40 when under load. I can't imagine the pump has been going bad for the past two years. :-p Something else is causing it.




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users