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2003 Legacy


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8 replies to this topic

#1 eweisner

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Posted 02 November 2012 - 11:16 PM

My 2003 2.5L Legacy needs a transplant. Researching the posts I fould this statement from grossgary "95 EJ22's = dual port exhaust. 96+ EJ22's = single port exhaust. the EJ25 is dual port (like 95 EJ22's)" If I understand correctly a '95 EJ22 will bolt direclty into my car? I'm head out tomorrow to a pull n save and have the following options:

(2) 1995 Legacy's
(1) 1999 Forester
(1) 1995 Impreza

I know you guys have talked about this in other posts but I've not seen a post about anything newer than a '99.

Edited by eweisner, 02 November 2012 - 11:21 PM.


#2 porcupine73

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 07:56 AM

I've never done it, but just some notes I remember from similar posts....

Will definitely need ECU from old engine; your engine is speed density airflow based - those older engines you listed will be MAF based.

You're probably going to want the wiring harness then too. Not sure if there will be any communication issues to the TCU if it's an AT, since you have a phase II 4EAT if it's an auto, and those would've all had a phase I.

Emissions charcoal canister stuff, you may have to play around with that a bit to get it working.

Additional note on ECU's: if you have to pass ODBII emissions inspection, you might not make it with the '95, since ODBII startd in '96. Subaru did have ODBII in their '95 ECU's though I understand it might have been a bit quirky.

Ditto issue on '96 ECU, it resets all I/M's every time the engine is started. So for your 2003 for example if they're going to require no more than one not ready, that '96 ECU might be a problem to pass with?

Possible issues with EGR vs. non-EGR.

#3 grossgary

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Posted 03 November 2012 - 08:03 AM

*** NO*** the 95 EJ22 engine will not work in your car.

(1) 1999 Forester


You are in luck - that 99 Forester is the SOHC EJ25 that you need. Here are the engines you can use:

EJ22: 1999+
EJ25: 1999 forester and Impreza RS ONLY and all 2000-2004

For a 2003 you need a 1999+ Phase II EJ22 to swap into your 2003. The problem is that 99 EJ22's are hard to find and more expensive so it's not as easy of a swap.

If your 2003 has EGR then the engine needs EGR and there are no dual port options for 99+ EJ22's so you have to get the exhaust manifold (but the exhaust manifold is identical so it bolts right up).

is the 2003 repairable? if you mentioned what's wrong with it you might have other options.

there are two types of EJ25's, the information you quoted out of context from me is specific to 1996-1998 and some 1999 EJ25's.

the only way to get the 95 EJ22 to work...and i don't recommend trying it without lots of patience and ability to work around issues, would be to strip the 1995 intake manifold harness and swap your entire engine harness from your 2003 intake manifold onto the 1995..including fuel injectors and fuel rails if necessary. but then you run into the idle air control issue since they are different designs. i haven't done it enough to know how repeatable it is, if there are differences, etc.

2003 is also MAP sensor instead of MAF sensor so you'll drop the 95...

and might have to install the 2003 passengers side cam and crank sprocket on the EJ22 but that's easy.

Edited by grossgary, 03 November 2012 - 08:20 AM.


#4 eweisner

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 11:37 AM

One more question. I have found two engines a 2000 Impreza 2.2L and a 2002 Impreza 2.5L. Which one is my best option?

#5 porcupine73

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 12:47 PM

Hm all other things being equal, it seems like the 2.5L would be the most straightforward installation. It looks like per Gary's info you could use the 2.2L though as well if that's what you really wanted to use. Make sure to check out Gary's must have's, like if your engine has EGR replacement engine needs EGR.

#6 grossgary

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 12:47 PM

One more question. I have found two engines a 2000 Impreza 2.2L and a 2002 Impreza 2.5L. Which one is my best option?

it's a toss up at this point. mileage, maintenance history, price, how many owners for each one - headgaskets done on the EJ25?

00-02 EJ25's had an extended 100,000 mile headgasket warranty and many were repaired by Subaru - so one could inspect the heads and see if the headgaskets were already replaced. Or look for service records, ask Subaru about the VIN. Of course that doesn't guarantee they'll hold and Subaru doesn't resurface them usually, but at least you would know.

Everything being equal - I would lean towards the EJ22 and install a complete timing belt kit - new pulleys and tensioner. I see no reason to intentionally introduce EJ25 headgasket issues to a car if you have a choice.

You need a single port exhaust header and then bolt EJ25 intake manifold to the EJ22. Swap the crank sprocket and drivers side cam sprocket when installing the new timing belt (it lakes 3 minutes, very simple, no extra work really).

*** NOTE - These are Phase II 99+ specific directions, this info is not accurate on older EJ swaps. Don't follow directions for older EJ22-Ej25 swaps.

If you get the EJ25, now is a good time to install new EJ25 Turbo headgaskets. These Phase II EJ's are easy headgaskets to install, particularly with the engine out of the car, that's the hard part.

#7 grossgary

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Posted 23 November 2012 - 12:48 PM

Make sure to check out Gary's must have's, like if your engine has EGR replacement engine needs EGR.

yes make sure both have EGR. or both don't have EGR.

it's easy to install an EGR engine into a non-EGR vehicle, but not the other way around.

#8 eweisner

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Posted 25 July 2013 - 09:24 PM

"You need a single port exhaust header and then bolt EJ25 intake manifold to the EJ22. Swap the crank sprocket and drivers side cam sprocket when installing the new timing belt (it lakes 3 minutes, very simple, no extra work really"

 

This is what another member of this and another site told me.  I'm working with another gentleman whose been a great help but we're at a standstill.  The motor is in the car, the "y" pipe is installed.  New clutch kit and flex plate.  I'm not disagreeing with what the other very knowledgeable member told me, just need more than one source.  The guy that is helping me is very concerned with the timing and doesn't believe that just "Swap the crank sprocket and drivers side cam sprocket" will work.  He's worried about messing up a $1000 motor, which I really appreciate.  He's owned shops, and builds racecars, so is very knowledgeable.

 

The following is from the member I spoke of earlier.  Again I don't doubt what he is telling me at all.  I just need a seconded motion if you will....

 

the timing marks are hash marks like this ''|'' not the
arrows.
CRANK
the hash mark on the crank sprocket is located on the
rear of the sprocket. there is a flange with ''tabs'', the timing mark is on one
of those.
some of the later sprockets have a ''zillion'' tiny taps.
the
sprockets from the 90s have about 6.
TIP: the key way slot on the crank and
sprocket is supposed to be down in the 6 oclock position when the crank is lined
up right.

CAM
the hash mark on the cams is located on the outer
edge of the front face of the sprocket. this mark aligns with a cut in the
timing cover or the head behind the sprocket pulley.
the hash mark should be
straight up in the 12 oclock position.
NOT the ARROWS, NEVER the
ARROWS.

the driver side cam will be ''loaded'', but it should sit still
when positioned correctly. if it jumps after you position it try again in a
slightly different position.

the passenger side cam will be at rest, no
load, no worries.

it is not unusual for one pulley to be a tooth off
after your first attempt to set it.
if so try again. one tooth makes a big
difference.
1/2 a tooth may be ok.
rotate the crank by hand 2 full
rotations after you install the belt and check the alignment marks again, pulley
to engine, not belt.
if the belt has marks on it they will not line up for
something like 700 rotations.

if you are re-using the tensioner, make
sure it is in the upright position when you compress the piston. (piston
pointing up & down.)
if you do it with it on its side you can damage
it.
and compress it SLOWLY, VERY SLOWLY.

a new tensioner will come
compressed.
but if you get it wrong the first time and need to redo it, be
careful.

a note for the mechanic,

subaru timing belt rookies are
always looking for TDC.
you do not need to do that.
i only know subarus,
but apparently this is different than ANY other engine on earth.

suabru
gives you very specific timing alignment marks which eliminate that requirement.

the correct timing alignment marks locate all 4 pistons at mid- stroke. this
eliminates any possibility of valve to piston damage.
they even did this on
their ''non-interference'' engines which do not have valve / piston
interference..

 


 



#9 WoodsWagon

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Posted 27 July 2013 - 08:53 PM

The difference in the cam and crank pulleys are the number of "teeth" that trigger the sensors. You use the pulleys to match the computer. The physical timing marks are all the same.

 

Make sure you get the crank bolt tight enough when you're done.






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