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TSB from AU/NZ concerning Gates timing belt installlation


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I've never seen that happen. But then I always follow the specs on fitment of that guide plate as well as the ones on the DOHC rear belt covers (if equipped).

 

I have never had any trouble at all running a feeler gauge into the gap to check clearance. I always check at the middle and at either end. Same with the corner guides on the belt covers.

 

Neat tool though.... I guess us Americans don't get them? :cool:

 

GD

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Havent checked the website yet, but I would assume we do.

 

Went to the corporate site and checked the part numbers, dont see anything listed that was in the TSB yet.

 

Email sent to corporate, will post results.

Edited by Turbone
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I know I've seen in the Subaru service info to use a feeler gauge to check the clearance on that guide on the MT vehicles. Maybe some people are just putting it back in without doing that so that it is touching the belt and causing those failures. Because that failure seems like it would happen with a genuine belt or any aftermarket belt.

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Using a feeler gauge while the engine is still in the car is/would be a pita.

When you tighten the bolts it moves the plate tighter, so the tool Gates provides means you dont need to use the feeler gauge, you just stick it in there and tighten the bolts. We really should have this available here :-\

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It's not a Subaru TSB; it's a Gates TSB. That little special tool does look nice. If people really liked them maybe a group buy could get set up to get a couple dozen shipped over from Australia?

 

Correct, I should have pointed that out originally.

 

I remove the radiator 100% of the time when doing timing belts and there is plenty of room to get a feeler gauge in there.

 

GD

 

Yeah, you have plenty of room when the rad is removed. I just think using the FG for setting the guide plate clearance could be problematic.

With the tool from Gates its just slap it in there and tighten the bolts.

 

What would be wrong with just removing the guide plate?

 

The guide plate keeps the belt from possibly jumping teeth.

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The guide plate keeps the belt from possibly jumping teeth.

 

When did jumped timing due to the lack of this guide become an issue?

I had heard of some newer cars having problems with that during transport because of the car being rocked around while in gear. It seems to me that EJ engines were sold for about a decade before this little idea came up, how frequently can jumped timing be traced directly back to this guide plate not being in place?

Seems to me the timing tensioner should hold adequate tension on the belt to prevent jumping.

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I remove the radiator 100% of the time when doing timing belts and there is plenty of room to get a feeler gauge in there.

 

GD

 

I didnt know anyone who didnt remove the radiator, just seems like the rational thing to do to give you some elbow room.

 

I do remember, maybe on USMB, one person having a melted TB cover and we just couldnt figure out why it happened, but that was years ago.

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When did jumped timing due to the lack of this guide become an issue?

I had heard of some newer cars having problems with that during transport because of the car being rocked around while in gear. It seems to me that EJ engines were sold for about a decade before this little idea came up, how frequently can jumped timing be traced directly back to this guide plate not being in place?

Seems to me the timing tensioner should hold adequate tension on the belt to prevent jumping.

 

Not really. You have to look at it as a complicated system of pullies. You have just the crank moving back and forth just a little bit, not enough to turn the cams. With enough jostling, you can easily get the timing belt to jump. In real daily life, the TB would never ever see this kind of stress so it is not an issue. On a truck being delivered, rolling back and forth not even a complete rotation it can become one. And the more pullies there are, the higher the chances of it happenining.

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Not really. You have to look at it as a complicated system of pullies. You have just the crank moving back and forth just a little bit, not enough to turn the cams. With enough jostling, you can easily get the timing belt to jump. In real daily life, the TB would never ever see this kind of stress so it is not an issue. On a truck being delivered, rolling back and forth not even a complete rotation it can become one. And the more pullies there are, the higher the chances of it happenining.

 

So it's there for transport and it can be removed? That's what it sounds like you're saying, but looking at the belt and using my own brain instead of somebody elses judgement I would say that little thing is more or less cheap insurance. I would say removal is a personal call. A good indication it's not necessary is it's not on earlier models.

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When did jumped timing due to the lack of this guide become an issue?

I had heard of some newer cars having problems with that during transport because of the car being rocked around while in gear. It seems to me that EJ engines were sold for about a decade before this little idea came up, how frequently can jumped timing be traced directly back to this guide plate not being in place?

Seems to me the timing tensioner should hold adequate tension on the belt to prevent jumping.

 

 

 

I'll throw in my two cents on the guide plate. When I did the timing belt on the 06 Legacy I previously owned I noticed the newer style timing belt tensioner doesn't appear to hold the belt and "tight" as the older style tensioners. As a result of that, the guide may be there to help prevent the belt from jumping a tooth.

 

It looks like on the Legacy line, the plate didn't get added until the 3rd gen Legacies, even though the newer style tensioner was used on the 2nd gen Legacies.

 

That tool that Gates came up with is pretty cool!

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I remember when I used to work in a parts store in NZ we had this problem come back from a shop under warranty. The hydraulic tensioner ended up failing, seized and shredded the belt on a late-90's DOHC engine, and the workshop brought the tensioner back to claim the repairs to the engine under warranty. The whole timing assembly was sent away for analysis and it was determined that the engine failed due to the backing plate being set incorrectly, therefore putting the fault on the workshop.

 

Was a nightmare of a position to be in, the middle man between two companies blaming each other, but Gates ended up on top. That's the only time I've heard of it though. Hope it helps.

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Hm I don't know all applications that use the guide plate, I just assumed it was on all MT soobs. I thought I remember seeing on Endwrench that it was to prevent them from jumping time if parked in gear on a steep hill, I think that's what they said.

 

Pretty much the reason. They started putting the crank guide plate on manual transmission cars as when they were on the boat getting shipped, they were left in gear and would jump the timing belt.

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