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Guest Message by DevFuse
 

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Need a Master Cylindar


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17 replies to this topic

#1 djellum

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 09:08 PM

Hey,

so my brakes are spongy and wont bleed out correctly. shop checked it out while it was there for something else and said the master cylindar.

pricing them on Rock auto, but is there any actual difference in the ones for auto's and manuals, or with the hill holder (which I have but its not hooked up). i have power brakes but I dont know if they made manual brake models or if they are all power.

they also have rebuild kits for master cylindars (and strangely they dont specify type), which I havent done before but it seems pretty straight forward. anyone advise rebuiding over buying?

#2 Loyale 2.7 Turbo

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 12:01 AM

More info about what Car are you writing about is Needed in order to correctly Help you.

If you're writing about an Old-School Subaru, EA81 - EA82, no one came without Brake Booster; and I Kindly suggest you to Replace the Whole Master Cylinder instead of changing the internals, because it is made of Aluminium and it wear out along the Rubbers, so Usually they loose the Straightness.

The EA82 uses a 15/16" inner bore Master Cylinder.

Kind Regards.


#3 djellum

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 05:34 AM

sorry, in a hurry when i typed it. 87 Gl EA82.

thanks thats a couple of questions answered. cant imagine how auto or manual would matter so I will go ahead and order one unless someone chimes in.

#4 grossgary

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:13 AM

on manual transmission XT's and XT6's the brake master cylinder has a mechanism for the "hill holder" system that holds the car in place on an incline when you let the clutch out.

that might be the difference since auto's don't have that hill holder function obviously. but i would bet if you ignore the hill holder component they are interchangeable?

they do seem really simple, i wouldn't be concerned about rebuilding Subaru one. (Loyale 2.7 - you've seen Subaru MC's out of spec?). the original lasted a quarter century i wouldn't hesitate to rebuild my known good one? i would almost trust that more than an aftermarket rebuild, that's probably all they're doing on an unknown MC.

I wouldn't for other manufacturers I'm less familiar with, I'd just replace, but Subaru brakes are so robust, they rarely have issues. i haven't done a master cylinder but i've done brake caliper rebuilds before and they are similarly very simple and easy to do, not much to it, like a seal or two and that's it.

#5 ivans imports

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:51 AM

on thoose cars a low brake peadal is always related to the rear brake addjusters stuck or run out of travel or backwards very very rare to see bad master and very commen to see rear brake problems

#6 somick

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 01:30 PM

Do not order from ra. You will get stuck with wrong parts and they will charge you for return shipping

Sam

#7 grossgary

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 03:43 PM

i second being careful - good point by previous posters. Subaru master cylinder failure is extremely rare. And Rock Auto - cross reference the part number on google, ebay, other parts sites, it is easy to get the wrong part from them.

#8 djellum

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 04:24 PM

Ill check those rears first from the sound of it. tbh it really doesnt feel like a MC to me, which is why I had them look at it. I can lock them up no problem, but its way down by the floor when I do. you can pump them up a little and then its more normal, but they actually work fine if you just accept that they will almost be on the floor.

I looked at the pic of a rebuild kit and its dead simple, however its the same price lol.

hopefully the back brakes can be adjusted.

#9 grossgary

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 05:00 PM

interesting symptom. did you try googling "low brake pedal"?

#10 l75eya

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 06:30 PM

Maybe it has something to do with your hill holder being disconnected. My guess.

#11 Loyale 2.7 Turbo

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 12:04 AM

... Loyale 2.7 - you've seen Subaru MC's out of spec? ...


Just once in a EA82 and once in a J10 Justy (Beside more Non-Subaru cars); maybe because the pretty Bad Roads that we have here, you know... there are Potholes even inside the Potholes in certain areas, and traffic jams in others, so maybe the Brakes shall be used at least 3X more than in USA, I believe...

What happened is that when I installed the new Kit for those Master Cylinders, they still loosed pressure, specially under heavy braking...



... I wouldn't hesitate to rebuild my known good one? i would almost trust that more than an aftermarket rebuild...



I Agree, Absolutely... Cheapo aftermarket Master Cylinders could be Dangerous, I always suggest to use original Master Cylinders or Repair Kits from the Subaru Dealer.

However, I Agree that the Subaru Master Cylinders rarely fail.

May I Ask if the Bleeding process was done seeking the Cross Pattern for EA82? ... Because once I fixed a Low Pedal in a EA82 by doing the Cross Pattern bleeding; if it is not done like that, the Brakes could be Low.

Kind Regards.


#12 djellum

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 01:01 AM

I did rear passenger, front driver, rear drivers, and front passengers in that order. it was listed in my haynes that way. i put a full resevoir through each line (not running below half full before filling). then I repeated the process, then I let them gravity bleed for a bit.

I had to do it by myself so I figured that I just didnt get all the air out, so i told the shop to bleed them with the pressure machine they have, but they said the MC was bad.

I doubt its the hill holder, since it was in the same condition before I changed the brakes and this is a new issue. Unless the hill holder was damaged by the process.

Most google searches show up with an MC problem, or air in the line. both possibilities, but I think ill check those rear brakes. its the cheapest solution and should probably be done anyway since i havent had the drums off since I got it.

#13 naru

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 10:05 AM

you can pump them up a little and then its more normal


Definetly adjust the rears,but,no amount of rear brake adjustment will keep the pedal from changing height between strokes.

You need a MC.

Forget about rebuilding them.Waste of time and money.
Durability is very questionable.
Been there,done that many times when I was young and foolish.

Don`t bother w/factory rebuilds either.They are just as bad,IME.

MCs are one of the few car parts that you want NEW not "rebuilt".

Edited by naru, 14 December 2012 - 10:08 AM.


#14 Gloyale

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 11:05 AM

Definetly adjust the rears,but,no amount of rear brake adjustment will keep the pedal from changing height between strokes.


This isn't true.

on EA81's and 2wd EA82's the back brakes being out of adjustment will creat very long pedal travel before "catching"

If you give it a few quick pumps it stiffens up, because the rear shoes don't fully retract between each stroke.

I know that a similar feeling can be had from a spongy master....but in that case, the brakes will initially feel weak.....not just further down the the pedal travel.

To the OP, do yourself a big favor.....if you have adjustable brakes....adjust them. If you have self adjusting (ea82 4wd) then remove the drums and see how much pad is left, and make sure the selfadjuster isn't stuck.

If the brakes feel good, but the pedal is low, it's probably not the master.

#15 djellum

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 03:31 PM

I'll check the rears on my day off tomorrow. It may or may not be the problem, but I havent had the drums off so I should check anyway. if it fixes it great, if not ill get a MC.

#16 AKghandi

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 05:50 PM

i have a spare ea82 MC out of a 5speed w/hill holder.
For the money to ship it its yours.

#17 djellum

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Posted 14 December 2012 - 06:30 PM

thanks AK, ill keep that in mind. ill check the adjustments first though.

#18 ivans imports

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Posted 18 December 2012 - 11:16 AM

have had some loyales trap air in the rear porportioning valve at the back of car the rear takes a long time and lots of fluid to remove all the air 1/2 L or more. I whould still blame the rear brakes somwere. Addjuster upside down ? or stuck or air




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