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timing belt blues


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10 replies to this topic

#1 roosterslc

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 12:40 PM

Have a 95' legacy wagon with 185k that has been great.  Normal timing belt, water pump, seals, and tensioner were done 7 yrs-30k ago been running great.  A few days ago my girlfriend drove to no problems so she says, goes to leave hrs. later wont start.  I came down the next day to find the battery dead took battery to charge after returning, tried turning it over very strained from its normal cycle.  So I was concerned and started looking around and could see movement in the timing cover.  Stopped turning over engine and proceeded to get the vehicle home.

 

Yesterday I took apart the front cover to find cam pulley blown apart where the retainer ring came apart from the pulley.  So tried to bring it to tdc and both cams are off their marks.  I am wondering if this engine is shot or maybe salvageble.  My thinking is to change the pulley put a new belt on and see if will go.  I am not sure how to determine the correct positioning of the cam shafts, the manual I have is not very specific in this area.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.



#2 mikec03

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 01:17 PM

You have a non interference engine so you have not damaged anything.  There are many excellent DIY's on the timing belt installation, but in brief, the short lines [not arrows] on the cam and crank pulleys line up with marks just to the rear of the pulleys, at the 12:00 position.  



#3 Olnick

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 01:55 PM

Before you do anything research the process--read--study.  TDC is irrelevant.  Use hash marks for alignment, NOT arrows.

 

Here are a couple of links that will help you:

 

http://www.northursa.../timingbelt.pdf

 

 

http://beergarage.com/SubyTBelt.aspx

 

 

At 185k you should "overhaul" the entire front end--it's quite easy while you have it opened up.  Replace the water pump and thermostat.  Reseal the oil pump.  Replace cam & crank seals.  Replace all the idlers.  There are very reasonably priced complete kits available from "The Import Experts" and "Mizumoauto."

 

Good luck--and by all means ask any specific questions here at USMB.  Welcome aboard!



#4 torxxx

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 02:50 PM

One thing I will suggest since you are blessed with a 2.2L dont pull the radiator.  just remove the fans.  There is more than enough room do do a belt/seals etc.  

 

One big thing on those 2.2L is take a good look at the crankshaft where the keyway for the timing gear and crank pulley attach.  if it appears our of "square" (its a rectangle shaped groove with a half moom cut into the crank) replace the keyway and get some metal epoxy or a welder and get that keyway fixed.  I've seen a lot of guys do the entire job (me included lol) and never look at that.  Get it all together and not tighten down the crank nut to 150 lbs or w/e the spec is and you've got a way bigger issue



#5 davebugs

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 04:16 PM

On a '95 2.2 you're good - NON interference.

 

Dots and dashes (hash marks NOT arrows).

 

Just confirming what others have posted.

 

I do complete timing component kit and seals, WP, all belts, etc while I"m at it personally.

 

Most of us get the kits on the internet.  I use theimportexperts and others use someone else from the left coast.  WAY more reasonable that the local parts place or dealer normally,



#6 roosterslc

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 07:08 PM

Thanks for the quick response with all of your responses.  As I have been looking at pic's I see marks being talked about and have done the timing belt proceedure before but its been a couple of years.  My question is I know its out of time because the face of the left cam pulley has sheared off allowing the belt slowly work its way off the pulley 1/4 of the way.  The face of the pulley is where the  marks are located or is there another mark on the inner edge of the pulley?  I am assuming here, but dont I need to get the cam in the proper alignment before I pull off the pulley to replace it?  Also verifing if I am on the proper stroke or not.  I am planning on doing the hole service of seals, pump, and related parts if I dont have to worry about having damaged  the motor if what I thought I saw is correct that it is a non interference motor?



#7 Olnick

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 08:17 PM

Yes, the hash mark for alignment is on the front face of the cam pulley.  You'll need to get a new (used) pulley.  IIRC it is keyed so it will only go on in the proper position--then you can line it up by the hashmark.  I think any left side pulley from '90 through '95 will work (but someone correct me if I'm wrong!)

 

Now for the big question:  How the heck did the face of the pulley get sheared off?!!



#8 lmdew

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 08:33 PM

I have the cam pulley you need.

 

Larry



#9 johnceggleston

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 07:49 AM

if the belt is still in place, align the cam on the other side to its correct timing mark and then check the bad one.

 

there should be arrows on the inner part of the cam, if they are in the same relative position you are in the ball part and you can remove the belt with out worry regarding valve damage.

 

NOTE: the arrows should NOT be in the 12 oclock position, this is top dead center and it could cause piston valve contact.

 

TIP: once you decide you can remove the belt safely, loosen the cam bolt BEFORE you remove the belt. it will give you a way to hold the cam in place.


Edited by johnceggleston, 04 March 2013 - 07:50 AM.


#10 roosterslc

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 03:17 PM

Thanks again for the imput I had not been able do any more investigating until this morning.  Well to answer the question of why the cam pulley sheared has been answered.  The #2 idler bearing completely blew apart none of the ball bearings are left in thier respective place I did find most of them in the cover, what a mess.  A portion of the timing belt that had been walking off the cam pulley actually split apart and has wrapped itself around the crank sprocket.  There is a real mess of chewed up belt preventing me from being able to see alignment marks.  Part of me wants to just pull it all off so I can see where the marks are but the belt is still tight enough to prevent me from getting debris out of the way.  If I end up not being able to set the crank and one good cam to the proper marks before I have to remove the belt will I be totally screwed?



#11 davebugs

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Posted 05 March 2013 - 03:39 PM

ZIt's non interference so you're good.

 

That said there is a notch that sticks up on the back of the cogged piulley on crankshaft behind harmonic balancer.  Luuk for a noth to align it to under the crank sensor.

 

When possibly that's what you want to do.  All 4 pistons will be half way out.  Them the cam sprockets don't matter on this engine.






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