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Input required! (emissions, EA82 SPFI)


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14 replies to this topic

#1 tincan

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 08:48 AM

Right, so I'm not really sure this belongs in this section, but here's the deal.

Exhaust bit the dust, got informed the car has California based emissions on it.

So, the question is... what options do I have in terms of ditching that lousy, power robbing, completely unnecessary system from the car? It has to go. Long and short.

Any and all input and information is helpful. Thanks.

#2 NorthWet

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 09:37 AM

Most of the "emissions control" are part-and-parcel of the engine management.  There are no "power robbing" components on the car.  As far as the exhaust system being restrictive, it pretty much complements the rest of the air-handling on the engine.  Any changes to "open up" the exhaust will mostly just make it louder. 



#3 ivans imports

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 09:50 AM

They seem to run and make the best power on stock exhaust have seen no prof of power gains from removing stock one



#4 MilesFox

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 09:54 AM

ditch the muffler and advance the timing, run premium fuel. have fun. If the car had 200 hp, it would still run out of gear at 95 mph.

 

If the car feels slow, rev it up more. Powerband is 2500-55-- rpm. If you are short shifting and cruising below 1500 rpm you're doing it wrong.



#5 tincan

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 10:01 PM

ditch the muffler and advance the timing, run premium fuel. have fun. If the car had 200 hp, it would still run out of gear at 95 mph.

If the car feels slow, rev it up more. Powerband is 2500-55-- rpm. If you are short shifting and cruising below 1500 rpm you're doing it wrong.


Your advice always seems to be sound on EA cars. Straight pipe or glass pack? I suppose either is the same...

My "normal" shift point is between 2500-3000 for level or intown driving. Otherwise I try to avoid going past 5000 being more aggressive.

So this emission system should just stay put? What's different from the 49-state?

#6 MilesFox

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 10:07 PM

The difference would be built into the ECU. The LED will identify itself by blinking so many times in a row. Mechanically everything is the same, as far as i know.

 

I like to go the route of installing a glasspack immediately after the y-pipe flange, and substitute the muffler for a straight pipe. 

 

You should be shifting so that when you upshift, your next gear lands at the 2000-2500 rpm range when accelerating from the bottom of a gear. Ideal cruising rpm in any gear at any speed would be 2000-2500 rpms such as 3rd gear at 40 mph

 

These engines seem to be more efficient in middle rpm range than lower rpm range. anything above 4000 isnt really necessary unless you are trying to get on it, hence wind it up if you want to gain some acceleration.



#7 tincan

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 10:19 PM

The difference would be built into the ECU. The LED will identify itself by blinking so many times in a row. Mechanically everything is the same, as far as i know.

I like to go the route of installing a glasspack immediately after the y-pipe flange, and substitute the muffler for a straight pipe.

You should be shifting so that when you upshift, your next gear lands at the 2000-2500 rpm range when accelerating from the bottom of a gear. Ideal cruising rpm in any gear at any speed would be 2000-2500 rpms such as 3rd gear at 40 mph

These engines seem to be more efficient in middle rpm range than lower rpm range. anything above 4000 isnt really necessary unless you are trying to get on it, hence wind it up if you want to gain some acceleration.


You mean immediately behind the front cat? My car has two. One off the flange at the rear cat, about 6 inches into the next area of pipe.

I'll jack the car up in the am to show you. I was aiming to put 2" pipe in for the entire system regardless, for future support of upgrades to the engine.

#8 MilesFox

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Posted 15 August 2013 - 10:26 PM

Yeah, ditch the 2nd cat, basically the glasspack will replae it. The header pipe does all the exhaust tune and scavenging, and everything after that just brings it out past the bumper.

 

Is your car exempt from emissions for registration in your state?



#9 tincan

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Posted 16 August 2013 - 08:26 AM

Yeah, ditch the 2nd cat, basically the glasspack will replae it. The header pipe does all the exhaust tune and scavenging, and everything after that just brings it out past the bumper.

Is your car exempt from emissions for registration in your state?


That's what I thought, the part about the first cat and header pipe. The Monro I asked to do the custom system refused to remove the second cat, since it is one, not simply a resonator (the rear cat is part of the piping behind the front cat's flange). Instead they gave me some outrageous $1049 quote to replace everything. Yeah, no, I'm not that stupid.

Yeah, my car doesn't require an emissions test, but NY inspection stations will fail you for having an engine light.

#10 ivans imports

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Posted 16 August 2013 - 08:49 AM

For that price can buy a millermatic and weld it up yourself Not a bad idea i go to local parts store and look at the wall of pipes till i find the one i whant and make my own premade exhaust peices are realy cheap as long as your no after catts. I made a compleate exhaust for my 75 dodge motorhome for 200 $ all new from front to back and with the help of cheap pipe expander was able to make it all with clamps  and hangers dident even have to weld anything



#11 Gloyale

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Posted 16 August 2013 - 11:28 AM

California car has an Exhaust gas temp sensor and a slightly different ECU.

 

Swap to a non Cali ECU, and cut the sensor lead if you like.......but you won't notice any difference.

 

This is an economy car........not a race car.



#12 tincan

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Posted 17 August 2013 - 01:57 AM

California car has an Exhaust gas temp sensor and a slightly different ECU.

Swap to a non Cali ECU, and cut the sensor lead if you like.......but you won't notice any difference.

This is an economy car........not a race car.


Except the engine being quite underpowered means its frequently losing the economy over things like hills.

The point is to stop that. Just because one wishes to increase power somehow, does not automatically mean they expect it to be a race car.

That's a common assumption.

#13 tincan

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Posted 17 August 2013 - 02:02 AM

For that price can buy a millermatic and weld it up yourself Not a bad idea i go to local parts store and look at the wall of pipes till i find the one i whant and make my own premade exhaust peices are realy cheap as long as your no after catts. I made a compleate exhaust for my 75 dodge motorhome for 200 $ all new from front to back and with the help of cheap pipe expander was able to make it all with clamps and hangers dident even have to weld anything


It turns out as long as you don't ask them to install said modified exhaust parts, they'll put together anything you like. So, I'm getting a 2" cat back in the form of the one Milesfox mentioned above

I have access to welders, but, it's not something I do.

#14 Gloyale

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Posted 17 August 2013 - 10:52 AM

Except the engine being quite underpowered means its frequently losing the economy over things like hills.

The point is to stop that. Just because one wishes to increase power somehow, does not automatically mean they expect it to be a race car.

That's a common assumption.

 

Whatever your motivations, doesn't matter.

 

Race car or not, anyway you look at it, these engines don't have alot more power left in them to tap.  And what is available isn't going to be had from "ditching that power robbing emmissions stuff"

 

The california model cars have very little differenrence from the 49 state versions. 

 

Losing the rear cat could help a tad.......running premium gas can help too.

 

As for losing economy going up hills?  If you try to power up them at full speed fast as you can go, then yes......

 

Get off the gas, grab a lower gear, and let the RPMs do the work while holding a light throttle opening.......you will use less gas.

 

But which are you after?  Less gas?  more power?  those are ussually opposing goals.



#15 tincan

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Posted 17 August 2013 - 02:09 PM

Thanks for your help guys, this thread can be closed/removed as I've made decisions.




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