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2000 motor swap questions


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16 replies to this topic

#1 nakedandfam0us

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 09:57 AM

Hello everyone, I picked up a 2000 outback limited with a blown timing belt.

 

Well... it had a blown belt, and the guy slapped on a new one and tried to start it... so needless to say the motor is in dire straights. pulled heads there's bent valves, damaged pistons, and all that fun stuff. no problem, i have a running motor out of a 2002 TS that I will drop into the car as a temporary fix while I completely rebuild the original motor over the winter. The car is an auto (gross) which I'm going to leave for now until the rebuilt motor goes in and I have rounded up clutch linkage, rear diff etc.

 

I ordered from subaru today- oil pan, exhaust gaskets, rear main seal, oil separator plate, water pump gasket, t-stat housing gasket.

I ordered from online today- gates timing belt kit tckwp304, t-stat.

 

The 2000 ecu currently in the car is for an auto tranny tz1a4caba and ej251axawl engine.

The 2002 engine going into the car is for a standard tranny tyl54vc2aa and ej251aw3ab engine. 

 

So, should I swap the ecu with the matching motor and trick into thinking there is an auto, or leave it as is and just plug in the motor?

 

And, is my parts list complete for this project? Like I say I'm just looking for 6 months of reliability so basically I am going economy class for now, and going all out on the winter build. 

 

Thanks for any advice here, I have done tons of reading it seems either way will work but I figured check with the experienced before I'm turning the key.

 

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Edited by nakedandfam0us, 28 September 2013 - 03:37 PM.


#2 nakedandfam0us

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 03:40 PM

got the motor out with only one ignorant bolt to hassle me, so can't really complain. going to start on the new(er) motor tomorrow

 

never had the "pleasure" of having an auto tranny before either so I'm sure I will run into a couple questions for the experts. thanks in advance all!



#3 grossgary

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 03:51 PM

leave the ECU, it doesn't matter.  generally just bolt the intake manifold to the "new" motor.  but you can swap the ECU..again..it doesn't matter, the ECU isn't auto/manual specific, there's an identifier pin telling it which it is (which you'll need to change that pin if you swap to manual).

 

make sure the torque converter is fully seated.  if it touches the flexplate when installingt he engine the torque converter isn't fully seated.  you must draw the torque converter and flexplate together with the bolts holding the togehter once the engine is installed.

 

if you hate auto's that much you always will, but they are great solutions for a variety of reasons.  with synchro issues, input shaft bearings and seal issues, manuals are hardly considered more reliable any more and they're certainly higher maintenance with clutches, pressure plate, throw out bearings, pilot bearings that aren't great at making 200,000+ miles.  in traffic and towing auto's are superior too.  but like i said with that much of a manual preference it's likely you'll hate it.  just manually shift it and dog that thing out, you'll get the RPM's up like you like and wear that POS out. LOL



#4 johnceggleston

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Posted 28 September 2013 - 09:04 PM

the pistons are probably fine.

it is not very often that a busted belt causes piston damage.

a valve job will probably put it back on the road.

but you do what you think is best.

 

there may be a slight difference in the new vs. old engines.

use the existing intake, cam and crank sprockets and you should be good.

 

the 00 engine does not have EGR.

and they added it in 03 , i think, so that should not be an issue.

but even if the 02 does have EGR, it will not be an issue.


Edited by johnceggleston, 28 September 2013 - 09:06 PM.


#5 nakedandfam0us

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Posted 29 September 2013 - 11:25 AM

Thanks for the replies :)

 

I don't mind an auto tranny i guess, it certainly does have it's benefits, but sure do prefer the more control of a 5 speed especially in the snow. 

 

Cam, crank sprockets and intake. On it! 

 

The pistons did get hit pretty good, more so from when the previous owner tried to start it without fixing valves first. if i didn't have a running block already i would opt for a quicky head job and be done with it, but i figured this is a better route for now. 

 

Going to wrench on the 2002 motor today so we'll see how that goes

Cheers



#6 johnceggleston

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Posted 30 September 2013 - 08:19 AM

make sure you KNOW what the correct timing marks are.

do not guess!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



#7 nakedandfam0us

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Posted 01 October 2013 - 10:25 AM

spoken from experience? Thanks for the advice I will double check before cranking... LOL!



#8 grossgary

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Posted 01 October 2013 - 10:27 AM

spoken from experience? Thanks for the advice I will double check before cranking... LOL!

there are multiple marks on the crank sprocket and people do use the wrong one and can experience valve damage.  so experience in that he's seen it happen to others on the forums before for sure....



#9 AdventureSubaru

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Posted 01 October 2013 - 03:44 PM

Make sure you have the trans torque converter properly seated before you tighten things down. There's a write-up somewhere for it. it easily feels seated but still has another step to it. Sometimes this will come partly out when you pull the motor. If it's tightened without being properly seated, bad things will happen to your trans.



#10 nakedandfam0us

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Posted 01 October 2013 - 07:30 PM

I was unaware of the torque converter issue, thanks for that. 

 

I didn't give much thought to it when I pulled the engine, but now I'm wondering if I should have left the TC connected to the tranny and unbolted it through the access hole on the top of the motor? 

 

The pump shaft came out with the engine and a clip as well tz1a4caba more reading to do,,


Edited by nakedandfam0us, 01 October 2013 - 10:10 PM.


#11 AdventureSubaru

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Posted 01 October 2013 - 10:16 PM

http://www.ultimates...by-mnwolftrack/

 

There's some pretty good info in that thread to make sure you seat the converter. I replaced the trans in my wife's car a couple years ago at 298k I believe, and added a few pics to the thread myself. Should have all you need. The automatic (4EAT) is a great transmission. I prefer the feel of a 5 speed, but the gearing on the automatics makes them great for snow/trail/off road use since they crawl very nicely.

 

I assume you'll be checking fluid along the way. These Subaru transmissions are unique in that there are two dipsticks - a short one on the passenger side for the front differential (needs gear oil) and a long one on the drivers side (needs ATF) Occasionally people will put ATF in the differential. Otherwise it's pretty standard. If you choose, these trannies have external filters that can be replaced along with the fluid.



#12 lmdew

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Posted 02 October 2013 - 05:07 AM

Yes make sure the TC is fully seated in the trans.  One way I've found to ensure it's all the way in is to push back slightly and rotate it.  If the starter is still bolted in place it will just rub the starter gear.  When you bolt it up to the flex plate it will pull forward about an 1/8".



#13 nakedandfam0us

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Posted 02 October 2013 - 10:27 AM

i like the starter idea for depth checking. makes sense. 

 

so i think i've got it figured out what happened. when i pulled the motor the tranny pump shaft came with the motor. which is better than it staying the 4 speed i guess.

 

On this shaft is a small metal clip that holds pump shaft to TC. on other end of the shaft is a small seal, which broke. I am going to replace that small seal on the pump shaft, and the seal that is visible in the front of the transfer case. 

 

I know on some motors (example ford 351C) they use a 28oz weight on the flywheel/flex plate, if you use a different weighted flywheel you're hooped. Is a subaru flex plate balanced all the way around? can i bolt it to the crank is any orientation? thanks again everyone your help has been great



#14 ivans imports

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Posted 02 October 2013 - 10:36 AM

I whould use all managment from old engine cam gears crank gear intake ect then you know its a match take very little time to swap I always leave the intake atached to car never undoo feul lines and just flop intake over to ds put atowel down to keep from chiping fender



#15 ivans imports

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Posted 02 October 2013 - 11:42 AM

Make shure you check for cracked or droped guides when doing valves

#16 nakedandfam0us

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Posted 03 October 2013 - 06:59 AM

I'm not splitting this motor the heads are okay, new HG from previous owner. 

 

Building heads up on the blown motor this winter. ALL the guides and seals are getting replaced... she hit pretty bad lol



#17 nakedandfam0us

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Posted 03 October 2013 - 07:03 AM

I pulled cam and crank sprockets yesterday from the original motor, they are going on the newer motor today. I wouldn't have thought of them so thanks.

 

I got the bulk of my parts as well so its BUILD DAY!!! yay!

 

Using the original ECU, Sprockets, Intake.  

 

thanks again for the advice everyone!






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