whistler Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 So... my brat eats front cv joints, I'm hoping I may have finally figured the problem out, but the the most recent axle failure happened along with a failure of the driver's side lower ball joint. I'm not sure exactly what happened, but the tapered end of the ball joint is sheared off pretty much flush with the bottom of the A-arm (ie no threads on it at all) and I have no idea how to get it out of the knuckle without having some threads on the bottom of it. Suggestions would be greatly appreciated. The taper is free of the a-arm so I can pull that down and see the whole tapered end of the ball joint. I was hoping to avoid pulling the knuckle off so I can avoid having to deal with bleeding the breaklines, but I'm thinking taking the knuckle off, putting it in a vise and hammering out the ball joint may be the only solution. Hopefully the collective will (as usual) be smarter than I am. Tom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uberoo Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 If you have to pull the knuckle you can slit the brake line holder on the strut and bend its halves out of the way.Then you don't have to bleed the brakes.Once your done just bend the halves back into place to hold the brake line.You can use a dremel or jig saw or even a sawz-all to cut the brake line holder just its alot harder with the reciprocating blades.Just be careful not to cut the line. As for the balljoint pieces, try hitting the ball joint retaining nut with a impact wrench(make sure the cotter pin is removed first) to see if you can get it broke loose.If not you can take a punch and stake the piece of the ball joint to the control arm and try the impact again.Unless its rusted pretty good, the ball joint nut shouldn't be that tight.Assuming you get the piece of the ball joint out of the control arm your next task is to get the piece out of the knuckle.If you remove the retaining bolt and pry the knuckle apart slightly the ball joint should fall right out,if not hit the knuckle a few times with a hammer.Once the ball joint pieces are out just re-install a new ball joint and put everything back together again. NOTE: If you do have to pull the knuckle it would be fantastic opportunity to pack the wheel bearings full of grease. I would also swap the other ball joint because if one failed due to fatigue and age then the other can't be that far behind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uberoo Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 OPPS! I responded after only reading some of your post, but not the end where you explained that the threaded end broke off.To free it find a piece of steel pipe or even a piece of wood and put it on the control arm and hit the object with a big hammer.For obvious reasons you want the pipe or wood long enough to go over the top of the knuckle so you can hit it with a hammer.Put the pipe as close to the knuckle end of the control arm and hammer away.I like to use a floor jack handle or a chunk of exhaust tubing or even a very long socket extension. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman2 Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 (edited) Like Uberoo stated, get the brake line free of the strut. On my Brat there is a tiny little plate with two holes on it. Just behind the strut on the fender skirt, wire your calipers to it. Pull your knuckle, remove ball joint bolt (sure you already have), drive something into the slot. Biggest screw driver you have, wood chisel, cold chisel, anything to separate it and open the gap. A bench vise would be extremely helpful to hold the knuckle for you. I would probably drench it in break free, Kroil are any other lubricant I could find. Let it soak for a couple of hours. Then like stated smack the top of it sharply. It will eventually fall out! Give it no other choice, lol! If you have enough of the taper left clamp that in the vise, Put a box with some rags or something to cushion the fall and let the weight of the knuckle help you out! Have you replaced your motor mounts? If you have height adjustable struts are they adjusted all the way down height wise. Bad motor mounts and having the struts jacked up can both put undue stress on axles. The ball joint failing as it did is a little odd though. Maybe it was just old. I also agree with doing both sides! I believe my Brat is on it's second set of replacement ball joints. I replace them as soon as the rubber boot starts to fail. Also agree on checking, repacking, new seals or/and new wheel bearings if needed. Do both sides and save yourself some trouble. Typically they are not that hard to get out and in. Edited April 19, 2014 by bratman2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloyale Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 Pry open the casting slightly and drop the balljoint out. no need to remove the knuckle. PB and a wedge in the gap and it should come right out. I can't see the problem here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted April 19, 2014 Share Posted April 19, 2014 +1 to uberoos brake suggestion, that's basically the standard way to do it. Pry open the casting slightly and drop the balljoint out. no need to remove the knuckle. PB and a wedge in the gap and it should come right out. I can't see the problem here. +1. pry it open. liquid wrench, PB blaster, penetrant in there. if it's stuck, once pried open a bit you may even find enough room to get a small driver of some sort - punch, screwdriver in there and impact it from the top down. may be hard to get any bite though. hammering/prying on the vehicle is tricky as the suspension takes a lot of the impact rather than the part you're trying to get to. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman2 Posted April 20, 2014 Share Posted April 20, 2014 Also, don't over think this brake line thing. I just replaced all four on my Brat a week ago. Bleeding brakes is no big deal. You probably need new fluid anyways, heck you probably need new brake lines if you have not replaced them already. Clean up the bleeder screw, couple of drops of you favorite lube to help keep from shearing off the bleeder. Let sit for a couple of hours and bleed them. As far as the knuckle goes if you can get it out in place great. If you have to pull it so what, it is simple also. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistler Posted April 20, 2014 Author Share Posted April 20, 2014 Thanks everyone for your replies. Western washington was doing it's Spring thing yesterday (lots of rain) so I didn't brave the weather to work on it. I was worried about widening the slot in the knuckle too much if I pried on it, but it doesn't sound like that's a major concern so I went ahead and pried on it a bit this morning and the ball joint fell right out for me. I'm about to install the new axle and ball-joint. Should be good to go again soon. Thanks again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistler Posted April 20, 2014 Author Share Posted April 20, 2014 By the way bratman2, where'd the get the new brake lines for your brat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman2 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 Rockauto! I think they were just over $40.00 plus shipping. Also I have this little 2oz. brake bleeding bottle I bought for little of nothing. It has a magnet and a built in one way valve on the screw on lid. Comes with a piece of hose and works great for bleeding brakes by yourself, no help needed. Hook the hose up to the bleeder screw, crack the bleeder screw open and go pump the brakes 8-10 times. Close the bleeder, pull the hose off and dump bottle. Refill master cylinder and start on the next one. One of the best few dollars I have ever spent, according to my wife that use to be my brake bleeding partner!!! I think I got it at Autozone but not sure, I have had it several years. Did you get your broken ball joint out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistler Posted April 21, 2014 Author Share Posted April 21, 2014 I did, I ground down a cheap pry bar I have from harbor freight and pried a bit harder and it fell right out. of course the first replacement I got was wrong and I had to go get another one, but I've pretty much got everything back together. I need to go get a couple of cotter pins that I thought I have and don't and I'll be good to go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman2 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 The wrong part, seen that a few times myself. I generally check part numbers for my 87 against an 84 to keep from ending up with EA82 parts. Seems common as slice bread for lots of places to screw that up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistler Posted April 21, 2014 Author Share Posted April 21, 2014 yeah, this one was unusual in that they listed the same party number for all brats, gls and dls 82-87, it seems that either o'reilly has the wrong part in their database for the masterpro brand (all they had in stock) or masterpro doesn't make the correct ball joint. I usually do the "ask for 1984" trick is well. it often still takes two tries to get the right part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whistler Posted April 21, 2014 Author Share Posted April 21, 2014 Which brand of hydraulic lines did you get? There's a plethora of options on rockauto and the wrong part is a lot more of a pain when shipping is involved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman2 Posted April 21, 2014 Share Posted April 21, 2014 This was the front and they only have three left. AMERICAN REMANUFACTURERS INC. Part # 8718000 Rear was UNITED Part # 38137 As you can see I was a little wrong on the price. Which is good for you! . The front ones are not remanufactured, that just their name and they were USA made which for their price was great too me. The rear ones are very short and a pain to change due to their location. As a matter of fact the ones I got were about 1/4" shorter than the factory which did not help the rear installation at all. The fronts were a piece of cake, lol!!! I had bleed my brakes 5 years or so ago so I didn't expect to use the whole pint of fluid I had. But the fluid was fairly dark so I went from wheel to wheel pumping 10 each twice and used the whole pint. If you find that cheap one man bleeder you will love it. Soak all clips, fittings and bleeders good hours before starting will surely help!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subaruist Posted April 24, 2014 Share Posted April 24, 2014 Important note about ball joints... I had a ball joint go out on me in traffic, it was not fun. A ball joint failing in the wrong way is one off the few ways to bring down a Subaru almost instantly, and as far as I am concerned, one of those parts to keep on hand if you do any offroading or driving on rough roads with potholes. The way they usually fail is not to shear off though, but to just come apart, the ball coming out of the socket, so I wonder if there was more that happened with that failure. - This was on a 1979 Brat by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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