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Factory fill oil EA81, EA82


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29 replies to this topic

#1 MilesFox

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 10:09 PM

With all the argument on the internet in general, about which oil is best for Subaru, Mobil Vs. Rotella, 5w30 vs 5w40, does anyone know what the EA81 and EA82 came with from the factory? Considering the oil spectrum is anywhere from 5w30 to 20w50 on the tech sheets, i am curious which weight came in the box, considering "5w30 is not recommended for sustained high speed operation".

 



#2 Dinky26

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 10:25 PM

considering "5w30 is not recommended for sustained high speed operation".



Ugh....really, this is what I'm running in my Brat w/ the EA81....WTH...I thought that is what was recommended.......CRAP.....

#3 Loyale 2.7 Turbo

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 10:33 PM

The Number will Also depend on your Area's Climate.

 

In my case at the warm and stable caribbean climates, I always use my EA82 "BumbleBeast" with 20W~50, the last ten years I used Motul Brand, but I've switched recently to Valvoline's High Mileage 20W~50 Motor Oil, which develops quieter operation on my EA82.

 

I bet you can find interesting info about motor oils, here:

 

~► http://www.ultimates...l-for-your-car/

 

Kind Regards.



#4 MilesFox

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 11:05 PM

I understand viscosity index and oil weights (i work at an oil change shop). I have used 15w40 and 20w50 in ea82's. Currently, i am running Mobil high mileage 10w30 in the 96 Impreza (semi-syn, 5000 mi) and Mobil 1 high mileage 10w30 in my 86 3door (ej22 phase 2, full syn 10,000 mi) I am considering a 40 wt in the Impreza my next oil change, considering mobil1 0w40 full syn (as it will be winter with 0 degree weather.

 

But all that aside, i am wondering what was the factory fill oil in ea81 and ea82's when new. I know for sure that late model phase 2 engines came with 5w30 'energy conserving' oil from the factory to meet fuel economy standards for USDM, although the 'not recommended' stipulations exist in the owners manual, and the tech manuals at work, as well as listings for 5w30, 10w30, 10w40,, 30, 40, 50, 15w40, 20w50 are options based on temperature ranges.s. Based on that, and in my personal and professional opinion, 5w30 is only appropriate for temperatures consistently below 32-61 degrees F.

 

But for engines prior to 2000, 1995, before current economy standards, i am wondering what came in the box at the time of manufacture for EA engines. T^his would be before ISLAC GF 3 specs, and before API SJ, SI, SL specs. Current specs are ISLAC GF5 and API SN. Late model FA engines for 2013 and later call for 0w20 and 0w30 oil, as do most Toyota and Honda, and GM with 5w30 with 0w30 as winter option
 


Edited by MilesFox, 17 July 2014 - 11:14 PM.


#5 MilesFox

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 11:13 PM

I took a look at your oil write up. Very comprehensive; you are very knowledgeable. And with Mobil, that is the brand we sell at my oil change shop, so i am very familiar with their nomenclature and marketing. I suppose i could try and look online about old subarus and their factory fill, but i would guess i would find USMB so here i am asking to begin with. I have read the NASIOC threads regarding mobil vs rotella and the use of 5w40 oils.



#6 MR_Loyale

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Posted 17 July 2014 - 11:21 PM

As I recall mine came from the factory with 5w20.



#7 MilesFox

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 12:28 AM

As I recall mine came from the factory with 5w20.

No where does it list 20 wt oil except for late model FA engines for 2013 and later.



#8 jono

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 06:12 AM

used various 15W40 (shell, valvoline, nulon etc) for the HVLA's in EA82T for years now ranging from minus 7C to plus 40C whereas my EA81 20W50 15 years Valvoline XLD old adjustable tappets and thicker oil is my theory :)



#9 stratman977

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 06:48 AM

Dunno for sure but I would put my money on 10w30. I'm pretty sure around that time frame 10w30 was the reccomended all around oil for most cars.



#10 MilesFox

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 07:24 AM

Dunno for sure but I would put my money on 10w30. I'm pretty sure around that time frame 10w30 was the reccomended all around oil for most cars.

I agree, this seems likely, with 5w30 given as the winter weight option.  In regards to trends, the trend was moving form 10w30 to 5w30, and nowadays 5w20 is a common weight, with 0w30 replacing 5w30 where 30 wt is required (turbo) and 0w40 for heavier oil.

 

What i am trying to determine is if 5w30 was historic, or only installed in late models for 'energy conserving' sake,

 

Being at the oil shop, i try to move customers with subarus off 5w30 and into 10w30 at least for summer wt, or with soobs coming in a quart low or with more than 100,000 mi. Depending on what the customer would pay for, i should recommend 10w40 (semi syn) or 0w40 (full syn). It makes me withs we carried 5w40 delvac, but we only have 15w40.

 

I suppose in general, 40 wt preferred, 30 wt for colder climate/winter.



#11 Gloyale

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 10:57 AM

According to my EA FSMs.......

 

10w-30, or 10w-40 are speced for temps from 0 F to 95 F  (says both......doesn't give a distinct temp where to switch)

 

5w-30 is listed for temps BELOW 0 F which is -18 C........Well below freezing.....

 

 

I personally use 10w40 for everything except the coldest time of year.......then I might run 10w-30 if we are having a cold snap.

 

Unless you are well below zero ALL winter......I would not use 5w-30.

 

It also says if used in desert areas or heavy duty application, the following can be used.....30, 40, 10w-50, 20w-40, 20w-50


Edited by Gloyale, 18 July 2014 - 10:59 AM.


#12 MR_Loyale

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Posted 18 July 2014 - 08:51 PM

No where does it list 20 wt oil except for late model FA engines for 2013 and later.

 

You are correct. My memory must be going. Emailed Subaru and they said it came with 10W40. I do recall my father convinced me to switch to 10W30 which I have been using for most of the cars life.


Edited by MR_Loyale, 18 July 2014 - 08:53 PM.


#13 MilesFox

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Posted 19 July 2014 - 07:16 AM

This is good to know! 40 wt oil it is. At the oil shop i should ask them to supply 5w40 as the only 40 wt oils we offer is 14w40 for diesel (mobil delvac 1300 super) and mobil 1 0w40. The mobil 1 can be too expensive for customers to consider, and 10w 40 may be too heavy for winter operation in Wisconsin climate.

 

I suppose, for late model subaru with FA engines, that come with 0w20 and 0w30, i should suggest 0w40. I hope that going to 40 wt doesn't affect the warranty, Because this: http://www.nj.com/ne...ml#incart_river



#14 MilesFox

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Posted 19 July 2014 - 07:23 AM

2012 TSB in regards to oil consumption from subaruoutback.org reposted from NASIOC:

 

http://www.subaruout...tml#post1019434



#15 MilesFox

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Posted 19 July 2014 - 07:24 AM

Please can i have anyone's opinions about using 40 wt oil over 30 wt, for 5w, 10w, and 0w.



#16 silverhelme

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Posted 19 July 2014 - 10:58 AM

I'm retired now but in my own 2006 Impreza I still run 5-30 Syntec but I know how it was maintained and what the current oil pressure is.  The car has almost 200k on it and the oil pressure is still within factory spec's. That said I always based my oil recommendations to customers on mileage, known history, etc. If the Impreza was a customer car with normal wear I would recommend changing to a 10w40 or even 15w40.

 

I tend to recommend synthetic oil if you can afford it and are willing to stop ALL oil leaks. I have seen almost identical cars go about twice the service mileage using synthetic oil. I generally don't see much difference in fuel mileage but I get about 3 mpg more than a friend who has the same car and uses regular oil straight from the Subaru dealer ( I have always serviced my own ).



#17 MR_Loyale

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Posted 19 July 2014 - 11:10 AM

With the synthetic, are you extending the change intervals?  My Loyale started life with regular oil and 3mo/3K changes until 120K miles. Inside the cam tower was very clean to that point as I have pics of when I did the timing belt (w/engine out of the car) I took off the covers. A beautiful light tan tint with no dirty residue.  From 120K until 160K i switched to synthetic and 5-6K intervals. Now I am at the end of head gasket replacement and i can tell without a doubt the engine was the most filthy I have seen. Black dirty deposits in the cam tower area.  Had it all cleaned up and I am going back to 3mo/3K intervals and standard oil.

 

I cannot say for sure if it was the long interval or the synthetic. I suspect the interval more though.



#18 MilesFox

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Posted 19 July 2014 - 04:47 PM

Long interval maybe likely. Dirty or failed PCV. What i would presume is the synthetic oil is washing out all the carbon that has built up over the life of the engine, on the piston faces, skirts, and rings, the valve guides, and in areas where carbon will condense on the cooler parts of the engines.

 

This is not to get into myths about synthetic oil vs coonventional, but rather what was the factory fill weight for these generations of engines during their time.

 

For your sake, the head gaskets probably had failed from overall age of the vehicle, regardless of miles, and wheter or not the age of the coolant is old or hasn.t been changed every 3 years. If you are repairing it, you may as well continue with the synthetic oil. How were the carbon deposits on the piston faces and cc's? The synthetic oil does not degrade the same as convention aiol does. However, contaminants do collect in the oil regardless of syn or conventional, as this is due to the mechanical condition of the engine/and or operating envioronment/ maintenace habits to begin with.

 

Even conventional oil by today's standards far exceed the standoards for oil at the time of manufacture for these engines. Current standard for conventional oil is actually a semi synthetic oil, and for example, in 2000 and later toyotas, the drain schedule is 6 mo and 5000 mi with 5w30



#19 Loyale 2.7 Turbo

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Posted 19 July 2014 - 05:32 PM

I took a look at your oil write up. Very comprehensive; you are very knowledgeable...

 

Thank Miles, I Really Appreciate your Kind Words.

 

Let me add some information from Outside USA, only for sharing information. I talked with the old salesman at the last office of the Local Subaru Dealer, he said they always used 20W~50 on their EA81 and EA82, I believe it could be caused by our Warm to Hot Climates, here at the Caribbean.

 

Also, according to my Dad, the Subie came new from a Dealer in California, filled with 10W~40, but it could be 15W~40, he doesn't remember clearly the first number, but he asked about that, then, because we always do our car's maintenance; he only remembers clearly the last number: 40.

 

Kind Regards.



#20 Loyale 2.7 Turbo

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Posted 19 July 2014 - 05:38 PM

But since the very first oil change, we've used 20W~50 on the EA82,

 

the few times I used 15W~40, the Lifters became noisier.

 

Kind Regards.



#21 MR_Loyale

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Posted 19 July 2014 - 07:37 PM

Long interval maybe likely. Dirty or failed PCV. What i would presume is the synthetic oil is washing out all the carbon that has built up over the life of the engine, on the piston faces, skirts, and rings, the valve guides, and in areas where carbon will condense on the cooler parts of the engines.

 

This is not to get into myths about synthetic oil vs coonventional, but rather what was the factory fill weight for these generations of engines during their time.

 

For your sake, the head gaskets probably had failed from overall age of the vehicle, regardless of miles, and wheter or not the age of the coolant is old or hasn.t been changed every 3 years. If you are repairing it, you may as well continue with the synthetic oil. How were the carbon deposits on the piston faces and cc's? The synthetic oil does not degrade the same as convention aiol does. However, contaminants do collect in the oil regardless of syn or conventional, as this is due to the mechanical condition of the engine/and or operating envioronment/ maintenace habits to begin with.

 

Even conventional oil by today's standards far exceed the standoards for oil at the time of manufacture for these engines. Current standard for conventional oil is actually a semi synthetic oil, and for example, in 2000 and later toyotas, the drain schedule is 6 mo and 5000 mi with 5w30

 

I was very conscientious about the pcv changed it regularly.  The coolant prob every 5 years. Got lots of pics of the heads and block so you can see the condition for yourself.

 

http://www.ultimates...irst/?p=1239480



#22 coxy

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 05:01 AM

Oils firstly the first figure is basically the oil viscosity when Cold. Too high a number and the starter will work too hard turning the engine over.

 

The second figure is basically the oil viscosity when at running temperature, The reason there are variations relate to the ambient temperature as Loyal said in a hotter climate the oil gets thinner so you go to say a 20 W 50 for places like Australia or Honduras or probably Florida or Texas I would use a 20W50 for an EA 81 oe EA 82.

 

Later engines need lighter Oils because the ring packs are Low Tension compared to an EA 81 or EA 82 Engine all in a quest for lower friction and that ball Important Fuel Consumption Sticker on the Windscreen, The Low Tension Oil and Compression Rings in later Subaru's are what has landed them a Lawsuit in Jersey, Excess Oil Consumption.

 

Excess Oil Consumption is a much more common problem on any Late Model Engine with Low Tension Ring packs, especially if people baby the engine when new.

 

Low Tension Oil rings and taking it easy running in a new late model motor WILL result in OIl consumption issues and low power due to the fact the Rings will not have bedded in to give a good seal and compression at factory spec, Conversly after running it in Hard it will use far less Oil and make more power.

 

The only thing that needs a conventional bedding in procedure are the plain bearings at the Crankshaft and that will only take about 100 Miles to get a good working surface on the bearings, After that do not lug it do not rev it to redline but most importantly load it up say third gear full throttle from 40 to 80 mph and let the temperature stabilize after doing that a few times then repeat  and after a couple of Hours the rings will be bedded nicely to the bore.

 

I do it all the time at Work Running in Engines for race-bikes as well as any number of Bigger sports bikes increasingly for customers.(Ever Tried to load up something like a S1000RR BMW on the road), 180 HP Plus and no weight makes them very hard to load up effectively to really bed the rings in so that plus Licence Retention is why we are running in more and more Big Sports Bikes for Customers.



#23 MilesFox

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 06:48 AM

Might i ask what blend of brand of synthetic oil were you using?

 

I was very conscientious about the pcv changed it regularly.  The coolant prob every 5 years. Got lots of pics of the heads and block so you can see the condition for yourself.

 

http://www.ultimates...irst/?p=1239480

Which brand or blend of Syn were you using?



#24 MilesFox

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 06:51 AM

Thank you Coxy, as you information correletes with 'energy conserving' oil and the use of 5w30 in later engines. In your opinion, should 5w30 be continued, or moved to a heavier weight for the low tension rings pack engines?



#25 MR_Loyale

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Posted 20 July 2014 - 09:29 AM

Might i ask what blend of brand of synthetic oil were you using?

 

Which brand or blend of Syn were you using?

 

Castrol.






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