grandam88 Posted August 26, 2015 Share Posted August 26, 2015 1987 Ea82 Spfi GL Wagon. I like most people who own an EA82 have the failed Solenoids. I also have the codes to go with it. I have disconnected the solenoids, but I yet to have replaced them with new ones or resistors. I know these solenoids have a function and after reviewing diagrams in the FSM, it seems at least the Canister Purge Solenoid can effect the operation of the fuel system. I am aware you can just bypass the EGR with little side affects. What should I do with the hoses connected to the canister solenoid once i replace it with a resistor? It seems the gas fumes are returned to the fuel tank after being put through some sort of separator. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihscout54 Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 (edited) IIRC they are there for warm up drivability. You will survive with them bypassed, and replaced with resistors, as many of us have. Pretty sure I used grey 2 watt 33 ohm resistors. I currently am running working junk yard units. Ive read the old style Toyota solenoids work but they have smaller ports. Just replace the solenoids with a straight fitting. Edited August 27, 2015 by ihscout54 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveT Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 There are a few threads about how to use Toyota solenoids. As far as I know, I'm the originator of the mod. I am still using the same Toyota solenoids I bought from a junkyard in 1989. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandam88 Posted August 27, 2015 Author Share Posted August 27, 2015 I have read your posts about it, I have also read a webpage about it also. I believe it was your, not sure. Do you know what years and models I should be looking at for the solenoids? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveT Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 They were from about the same time period as the subarus. Most likely corollas. They were (probably still are) used in most cars from then on. I also used then from a random Honda. This reminds me, I'm going to have to find a new place to put my Web pages, since the is no longer is going to provide them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihscout54 Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 The problem with hunting for them is figuring out what you need. Normally open/closed etc. i have a bunch of these types of solenoids I use for various operations. I am a believer in having them operational, but you can simply bypass them with a piece of hose and see if you notice any issues. If it works out then get some resistors. You dont even have to remove the solenoid. Or get some hitachis or toyota solenoids from the boneyard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihscout54 Posted August 27, 2015 Share Posted August 27, 2015 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grandam88 Posted August 28, 2015 Author Share Posted August 28, 2015 Thanks for the advice. I will probably end up putting up with the check engine light for a while until I can get to a junk yard in the area. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SourKraut412 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 I also have the EGR light on...new to this rig (86 Brat) - still learning and collecting the various manuals, etc. So, does a failed EGR solenoid throw the same code(s) as a bad valve or would they be different? If so, I'll figure out how to pull the codes from the ECU as I read that procedure somewhere on here. The PO said they changed the valve, but the code is still there...wondering if it's the solenoid or if the PO didn't actually replace the valve. I unplugged the battery thinking it might clear it out and it's still there, not sure if that's even the proper way on these cars but it was worth a try. I tried a search on here, but it's not super easy to find results with a 3-letter word. Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
l75eya Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 If the brat is anything like my old GL, there is no computer. That EGR light is there as a service reminder. It doesn't mean anything is wrong it comes on every 30k miles to remind you to service (inspect, clean) the valve. There should be two same color unhooked connectors one male one female under the dash, you connect them to clear it. This doesn't apply to the fuel injected cars like the OP has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveT Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 And to avoid possible future confusion, I'll add that if you do have a SPFI, the ECU error for those solenoids is only checking that the coil is there. It has no way to know if the EGR valve itself is even connected. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naru Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 I also have the EGR light on...new to this rig (86 Brat) - still learning and collecting the various manuals, etc. So, does a failed EGR solenoid throw the same code(s) as a bad valve or would they be different? If so, I'll figure out how to pull the codes from the ECU as I read that procedure somewhere on here. The PO said they changed the valve, but the code is still there...wondering if it's the solenoid or if the PO didn't actually replace the valve. I unplugged the battery thinking it might clear it out and it's still there, not sure if that's even the proper way on these cars but it was worth a try. I tried a search on here, but it's not super easy to find results with a 3-letter word. Cheers Brats do not have EGR solenoids even if they are equipped w/engine computers. It is not possible to have an EGR code on a Brat. The light is a service reminder,as mentioned. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naru Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 The problem with hunting for them is figuring out what you need. Normally open/closed etc. i have a bunch of these types of solenoids I use for various operations. I am a believer in having them operational, but you can simply bypass them with a piece of hose and see if you notice any issues. If it works out then get some resistors. You dont even have to remove the solenoid. Or get some hitachis or toyota solenoids from the boneyard. I think the size of the bleed orfice varies too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naru Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 IIRC they are there for warm up drivability. You will survive with them bypassed, and replaced with resistors, as many of us have. Pretty sure I used grey 2 watt 33 ohm resistors. I currently am running working junk yard units. Ive read the old style Toyota solenoids work but they have smaller ports. Just replace the solenoids with a straight fitting. Neither one is there for warm up drivability. In fact,they are both disabled until the car warms up. Purge solenoid is there to control evaporative emissions. It merely purges the charcoal cannister of adsorbed gasoline at the appropiate time so it can adsorb more later. Nothing to lose from deleting it(except more evaporative emissions). I`d keep the EGR though. If you do delete them,plug the lines rather than connecting them w/a straight fitting or else you will be purging and EGRing all the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihscout54 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Neither one is there for warm up drivability. In fact,they are both disabled until the car warms up. You misunderstood, the solenoids are there only for warm up drive-ability. Hence why they are disabled during cold operation. There is a chance that they are closed at wot or something silly like that but the vac signal to them would be so low it wouldn't matter. This tech is very common. I suggested the OP bypass the solenoids themselves with hose and live with the slight cold operation issues this will cause.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SourKraut412 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 All good info, thanks for the replies. I did forget to mention that I ran a couple tests per the Haynes, warming up and reving engine to see if the valve opens and then pressure testing with a vacuum pump. Neither opened my EGR, so I still have my suspicions that it is bad. Good to know there aren't other components that would cause it not to work unless I've misunderstood something. I'd prefer it to operate correctly even if it won't hurt anything if it's deleted, but seems like there are conflicting opinions on both sides of that argument. Anyway, I had to order a bunch of odds and ends from Rock Auto and found a closeout EGR for like $12, so I figured I'd give it a try since it was a minimal risk for the cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 (edited) naru - my factory manuals for early 85 86 claims EGR not operational until at op temp, nor is it operational or supposed to be above was it 28 mph ? Though, depending ondiffering world markets for these Subes, there are differing conditions when and when not the EGR works. Looks like EGR in most of our markets is for use in built up areas of low speeds. Not picking on you but wondering where you get your understanding that EGR not operate until car warms up ? I am all for the canister to be working properly and would prefer to try see how car ran with solenoid bypassed so cannister was evaporating more often, than not. There are so many cars with solenoid air vacuum control about, should not be hard to find one with similar operation from most Japanese cars. I think the egr one lets the EGR side bleed to atmosphere when switched off, no idea why it needs to bleed off though ? I used a similar from a carby EA82 inlet for my EA82T EGR, fixed the code iscout types faster Edited September 8, 2015 by jono Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihscout54 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 I also have the EGR light on...new to this rig (86 Brat) - still learning and collecting the various manuals, etc. So, does a failed EGR solenoid throw the same code(s) as a bad valve or would they be different? If so, I'll figure out how to pull the codes from the ECU as I read that procedure somewhere on here. The PO said they changed the valve, but the code is still there...wondering if it's the solenoid or if the PO didn't actually replace the valve. I unplugged the battery thinking it might clear it out and it's still there, not sure if that's even the proper way on these cars but it was worth a try. I tried a search on here, but it's not super easy to find results with a 3-letter word. Cheers The light on your dash should read ECS, and there are codes for this system. It is more complex to read them than on the OP's car. Im guessing your carbed (stock) Very few things set codes on the feedback cars, temp sender, control solenoids, an open circuit to the O2 sensor, etc. That system doesnt self diagnose well. Do you have to pass an emissions inspection? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SourKraut412 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Do you have to pass an emissions inspection? Nope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihscout54 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 (edited) I think the egr one lets the EGR side bleed to atmosphere when switched off, no idea why it needs to bleed off though ? I used a similar from a carby EA82 inlet for my EA82T EGR, fixed the code Interesting! Never took time to think about it. This done is so the EFR valve isnt held open, under vacuum, when the solenoid closes. Thats likely proof that the solenoid is there for more than just a warm up aid. I never noticed mention in the manual of it being closed under 28 MPH. Since stop and go type driving is not ideal for the fuel mixtures that the EGR makes best use of, its really most effective for highway or cruise driving. For something like putting around off road, switching it off and adjusting the fuel and timing may have real world benefit (not just emissions). I didnt notice much when I had the EGR routed directly to a vac port. When I get time Ill look through my manual and see what I can find on it. Edited September 8, 2015 by ihscout54 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ihscout54 Posted September 8, 2015 Share Posted September 8, 2015 Nope. You should start a new thread, with full details. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naru Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 naru - my factory manuals for early 85 86 claims EGR not operational until at op temp, . Not picking on you but wondering where you get your understanding that EGR not operate until car warms up ? my factory manuals for early 85 86 claims EGR not operational until at op temp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naru Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 I think the egr one lets the EGR side bleed to atmosphere when switched off, no idea why it needs to bleed off though ? If there was no bleed,the solenoid would not be able to command the egr valve closed. Vacuum would be trapped, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jono Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 aha, they have to breathe for some reason - and that looks like it makes sense. Naru, you say your manuals - factory manuals or someone elses ? cos my factory manuals have about three or four different EGR operation 'phases' depending on markets or aspiration method. I think there are two speeds that the EGR is meant to cut out depending on type or country. And as I have said somewhere befroe, found my EGR worked no matter op temp or car speed despite the ECU control is said to have. Higher engine or car speeds may be what helps keep it all nice and clean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rdweninger Posted September 9, 2015 Share Posted September 9, 2015 But, to get the EGR light to turn off.... under left knee panel, you may have to pull the fuse box. Look for a blue connector plugged into another connector. Nearby, you will see a green connector not plugged into anything. Unplug blue and plug in green. Light will go off. Run for another 60,000 miles. Or vice versa depending on who plugged what last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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