Legacy777 Posted June 6, 2004 Share Posted June 6, 2004 My compressor crapped out, and I put a used one in and redid everything. Well it doesn't really seem to be cooling quite as well as the original did. I think it either could be that I don't have enough refrigerant in it. Or I almost suspect there may be air in the system. I don't think the guy pulled a vacuum on the system long enough. But anyway. What I'm looking for is what others are seeing in the siteglass on the receiver/dryer. Mine sort of looks like a foamy mixture. I can see it speed up when I blip the throttle. However the way it should be is that I don't see hardly any bubbles, and maybe see a few when you blip the throttle. I don't know if I'm just looking at the siteglass wrong.....and that it's just normal.....or if it is a foamy mixture. If it is actually a foamy mixture. It's either low on refrigerant.....or there's air in the system. Anyone have any suggestions..... here's some pics of the site glass http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8080/subaru/images/acsiteglass1.jpg http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8080/subaru/images/acsiteglass2.jpg http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8080/subaru/images/acsiteglass3.jpg Also got a set of gauges. With the a/c on full fan & max a/c. The low side is around 30 psi, & the high side is around 215 psi. I should note....this was an R12 system that had been converted to 134a over a year ago. It was working great, besides the fact that the compressor crapped out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strakes Posted June 7, 2004 Share Posted June 7, 2004 My wife's car is still R12 and my observation on my wife's 93 Legacy site glass is crystal clear with the engine running, and the a/c on. Blip the throttle and rev the engine...maybe a 2 or 3 tiny bubbles appear momentarily and then the site glass goes clear again. The a/c in this car has been running great. It doesn't look anything like those pictures of yours, so I think that you are right and that you're looking at a lot of foam. Ouch, my parents live in hot Houston ...not a great place to lose your a/c, good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenSisters Posted June 7, 2004 Share Posted June 7, 2004 It should be clear. You either have air or, more likely, an under charged system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbrand Posted June 7, 2004 Share Posted June 7, 2004 The guy that vacced and recharged mine said it is normal to see some foam on the converted systems as there is less R134 than there was R12 in the system, I will look at sight glass on mine tommorroow and compare to pix, has run 2000 plus miles since changing the compressor and is still cooling great. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SevenSisters Posted June 7, 2004 Share Posted June 7, 2004 I didn't read down past the pics and didn't know it was a 134 retro. Don't know about them. Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted June 7, 2004 Author Share Posted June 7, 2004 Thanks for the feedback guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbrand Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Thanks for the feedback guys. jOSH, i FINALLY GOT OUT TO LOOK AT MY lEGACY SIGHT GLASS(THE CAR IS MY wife CAR) iT LOOKS PRETTY MUCH LIKE YOUR PICS, ON AN OLD r12 CAR WE WOULD SAY IT IS READY FOR A CAN OR 2. bUT IT WAS CHARGED TO SPEC AND IS COOLING GREAT........ GLENN Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
f15xxx Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 triple7, generally a conversion uses 70-75% of the amount of r-12 previously used. don't fill to the same capacity, it will be too much. i'd say that not only is there not enough r134a in there, but there is probably some air in there too. just let an a/c monkey do the vac and fill. btw, how new is your receiver/dryer? i hate giving advice to a captain, just say so if it is out of line:) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nug Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 I'm a little concerned by the fact that it looks 'milky'. I'm not sure I've seen that before. Could be contamination of some sort. Did different refrigerant oils get mixed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sea#3 Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Legacy777 You say you replaced the compressor. Did you drain the old oil out and refill it with PAG or Ester oil? The manual states that you drain the oil from the old compressor in to a container, measure the amount of oil. Drain the replacement compressor and add new oil (Pag or Ester oil) in the amount that came out of the old compressor. Also did you replace the receiver/dryer? It looks as if there may be to much oil and /or water in the system (It should be clear R-12 or R134a) The only way to get the water out of the system is to change the receiver/dryer And vacuum the system for at least 45 min to an hour The pressures look about normal for the low side but the high side may be a bit high, but that’s hard to say without knowing the ambient temperature and humidity Sea#3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted June 11, 2004 Author Share Posted June 11, 2004 triple7, generally a conversion uses 70-75% of the amount of r-12 previously used. don't fill to the same capacity, it will be too much. i'd say that not only is there not enough r134a in there, but there is probably some air in there too. just let an a/c monkey do the vac and fill. btw, how new is your receiver/dryer? i hate giving advice to a captain, just say so if it is out of line:) I used about 75-80% of the original r12 amount. The receiver/dryer is brand new. It's cooling fine....I added a little more r134a. I'm probably just going to leave it alone unless I have problems. I let a guy pull the vac & fill last time....that's sort of why I'm at where I'm at. If I do it again....I'll do it myself to know it's done 100% correct. Don't feel out of line....I asked for the help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted June 11, 2004 Author Share Posted June 11, 2004 I'm a little concerned by the fact that it looks 'milky'. I'm not sure I've seen that before. Could be contamination of some sort. Did different refrigerant oils get mixed? I previously converted it to 134a & used esther oil. I used the same brand of esther oil this time as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted June 11, 2004 Author Share Posted June 11, 2004 Legacy777You say you replaced the compressor. Did you drain the old oil out and refill it with PAG or Ester oil? The manual states that you drain the oil from the old compressor in to a container, measure the amount of oil. Drain the replacement compressor and add new oil (Pag or Ester oil) in the amount that came out of the old compressor. Also did you replace the receiver/dryer? It looks as if there may be to much oil and /or water in the system (It should be clear R-12 or R134a) The only way to get the water out of the system is to change the receiver/dryer And vacuum the system for at least 45 min to an hour The pressures look about normal for the low side but the high side may be a bit high, but that’s hard to say without knowing the ambient temperature and humidity Sea#3 I opened up the used compressor I put in.....it was pretty much bone dry. I added the specified amount of esther oil per the what the haynes a/c manual stated my system required. I did the same thing before. Yes I replaced the receiver/dryer. Let's say I have too much oil and/or water in the system.....is there any damage that could happen.....or just not as good cooling efficiency. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
99obw Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 When I put the new compressor on the outback I had too much oil in it at first. It would cycle on and off rather quickly, so cooling was poor, but the low side pressure was fine. I think it is pretty hard on the compressor to have too much oil in it. I let the refrigerant out of the system and a lot of oil came out with it. I have no idea how much oil is in there now, probably too much still, but it cools decent and no black death or compressor noise so far. I don't think all of the oil stays in the compressor, so adding the total system amount to the new compressor would probably result in too much oil in the system. The only way I know to get the oil out so you can start with a clean slate is to flush the entire system with solvent. Water in the system can freeze up, causing intermittent operation. If you replaced the receiver/dryer the new dessicant should absorb any moisture, especially considering the fact that you had it vacuumed. When I put the compressor on the outback I did everything wrong, I didn't have a vacuum pump so it wasn't vacuumed, and I didn't put a new receiver/dryer on it. It is cooling pretty good now so I am going to leave it alone until it gives me problems. I am in a much cooler climate so the A/C can be less than perfect. You probably require full cooling capacity in Texas. Needless to say I know just enough to be dangerous with this A/C stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted June 11, 2004 Author Share Posted June 11, 2004 I flushed the entire a/c system out with a/c system cleaner before doing anything.....so the amount of oil I put should be pretty accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
99obw Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 Hmmm. How did you measure the amount of refrigerant that you added? I remember reading somewhere that the system won't be as cold if either you have too little or too much refrigerant. I can't remember where I read that though. I do have a book on the subject, perpahs I will look it up if I get time. The outback is a little undercharged according to the low-side gauge I have and it is as cold as it has ever been. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted June 11, 2004 Author Share Posted June 11, 2004 system calls for around 1.8-2.0 lbs of R12 refrigerant. 75-80% of that amount is 1.35-1.6 lbs of R134a. Two 12oz cans equals 24 oz of 134a. There's 16 oz in 1lb. 24 oz is 1.5 lbs. Since you really won't get all of the 134a out of the can.....I put in 2 cans and just recently added a touch more from a third can. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avk Posted June 11, 2004 Share Posted June 11, 2004 That's right, the refrigerant stops flowing out of the can once the pressure inside equals the system pressure. I just thought a way to go about that might be to use a scale and weigh the can before and after charging. Then you'd know how much went in. A cheap kitchen scale would do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted June 12, 2004 Author Share Posted June 12, 2004 that's actually what the fsm says to do....weight it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avk Posted June 12, 2004 Share Posted June 12, 2004 Does your manual say to weigh the can? Mine only says to use the scale when charging from a 30-lb cylinder. And then I thought, look, you can weigh the can too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sea#3 Posted June 13, 2004 Share Posted June 13, 2004 I opened up the used compressor I put in.....it was pretty much bone dry. I added the specified amount of esther oil per the what the haynes a/c manual stated my system required. I did the same thing before. Yes I replaced the receiver/dryer. Let's say I have too much oil and/or water in the system.....is there any damage that could happen.....or just not as good cooling efficiency. It shouldn't damage anything, but if there is too much oil in the system it will affect the cooling ability. The oil will tend to glob up and hinder the evaporator valves ability to do its job SEA#3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted June 14, 2004 Author Share Posted June 14, 2004 thanks sea, I'll see how things work. If it really looks like things aren't working well. I'll redo it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger83 Posted June 18, 2004 Share Posted June 18, 2004 Did you check the temp of the output air? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted June 18, 2004 Author Share Posted June 18, 2004 I haven't checked it recently.....don't have a thermometer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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