steve56 Posted September 20, 2016 Share Posted September 20, 2016 While RandR timing belts on Subaru engines I'm always struggling to get the toothed idler pulley back in. There never seems to be quite enough slack in the Tbelt . I can fight it for a hour, walk away, come back and somtimes it goes right on or not. Ive done enough belts that I know this has got to be a common problem. Have no idea what the solution is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazyeights Posted September 20, 2016 Share Posted September 20, 2016 Try leaving the smooth idler off until the belt is installed and lined up, then put the smooth idler on last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fairtax4me Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 Tensioner should go on last. If you can't get the tensioner on the belt isn't set right. Get the belt on right, marks all lined up and the tensioner drops right into place. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 i do what crazy 8's and fairtax said - leave the lower idler off or tensioner off until the belt is installed. I've done the lower toothed idler plenty of times earlier on and it was as you've said - it can work but is cumbersome and prone to stripping the pulley only threads. I still encounter variance - some are easier than others - probably dohc, sohc, phase I and phase II differences? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve56 Posted September 21, 2016 Author Share Posted September 21, 2016 i do what crazy 8's and fairtax said - leave the lower idler off or tensioner off until the belt is installed. I've done the lower toothed idler plenty of times earlier on and it was as you've said - it can work but is cumbersome and prone to stripping the pulley only threads. I still encounter variance - some are easier than others - probably dohc, sohc, phase I and phase II differences? i do what crazy 8's and fairtax said - leave the lower idler off or tensioner off until the belt is installed. I've done the lower toothed idler plenty of times earlier on and it was as you've said - it can work but is cumbersome and prone to stripping the pulley only threads. I still encounter variance - some are easier than others - probably dohc, sohc, phase I and phase II differences I do put the lower smooth idler on last and the toothed idler on second to last. I haven't put the the tensioner on last in a long time. That always seemed like a recipe for a stripped tensioner bolt hole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartless Posted September 21, 2016 Share Posted September 21, 2016 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve56 Posted September 23, 2016 Author Share Posted September 23, 2016 timingbeltdiagram.jpg I do put the lower smooth idler pulley on last. That on goes on easily. Its the toothed idler that goes on next to last thats the problem. There never seems to be enough t-belt left after it goes around the water pump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartless Posted September 23, 2016 Share Posted September 23, 2016 when I do mine, the toothed idler pulley is already in place before i install the belt. in fact, ALL pulleys except the one smooth idler are in place before the belt goes on. I typically start with the passenger side cam pulley - using a spring clamp to hold it in position, then i feed it across the upper end to the drivers side cam pulley, taking care to keep it tight and making sure the marks line up correctly, then water pump and toothed idler... then install that last smooth idler. I have only had a hard time getting that last idler in place once - it seemed like the belt was just a hair too short, making it difficult to get the bolt started, but i did get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve56 Posted September 24, 2016 Author Share Posted September 24, 2016 when I do mine, the toothed idler pulley is already in place before i install the belt. in fact, ALL pulleys except the one smooth idler are in place before the belt goes on. I typically start with the passenger side cam pulley - using a spring clamp to hold it in position, then i feed it across the upper end to the drivers side cam pulley, taking care to keep it tight and making sure the marks line up correctly, then water pump and toothed idler... then install that last smooth idler. I have only had a hard time getting that last idler in place once - it seemed like the belt was just a hair too short, making it difficult to get the bolt started, but i did get it. Your able to get t-belt around tensioner, water pump and toothe pulley, by only haveing the lower smooth idler pulley off. Ive never seen a manual or youtube video of that proceedure. I would really like to learn that method. If you have any documentation of that, please post it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartless Posted September 27, 2016 Share Posted September 27, 2016 what's to learn? Put all pulleys in place except that last smooth idler - tensioner properly compressed and pinned, all bolts properly torqued. Thread the belt across the upper section, lining up the marks on the belt with the correct marks on the pulleys as you go. Thread over the water pump and under toothed idler as a pair - yes, it is tight, but it can be done*. Just make sure the belt does not slip from position on the cam pulleys (small spring clamps are very helpful here - clamp the belt in place on the cam pulleys). Install last idler pulley and torque to spec. Verify everything is in the correct positions before pulling the pin on the tensioner. Done. * start just the edge of the belt around both pulleys - about 1/4 inch worth - pull the slack from passenger side and line up on the edge of the toothed pulley first, then push the belt up over the waterpump pulley, once the edges are started over both pulleys, simply push the belt fully into place. these two have to be done as a pair or it wont work. I am not saying it is easy to get both started, but this is the easiest way I have found to install the belt around these pulleys. I have tried installing the toothed idler after the belt is over the water pump and had a heck of a time getting the bolt started correctly - as you have also found out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve56 Posted September 27, 2016 Author Share Posted September 27, 2016 what's to learn? Put all pulleys in place except that last smooth idler - tensioner properly compressed and pinned, all bolts properly torqued. Thread the belt across the upper section, lining up the marks on the belt with the correct marks on the pulleys as you go. Thread over the water pump and under toothed idler as a pair - yes, it is tight, but it can be done*. Just make sure the belt does not slip from position on the cam pulleys (small spring clamps are very helpful here - clamp the belt in place on the cam pulleys). Install last idler pulley and torque to spec. Verify everything is in the correct positions before pulling the pin on the tensioner. Done. * start just the edge of the belt around both pulleys - about 1/4 inch worth - pull the slack from passenger side and line up on the edge of the toothed pulley first, then push the belt up over the waterpump pulley, once the edges are started over both pulleys, simply push the belt fully into place. these two have to be done as a pair or it wont work. I am not saying it is easy to get both started, but this is the easiest way I have found to install the belt around these pulleys. I have tried installing the toothed idler after the belt is over the water pump and had a heck of a time getting the bolt started correctly - as you have also found out. Thanks fo taking the time to do a comprehensive explanation of the procedure. I will use it i on next T-belt. Ive never seen any Subaru T-bellt done without either putting the lower toothed and smooth pulleys or the tensioner back on after the t-belt was installed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heartless Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 I have owned multiple Subaru's since 2000 and have tried all sorts of different methods. This one works for me. Don't go into it thinking it is going to be a cinch, it isn't, but it is easier than trying to get that darn toothed idler to bolt up straight over the belt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve56 Posted September 28, 2016 Author Share Posted September 28, 2016 I have owned multiple Subaru's since 2000 and have tried all sorts of different methods. This one works for me. Don't go into it thinking it is going to be a cinch, it isn't, but it is easier than trying to get that darn toothed idler to bolt up straight over the belt. Yes, I've been fighting that toothed idler pulley for years. The strange thing is I've just walked away, come back, and it goes right on. Have done many engine swaps and head gaskets, but r and r of the t-belt always gives me trouble.The problem makes no logical sense to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bratman2 Posted September 28, 2016 Share Posted September 28, 2016 Thinking it's a cinch was my first mistake on my wife's 2011 Forester XT. That is the toughest timing belt I have ever installed. Glad it isn't due for another 105k, lol! Anyways, I installed the smooth idler last, though it took a couple of hard fought attempts! Will probably have to do my daughter's 2010 Impreza before next year is out. Hope being it doesn't have double overhead cams will make it a touch easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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