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Cracked head or HG?

92 Loyale HG Coolant leak Overheating Cracked head Coolant loss Heda Gusket

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23 replies to this topic

#1 somick

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Posted 23 October 2017 - 09:39 AM

92 Loyale with 187K. 2WD.

 

Is there a way to guess if this is just a blown Head Gasket or a cracked head?

 

The car has been losing coolant for a couple of years.  Now the temperature started rising. I introduced compressed air in all the cylinders at TDC.  At the cylinder #2 the coolant started leaking from the radiator.

 

I am a fairly conservative driver, drive around the town and do not rev the engine. 

 

What do you guys think?

 

Regard,

Sam



#2 DaveT

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Posted 23 October 2017 - 10:16 AM

Most likely head gasket.

By this age and milage kind of due. Also, any over normal temperature while low on coolant leads to and accelerates the failure.

#3 DaveT

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Posted 23 October 2017 - 10:17 AM

Revving the engine has nothing to do with it. They are made to spin fast, not lug.

#4 somick

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Posted 23 October 2017 - 11:44 AM

Most likely head gasket.

By this age and milage kind of due. Also, any over normal temperature while low on coolant leads to and accelerates the failure.

Thank you Dave.

 

I am still debating whether to do the HG job or just dump it.

 

I will see how much the junk yard will give me for it.

 

Thanks,

Sam



#5 idosubaru

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Posted 23 October 2017 - 01:42 PM

Probably just the headgasket from the brief info you told us. A nonturbo daily driver that isn’t significantly overheated and has head issues is almost always just a headgasket. I know it happens but I’ve never seen a non turbo crack a head.

You can drop the exhaust manifold and look for coolant up in the exhaust ports of the heads. EA82s crack through the water jacket and into the exhaust where you’ll see coolant in the exhaust ports of the heads.

When you drop the manifold pressurize the cylinder again and look into the exhaust ports.

Edited by idosubaru, 23 October 2017 - 01:44 PM.


#6 idosubaru

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Posted 23 October 2017 - 01:47 PM

They’re actually pretty easy to do in the vehicle. I wouldn’t even think about pulling an EA82 for just a headgasket, they’re too easy.

Remove two lower 14mm engine mount nuts and top mounts and jack the side of the engine up that you’re working on. Plenty of room and if you have electric or air tools you can get all the bolts out easy. You can have the head off before you’d ever have the engine out.

Swap on another head or resurface that one with a new gasket and call it good.

#7 ferp420

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Posted 23 October 2017 - 07:59 PM

All the heads crack on these rigs on almost every aluminum head ive ever pulled had some kind of crack but very rearly they do they ever crack through unless its a turdbo head gaskets are cheap get some sand paper and have at its its all very easy ive changed a head gasket in a half hour on this rig the hardest part about th3 hole job is geting rid of those stupid timing belt covers

#8 DaveT

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Posted 23 October 2017 - 09:30 PM

Another tip to make it easier.. run it or use heaters to get the entire engine to normal operating temperature, and then carefully loosen all the bolts. Intake are notorious for being stuck and snapping if you try to do it cold. Hot block also helps with head bolts.

#9 somick

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Posted 24 October 2017 - 10:29 AM

Thanks for the encouragement.  I will probably take on this job if I cannot get rid of the car :)

 

Any recommendations on the decent HG brand?

 

Sam 



#10 wagons

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Posted 24 October 2017 - 10:34 AM

Felpro permatorque for gaskets. Use only Subaru intake Manifold gaskets and cam tower o rings. Easy job make sure engine is warmed up to avoid breaking bolts like I did

#11 somick

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Posted 24 October 2017 - 10:59 AM

Thank you wagons so much!

 

Sam



#12 idosubaru

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Posted 24 October 2017 - 01:41 PM

I would use Subaru headsgasket but I have used Fel Pros before on those engines. I haven’t done enough engines or miles to know if it matters.

Subaru for intake manifold for sure.

Cam tower orings - are metal reinforced, get them from Subaru as well.

#13 wagons

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Posted 24 October 2017 - 08:02 PM

Best part of felpro permatorque is no need for retorque. I'd replace all the head bolts. They are $2.40 a piece. For less than $44 it's good insurance to make sure a head does not lift. Also if you do the headbolts, grind slots in an old bolt to make a thread chaser. Finding a thread chaser is next to impossible for a Subaru thread

#14 idosubaru

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Posted 24 October 2017 - 09:36 PM

I’ve almost always used Fel Pros in the past as well for the same reason. I’ve heard others shy away from them though not sure why and maybe failures cracked abuses or sloppily installed. I wouldn’t hesitate to use them again, I even have a set in my garage. Lol.

#15 XHighOctanex

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Posted 25 October 2017 - 12:13 AM

I've had my permatorque up to 260 a couple and 240 cruising a few more times and it still runs like a champ, no coolant loss whatsoever.

#16 ferp420

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Posted 25 October 2017 - 11:55 AM

Dont use the v1 copper gaskets they dident hold for snot v2 will be multi layered ringed gaskets kinda pointless if you ask me though these engines arent strongenuff to need a head gasket like that thats why im the only one that makes them the felpro are very good gaekets just thick

#17 somick

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 11:06 AM

Thanks.

 

I am still not sure if I want to do it.

 

Did not realize that I have to spend extra for cleaning/milling the heads.  I am pretty sure that if I do it myself I will kill the good heads.

 

Sam



#18 idosubaru

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 11:13 AM

you can do it yourself, it's actually really easy. 

 

http://www.ultimates...hop-techniques/



#19 Gloyale

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 11:48 AM



you can have the head off before you’d ever have the engine out.

 

 

that's crazy.

 

No way.  All the same stuff has to be unbolted.  

 

Alt, PS pump, AC if it has it, gotta pull exhaust, intake, EGR pipe on pass side head, etc.......

 

for 4 more bolts you can pull the engine.  Put it on a stand, and securely and easily work on the whole engine all around.

 

Engine pull takes 45 mins.  Getting all that stuff off and then getting one of the heads off......an hour an half at least.

 

I don't ever do HGs in car.  Too important of a job to have the partial access for inspection, cleaning, and careful reassembly.


Edited by Gloyale, 26 October 2017 - 11:50 AM.


#20 DaveT

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 12:14 PM

I always redo an engine, them swap it in. Much better access to everything with the engine on a stand. But I have spares and the space. I did them in car once.

#21 idosubaru

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 12:24 PM

Engine pull takes 45 mins. 

 

well i agree to an extent. 

 

it's not just removing 4 more bolts - it's 4 more bell housing bolts and the starter, engine mount nuts, (one additional lower front mount for XT6's), torque converter bolts if equipped, and setting up the engine hoist, chain lengths/load leveler, and separating.  all that is extra work, equipment and time. 

 

I do agree - it's easier in some ways and i typically pull, but then again I don't do EA/ER stuff any more since it's all rusted away out here.  but if i had some compelling reason like some people do, no space, no lift, etc -  i wouldn't hesitate to do it without an engine lift either. 

 

i guess if i did it more often and came up with a consistent set up i could pull it off in an hour or less, but it just never happens - setting up the stand, chain length/leveler, supporting the trans and hoping the lower nuts and engine mount nuts aren't rusty, etc. 



#22 ferp420

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 03:05 PM

The 4" lift makes life alot easyer i just pull the intake and one side of the exhaust and i think there are 2 accesory bolts then pull the lift block i have littleraly had the old head gasket off and a new one on and running in 30 min but i knew my heads were straight and my intake gaskets are all reusable except the headgasket and there werent any bolt issues i was kinda undernthe gun so went as fast as i could

#23 ferp420

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Posted 26 October 2017 - 03:07 PM

At one point i was making my own headgaskets and experamenting with them so i pulled my heads about 15 times in a row

#24 jono

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Posted 27 October 2017 - 02:00 AM

IgoSubaru Hgs every time, as I found upon retorque, they never take it. Subaru workshop tells me they never have cars back for retorque, they slap 'em on, start em up, drive 'em out


Edited by jono, 27 October 2017 - 02:00 AM.






Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: 92 Loyale, HG, Coolant leak, Overheating, Cracked head, Coolant loss, Heda Gusket

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