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Guest Message by DevFuse
 

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Subaru 4WD Sand Rail


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12 replies to this topic

#1 Sooby Doo

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Posted 14 August 2004 - 02:23 PM

Here is the deal I picked up another set of 81 Hi/Lo running gear and was considering building a 4wd tube chassis wheeler. Mostly for the sand and some dirt action. I have only seen one picture in the gallery that is similar to the idea, but I'm sure with all the subarus out there that some others have done this. Just looking for ideas.
http://www.ultimates...o.php?photo=445

#2 P K

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Posted 14 August 2004 - 04:25 PM

I have had similar thoughts, with the only concern being the front tires throwing dirt and sand in your face and every nook and cranny it could.

Then also, most of the weight is up front so steering in sand will be heavy versus a rear engine setup and skinny front tires.

Still intriguing though - think of designing it like a giant quad with fenders and paddles on all four corners.

#3 subarubrat

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Posted 14 August 2004 - 06:03 PM

goggles

#4 bushbasher

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Posted 14 August 2004 - 06:09 PM

if you put vw portal hubs on all ends of the suspension you could put the engine in the back with the motor facing rearward, and put the rear diff up front. The portal hubs are only 2 gears and would reverse the direction :brow:

#5 Zefy

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Posted 14 August 2004 - 08:11 PM

i wanted something of the sort too but up here we have a lack of sand...:rolleyes:


but anyway... i did some research and found this site... you should all check it out...

http://www.rhinobugg...om.au/index.htm

they make good stuff and you can buy a copy of plans from them...

enjoy!

#6 Sooby Doo

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 12:58 AM

if you put vw portal hubs on all ends of the suspension you could put the engine in the back with the motor facing rearward, and put the rear diff up front. The portal hubs are only 2 gears and would reverse the direction :brow:

Explain more, I'm interested in the idea but don't quite follow you yet. If anything I'm interested in the portal hubs. I've heard someother comments about them. Is there a link you might know about.

#7 All_talk

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 11:59 AM

I’ve been thinking/working with the VW reduction box (that’s what VW calls them) idea for a few years now. The rear could be adapted without to much fuss (custom arms, hubs, brakes and axels), but the front is the real challenge, you have to create a portal “spindle” so you can turn. You could avoid this problem by mounting the portals inboard on the transaxle and differential, but you would loose the added ground clearance they can give you, and might create some wheelbase issues. Not to mention the reverse torque reaction you get with portals on a trailing arm rear suspension can be tricky to drive (rear end raises on heave throttle). The best drive gear for a rear engine buggy is the 4WD stuff from the VW Syncro Vanagon, it has a viscous front coupling and a locking rear diff (and lock front diff can be added with some work), but if you can find this rare gear be ready to write a BIG check.

Gary

#8 SubSandRail

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 03:25 PM

If you want to get sand rail performance, get a 2wd tranny and go with the mid-engine style, mounting it in the rear and make the front the same as the typical sand rail (most are beetle front beams or custom A-arm).


I have been looking into using the rear torsion from a 83 or 84 wagon, and replacing the diff with the 2wd tranny. The trick will be shortening the oil pan enough to fit the engine over the torsion bar. Also, the DOJ's will need to be near the max angle, so plan on bringing spares when you play.

You could use the non-torsion rear end from the later 80's cars. That would let you cut out the middle of the fat tube for engine clearance. You would need to use the coil-overs for suspension.

#9 Sweet82

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 03:36 PM

That sounds like a COOL idea to me!:cool: A 4WD tube chassis wheeler!

I wonder if it would work? Seems to me a Subaru would be a natural in sand and in the dirt.

Why doesn't someone try it? :brow: Then let us know how it works?

Hummm!
http://usmb.net/gallery/albuo21?page=1

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#10 bushbasher

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 05:54 PM

Explain more, I'm interested in the idea but don't quite follow you yet. If anything I'm interested in the portal hubs. I've heard someother comments about them. Is there a link you might know about.


Portal hubs are found on the old old volkswagon vans (and bugs too?? I'm no vw expert) Basically the idea is that you rotate the whole subaru drivetrain around so that the motor is in the back like a vw. Then you have the rear diff of the subaru up front. Problem is that the vehicle would then drive in the wrong direction. The portal boxes flip the direction of the wheels at the hub to get you moving the right direction again.

I have a neat homebuilt dune buggy frame, and I plan on running a motorcycle engine longitudinally to front and rear subaru diffs and axles/hubs. But realistically I won't have the time for quite awhile.

#11 Hondasucks

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 06:37 PM

hey sooby doo, rigth around where you live (Charlotte street I think... it's the first left coming out Knox Butte right after the S curves) Down there on the loop there is a Subaru powered dune buggy with Subaru running gear, the guy keeps it in his backyard but occasionally its sitting out front.

#12 All_talk

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 08:43 PM

Portal hubs are found on the old old volkswagon vans (and bugs too?? I'm no vw expert)

Reduction boxes are found on '54-'67 VW busses, there were some ratio and other changes through the years too. They were designed to be used on the swingaxle tannys but I think they could be adapted to independant with some creative machine and fab work. If you are willing to run the VW brakes and wheels, things would be much simpler. Here are some pics of the VW units.

Posted Image

Posted Image

#13 bushbasher

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Posted 16 August 2004 - 09:15 PM

Well theres no question that maching would be involved :)




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