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Guest Message by DevFuse
 

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Timming Belt is about a k past due...


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39 replies to this topic

#1 Guest_JER2911_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 11:59 AM

I've kinda been waiting to do it and at the same time I've been holding off on changing my oil- Will they have to drain the oil to do the timming belt and any other seals etc. ? Or should I just change the oil and hold out on doing the t-belt for anothe 3k ?
Also, just to get an idea - what else I should have done while they are in there??
I'm budgeting for about $400 just to keep suprises to a minimum...thanks!
Oh yeah, it's a '91 Legacy FWD 2.2

#2 Guest_synapse79_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 12:36 PM

In my oppinion the belt could easily go 80k miles if not 100k miles.

My 98 2.2 developed an oil leak at 70 so thats when i did it. It can be done with out any oil loss.
I would also suggest resealing the oil pump, and in that case there is some oil loss.
It would also be a good idea to replace the front and rear main seals, and atleast front, that one gets pretty ugly and is easy to get at. If a manual now would be a good time to put in a new clutch disc, unless you or who ever is doing the work with out removing the motor, some goes for the rear main seal.

Some ppl say you should replace the water pump, it cant hurt. Atleast you would want to check to see if it was leaking.

#3 Guest_synapse79_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 12:38 PM

Let us know what ppl quote you, i would like to know.

Also, do not go to the dealership to have it done. You will be ripped off, and it will be a miracle if its done right. Get quotes from a few garages that specialize in subarus or inports.

#4 Guest_Frag_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 12:39 PM

There seems to be a consensus that you should also replace the water pump (if never been done), crank seal, cam seals and oil pump O ring while checking the oil pump back plate screws : they have been known to back off ; if so, retighten with Lock Tite. All of that is not very expensive in parts, around 200$ US (I got all of that for 150$ US, but was told it was a very good deal.)
Also, the belt tensionner could have to be replaced. That part is around 150$ US.

#5 Guest_synapse79_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 12:56 PM

forgot about the o-ring, mine was wasted.

Have you ever seen the belt tensioner go bad?

#6 Guest_k2subaru_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 12:58 PM

I had my timing belt and seal replaced at 100K in my 1.8 Impreza. The seal was starting to leak, and I do believe they changed the oil at the time, even though I prefer to do my oil my self. I took it to the dealership because that is a project that was too advanced for my know-how and I hadn't the time to do it anyways.

In fact, I'm due for oil about now in both my soobs.

Gotta check the paper for any specials on cases.

Talk to you later!

#7 Guest_Frag_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 01:23 PM

Synapse79, no first hand experience with that but I've read a couple of times that they can go bad close to when the second belt need replacement. That was also confirmed by a mechanic I trust at the dealer I buy my parts at.
I guess it's a little like for the water pump : if it's not leaking at second belt change, is one confortable with the idea it could fail before the third belt change?
I'll have to do my second belt next spring and have'nt yet decided if I'll replace the tensionner even if it seems to still be in good shape.
Would appreciate inputs by those with experience on this subject.

Finally, I think evaluation of how long a belt (or for that matter any drive train component) can last has to take into account what kind of driving one does. City driving gives the engines and related components at least twice the wear of highway driving.

#8 Guest_synapse79_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 01:57 PM

I personally plan on replacing the water pump on the second belt which will be around 170k, which is a good margin for a water pump, maybe pushing it a little. I plan on trying to get 100k miles out of the new belt. I also resealed the back plate and installed an ACT clutch, so it should be good to go, and i dont care to pull the motor again any time soon.

As for the tensioner. It would have to look pretty bad before i would replace it. I would test it a few times with a vice when installing a retaining pin, see how well it comes back.

I was actually going to do the water pump also while i had everything apart, but the dealer wanted like 120bux or something like that, so the price aided with my decision to leave it in, and it was one less thing to do at the time.

#9 Guest_synapse79_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 01:59 PM

You guys notice that there doesnt seem to be any "real" mechanics on here. Or they do a good job keeping quiet...

#10 Guest_Frag_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 02:19 PM

What do you mean no "real" mechanics...
Dont you think we're better than any of them !?



Just to flush them out.. hi! hi!

#11 Guest_bythesea_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 02:31 PM

Not that I'm a mechanic but if you don't get em, in writing, to swear on the life of their first born that the crank pully bolt is properly torqued then your'e just asking for trouble. When it comes loose on the EA-82 motors things just fall off and all your eejit lights get shiny. On the New Gen things go crunch when it happens. Bye Bye crankshaft :) . Get a good mechanic and stick with him(her).

#12 Guest_JER2911_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 02:49 PM

I've herad all of this needed to be done, and that's why I've budgeted for so much...I my thinking though if I walk into the Mech shop and say:
"I want a t-belt and while your at it check the water pump, crank seal, cam seals and oil pump O ring while checking the oil pump back plate screws : they have been known to back off ; if so, retighten with Lock Tite
and the crank pulley bolts"

I'm asking for a huge price tag..what do you think? Should I just trust that the Mech might know all these things or should I mention them and hope I don't get the 'ol "well, while we were in there we noticed that this and this and that and this were all bad and you need to pay $550 plus your right arm and first born child."

#13 Guest_JER2911_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 04:59 PM

These guys are an independant shop and they specialize in Suby's they gave me a quote of $225!! Sweet!!

#14 Guest_JER2911_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 05:13 PM

that price also includes a new crank seal...

#15 Guest_durron22_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 05:29 PM

I find this very interesting as over here in Aus Subaru state that the timing belt must be changed at 100,000KM which is only about 62K Miles.
And they charge about $800 to do so.
Also re your timing belt tenstioner I had one go at 150,000KM (93,000 Miles ). Luckily it was noticed before the car was started as the engine was being worked on.
So I ask you are we being duped over here with this early timeing belt change. Also the service interval is 12,500 Km ( 7700 Miles ).

#16 Guest_JER2911_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 05:38 PM

This belt is the second one to go on...the car has 141,205 miles the first was changed approx. 80,000.
Just so I can have a methodical/educated list of stuff to check or stuff they might try to pull. Here's what I have so far:
Water pump: check-should prob. replace? (never been done that I can tell.)
Belt tensioner: check-should prob. re-place?
Crank Seal: included in cost

What else am I missing??

Thanks!
Jordan

#17 Guest_synapse79_*

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Posted 17 December 2002 - 07:31 PM

thats a pretty decent quote. Best part is that its at a subaru garage..
Make sure to have your oil pump resealed and the O-ring replaced. Its like a 30min job with the timing belt off, so it shouldnt cost too much more. Removing the pump makes it easier to change the front main seal anyways.

My oil pump started to leak really bad around 70k miles.

#18 Guest_gotsubarus_*

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Posted 18 December 2002 - 09:28 AM

I usualy charge 180.00 to change Tbelt, crank seal, cam seals, left front cam plate o ring( small extenssion plate that holds the cam seal and cam sensor ) the cam cover o ring on the right rear head. ( this is price on 2.2L )

I have never had to replace a tensioner yet. Water pump change isnt always neccesary on the 2.2 thats a judgment call ( if the t belt breaks because of water pump it wont hurt the engine ) but on the 2.5 thats a scary thought....

#19 Guest_Frag_*

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Posted 18 December 2002 - 10:23 AM

gotsubarus, could you give me (us) more detail on that "cam plate O ring". First time I hear of that.
Where is that exactly and do you replace it at every belt change ?
What happens when this O ring fails ?
As for the cam cover O ring, do you mean the cam cover gasket?
And when you write "right rear head", what do you mean by "rear"?
That's a lot of question, but you're talking about things I've never heard of and would like more precisions since I'll be doing that next spring.
Thanks in advance.

#20 Guest_gotsubarus_*

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Posted 18 December 2002 - 11:24 AM

On the passenger side of the car ( which is right rear ) there is a small cam cover cap with 2 bolts in it... Remove the bolts and there is an O ring that will harden in time and or crack... therfore leaking oil. ( not a massive drip like the crank seal leaking, but lost oil is lost oil )

The other one is on the front of the head on the drivers side... romove timing belt cover, then the timing belt, then the cam pully 17mm, the 3 bolts 10mm removing the back timming cover plastic. remove the 10mm bolt that hold dipstick, then there are 2 bolt 10mm and a 12mm bolt.... unplug or remove the cam sensor and pull the alluminum extension off there will be an O ring to replace there.

THIS IS ON THE 2.2L and the 1.8L

I replace them when needed if you reach under and feel oil or if Valvcovers are leaking they might be leaking. some leak before others because peoples driving habbits are different than others and temperature makes a difference on rubber seals. ( hot cold )

#21 Guest_Frag_*

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Posted 18 December 2002 - 11:33 AM

Thanks a lot gotsub!
That was new territory to me.

P.-S.: It seems I was wrong on that former post (higher): there ARE real mechanics here... 8o

#22 Guest_JER2911_*

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Posted 19 December 2002 - 02:12 PM

I'll add the oil pump re-seal to the list.

#23 Guest_meep424_*

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Posted 19 December 2002 - 04:06 PM

I read on this board sometime ago where the typical lifetime for a water pump (original Subaru) was up to 105,000 miles. I decided to see if I could stretch mine out to 120,000, to replace with the second timing belt...

Pump blew out that 106,500 for me. A new, not rebuilt, bosch pump cost me $55, and an additional 25 minutes while I changed the belt.

Be careful with the brand of replacement timing belt. My second belt was not Subaru, I believe it was the gates brand -- and it started to stretch after 40,000 miles causing rough idle and poor firing during low RPM acceleration.

Imagine my surprise when, after changing my water pump and timing belt, performance dramatically improved. I had spent months trying to fix the rough behavior.

Meep

#24 Guest_JER2911_*

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Posted 19 December 2002 - 05:34 PM

As it is right now my car idles weird...rough and jumpy, I really need to get this belt done...the RPM's will fluctuate when first starting up...could this be the belt about ready to go??

#25 Guest_OthercarisaFiat_*

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Posted 19 December 2002 - 10:12 PM

I had a water pump go about 1 year ago at 95,000 miles. Trashed the timing belt, oil pump, and some other stuff to the tune of about $1200. Replace that pig.




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