Jump to content


Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, my lurker friend!

Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, an unparalleled Subaru community full of the greatest Subaru gurus and modders on the planet! We offer technical information and discussion about all things Subaru, the best and most popular all wheel drive vehicles ever created.

We offer all this information for free to everyone, even lurkers like you! All we ask in return is that you sign up and give back some of what you get out - without our awesome registered users none of this would be possible! Plus, you get way more great stuff as a member! Lurk to lose, participate to WIN*!
  • Say hello and join the conversation
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get automatic updates
  • Get your own profile and make new friends
  • Classifieds with all sorts of Subaru goodies
  • Photo hosting in our gallery
  • Meet other cool people with cool cars
Seriously, what are you waiting for? Make your life more fulfilling and join today! You and your Subaru won't regret it, we guarantee** it.

* The joy of participation and being generally awesome constitutes winning
** Not an actual guarantee, but seriously, you probably won't regret it!

Serving the Subaru Community since May 18th, 1998!

Guest Message by DevFuse
 

- - - - -

Subaru Hesitation Problems


  • Please log in to reply
81 replies to this topic

#51 Guest_Legacy777_*

Guest_Legacy777_*
  • Guests

Posted 14 January 2002 - 01:39 PM

don't know about the longevity of the beef jerky.....let us know how it works out.

#52 Guest_Gus_*

Guest_Gus_*
  • Guests

Posted 14 January 2002 - 02:44 PM

I bet beef jerky would last longer than most of today's space age polymers.

#53 Guest_st2eelpot_*

Guest_st2eelpot_*
  • Guests

Posted 14 January 2002 - 04:31 PM

Maybe we can somehow get all the carbon deposit in the right place, sandwich it around the knock sensor, and put it to good use.
heh
Dave

#54 Guest_yushincho_*

Guest_yushincho_*
  • Guests

Posted 16 January 2002 - 06:49 PM

Hi folks,

I got my impreza fixed by replacing fuel filter and fuel induction cleaning (BG....) in subaru dealer shop. I spent some money for that.

Mine is 96 Impreza, 1.8L, manual shift, 78Kmiles on it.

I want them to test it by OBD2 scanning. And they checked
it and reported me that there is problem in fuel system.

And I tested my impreza after repair, and it looks fine. Though,
a little and subtle vibration is sensed when I accelate it abruptly and hard at idle. But it is recovered as before and no hesitation or fluctuation is sensed during driving.

They showed me very very dirty fuel coming from my vehicle.
I don't know where exactly it come from, but guess from fuel filter. There is chunk of dust and ....black gel like things in the fuel.

Thus, I think there is no significant matter in sensors or ECU of my impreza. Just the dirty fuel filter and fuel inducton system was the reason of hesitation.

I owned this impreza for 3 months and I think previous owner didn't do any maintenance work for it.

The subaru dealer also recommended to replace spark plug, but I declined, since the cost is high as you expect and I want to do it my self if it is really necessary.

I detached the spark plug yesterday,I can't believe it, it is really really dirty....
I want to have some chance to see who the previous owner is...
I'm planning to replace all ..every things of mine soon.

I believe most of you are good mechanic and doing good maintenance, but if not, checking the fuel system could give you some clue.
I used to clean throttle body myself for another vehicle but nothig I did for this 96 impreza....

After all, it is very fortunate for me that the reason of hesitation was just due to bad fuel system parts,
however I hope all of you having this problem can handle it in smart way. And I hope to follow all the study you do to resolve this stuff.

Thanks for all the posts about hesitation, it was really
important & critical information, but enjoyable to me.

Yushin - 96 Impreza, 1.8L, Manual shift, 78Kmiles

#55 Guest_Legacy777_*

Guest_Legacy777_*
  • Guests

Posted 16 January 2002 - 07:47 PM

You think you could find out where that dirty fuel was coming from?

And what they used to clean it?

Thanks

#56 Guest_yushincho_*

Guest_yushincho_*
  • Guests

Posted 17 January 2002 - 07:59 PM

Josh,

I guess they got dirty fuel just before the 'in' of fuel filter, not from after the 'out' of the filter thru fuel injectors. (You know there is in and out on fuel filter.) So that much chunks are deposited.. But didn't watch they work. They don't permit me to enter ther work area.

And the service name is "BG Induction System Clean-up Service".
I have catalog and it says "Deposits in the fuel indection system cause driveability problems such as hesitation, surge, stall, hard starting, rough idel and loss of power".

And it also says Modern engines are finelt tuned and extremely sensitive to deposits that accumulate on intake valves, intake ports, fuel injectors and combustion chambers.
As all we expect...

And on its cover, with a picture of fascinating and gorgeous fireworks, is is saying "Remember how much fun it was to drive your car when it was new?"
All we miss that memory of fun!

And as i said before, my spark plugs from 78,000 mile impreza was incredibly dirty and worn out...

Even with Hyundai Elentra(South Korea Avante), one of my previous cars, 1995~2000, 110,000 km(about 70,000mile), I just used to clean throttle body annually myself, replaced fuel-filter once, but It was really ok without any fuel induction cleaning.

Hope this could be some help to you.

Yushin
96 Impreza, manual, 1.8L, 78,000mile

#57 Guest_Legacy777_*

Guest_Legacy777_*
  • Guests

Posted 17 January 2002 - 10:14 PM

Thanks for the info.

I'll have to do some snoopin for that stuff.

#58 Guest_Vr8tor_*

Guest_Vr8tor_*
  • Guests

Posted 17 January 2002 - 10:30 PM

Bjelko,

I had the exact same problem with my 1999 Subaru Legacy Outback Wagon (Non-Limited) Automatic. The car would downshift and take a two-count to move after doing so, almost like Turbo lag. It was not only annoying but very dangerous and one of the reasons I let the car go after the lease. It was impossible to drive smoothly in traffic. Once above a certain speed though, it would fly. I never complained about it to the dealer because I thought that I would get the comment that it was "normal" plus I had already made up my mind to get rid of the car because of other things my wife and I didn't lke about it.

I also had a problem with going through small puddles on the highway after it rained, say at 55-60. The steering wheel would lurch in my hand and it felt that I could lose control of it. I don't know if that was normal for Subaru AWD systems (power transfer?) but it was also VERY disconcerting to feel. Those two things coupled with the trucklike turning circle and the way too heavy steering that made it impossible to parallel park (too heavy for me, let alone my wife), made me think of another vehicle. Don't think I'm bashing the car because other than that I had no mechanical problems to speak of in 38,000 miles. One check engine light and a bad brake job that the dealer fixed and the only other problem was a sticking cupholder. I loved the look of the car (the best looking wagon out there by far) the Green color we chose, the practicality of the wagon and folding seats and the fantastic traction in the snow. Unfortunately it just wasn't the car for us. I just took delivery of a Ford Escape as a replacement.

#59 Guest_jlawton_*

Guest_jlawton_*
  • Guests

Posted 18 January 2002 - 12:00 AM

We have a 2002 outback ltd with less than 8k on it and find it less than desirable to drive in slow-moving traffic for some of the same reasons as described here. However I don't know if it is the manual transmission or engine hesitation but I feel like a sitting duck too when trying to cross a busy intersection in this car. Very jerky at very slow speeds say moving along at a stop sign line-up or just cruising out of my drive-way. Over 30 and up everything is fine. It seems to want more gas pedal to get going from a stop without shuddering but then the clutch burns. Never had a manual that was so hard to drive smoothly. Same line from the dealer and from SOA "the problem has to be reproduced at the dealership".

Also why would the brakes be squealing on a new car? Never had that before.

#60 Guest_jlawton_*

Guest_jlawton_*
  • Guests

Posted 18 January 2002 - 12:14 AM

I have the EXACT same phenomenon as Azulan Chaosbreaker describes. I've never had to concentrate so much at intersections in my life. And I'm doing the same thing to get around it but it isn't good for the clutch. The dealer was absolutely no help, told us that the smell we think is the clutch was undercoating (right!) and that we couldn't slip the clutch in a stop and go traffic situation but didn't suggest how to avoid the problem of jerking through city traffic without stalling the car. This is like the dealer who told my neighbor, who's car stalled whenever he braked during a turn , to try not braking on turns.

#61 Guest_Legacy777_*

Guest_Legacy777_*
  • Guests

Posted 18 January 2002 - 09:33 AM

WHAT....."try not to brake around turns"

You know what I would have done....I would've walked around the service desk and smacked the idiot, then i would've gotten the dealership manager, and told the service dude to repeat what he initially told me about not to brake around turns.

We need to do some weed eatin of the gene pool......it's gettin WAY too crowded.

#62 Guest_Commuter_*

Guest_Commuter_*
  • Guests

Posted 18 January 2002 - 12:55 PM

jlawton:

Regarding the brake squeal - Subaru did come out with some different brake pad shims (or something of that nature) that fixes the problem. Others have reported on this. I assume that you have the same problem. Have you had this fix applied?

Regarding clutches - I'm hearing more and more of problems with the current generation of Subarus. The Impreza guys are complaining too of clutch shudder/chatter. I'm not sure if Subaru has gotten to the bottom of it yet. Partial explanations I have heard are the use of harder clutch friction materials for better wear, but it will shudder, especially when cold. Another theory is warped or poorly machined flywheels. I'd keep on Subaru about it.

Hesitation - I have an automatic, but I can appreciate what a ragged throttle response will do for trying to start off with a manual transmission car. I know that my generation of Legacy Outback (late 90's, I have a 97) is "somewhat" susceptible to carbon build up. (I've heard the same reports from others.) The posts above are interesting to note. Perhaps the current batch of Subarus are no different? I know that my throttle response was unpredictable between 600 and 1200 rpm while this was going on. One time fine, another time a slight lag, another time it would lag more, another time it would actually bog down a bit with the rpms dipping slightly, etc. I never had it stall, but it came close a couple of times. My dealer did a MotorVac process which I think is the same as the Induction service spoken of above. It flushes out the fuel rail and the injectors. Cleans the intake ports and valves and combustion chamber. If you have a significant build up, the stuff you buy off the shelf in an auto parts store will not be sufficient. However, you could try and if it makes a bit of an improvement, it may indicate a carbon problem. However, it's not a foolproof way to test. I tried a bottle or 2 of stuff and it didn't seem to do anything. Now that things are cleaned out though, a store bought bottle of something 'does' seem to keep the carbon in check (or a tank of premium, especially Sunoco which has a bit of methanol in it). Valvoline stuff with kerosene in it seems to work alright for me.

Just some thoughts for you. It is very disconcerting to hear of this many people having these problems with the manual equipped cars.

Commuter

#63 Guest_PHATBRAT_*

Guest_PHATBRAT_*
  • Guests

Posted 18 January 2002 - 04:38 PM

They do make semisynthetic. I believe there are a few out there....Durablend comes to mind. It's like half synthetic and have regular oil, specifically made to work with eachother. I would start with that before you go synthetic all the way. Maybe 2 or 3 oil changes with this then to synthetic. I dunno....

#64 Guest_st2eelpot_*

Guest_st2eelpot_*
  • Guests

Posted 18 January 2002 - 05:24 PM

I know I've talked a lot about the clutch shuddering problem on this board before, so if you don't want to read about that any more skip this post. Here are the basics we've talked about- particularly when the car is cold (this applies to the '00-'02 body style outbacks, manual transmissions) the clutch seems overly grabby in and thus causes a bucking when accelerating from a stand still. Some people have found a solution to be simply start the car in 2nd gear. That seems to work, but is never easy on the car. Buried in past threads someone got a dealer to admit there was a problem, but told them there was nothing they could do about it. I contacted SOA and I have an awesome dealer and they are willing to try to reproduce this thing (it happens every morning). Tuesday I'm dropping off my car in the evening, getting a free loaner car thanks to SOA, then Wednesday morning the head mechanic of this dealer is going to try to reproduce it, and fix it. SOA told him some sort of things to look for (meaning they acknowledged the problem and might even have been researching it!). Thursday morning the mechanic is going to drive it again to see if his work did any difference. Then I pick the car up Thursday or Friday.
As far as the brakes squeaking while cold and going in reverse, subaru put out some shims that your dealer should install for free (if you ask them to) that cures this.

Cheers,
Dave

#65 Guest_Grounded1_*

Guest_Grounded1_*
  • Guests

Posted 19 January 2002 - 03:51 PM

I agree with Legacy777. Sometimes I can swear that the (auto) Tranny is shifting into lock up before it is suppose to, thereby putting an extra load on the engine which the ecu tries to compensate for with either ignition/ fuel and then god forbid there is knocking during this. It all compounds itself. I've been chasing mine with a new knock sensor, oxygen sensor, contact cleaning the MAS, replacing the pvc check valve, tune up, ect. It comes and goes when it wants and is very particular about the actual circumstances that cause it. If I could easily change my tranny duty solenoids without dropping the valve body I would, just to rule it out. But I do feel the tranny is partly the culprit.

Pat

#66 Guest_JaapH_*

Guest_JaapH_*
  • Guests

Posted 22 January 2002 - 07:16 PM

Hi,
I have an 96 Outback and drive in Europe (its an US imported outback). Its automatic and I don't seem to have any problems.
What I wondered though is what type of fuel are you using in the US? Could that mean anything for the carbon buildup? I use gas with 98 octane now and it gives good performance. I also asume that a high octane figure gives less knocking.

#67 Guest_Commuter_*

Guest_Commuter_*
  • Guests

Posted 22 January 2002 - 09:42 PM

98??!! Premium here in Canada is 92 to 94 maximum. I believe the States is similar.

I've heard mixed reports about the quality of our gasoline in North America. I'm not sure how it compares to Europe, but I would suppect that it lags if anything. I read a newspaper article earlier this winter that indicated that Canada still has fairly high levels of sulphur in the gas in many areas of the country.

As I said above, I know that an occasional tank of premium in my car helps to keep things "in check" as far as the carbon issue goes. I'd like to just put it in all the time, but when I'm filling up twice a week, I can't justify the 10 to 20% extra.

Commuter

#68 Guest_JaapH_*

Guest_JaapH_*
  • Guests

Posted 23 January 2002 - 03:34 PM

The lowest octane we have is 92 then there is 95 which I used much and premium is 98. Driving a Subaru in Europe is not for the 'poor'. In the Netherlands Subaru has a market share of 1%. Thats really low. And heads keep turning when I drive it. Our gas prices are aprox. one dollar for a liter. But then again ist much crowded here and distances between cities are shorter.

I wonder if this makes a big difference for the hesitation problem? My Outback was brought to Europe before they started selling them here (97) and has about 90k(miles). I never had the hesitation problem.

I did have my cranck and cam sensors replaced after twice a check engine light. Those were very 'common problems' with the 2,5L accoording the dealer. But he said I have the beter ones now...( is that a common problem in the US?).
And of course I had the cranck seal problem. Did that one myself.

I found out that prices of parts are much higher here.
Front brake pads OEM's cost $150...

Jaap

#69 Guest_Legacy777_*

Guest_Legacy777_*
  • Guests

Posted 23 January 2002 - 04:05 PM

OUCH!! 150 bucks for OEM brake pads.

#70 Guest_st2eelpot_*

Guest_st2eelpot_*
  • Guests

Posted 24 January 2002 - 01:17 PM

My 01 Outback wagon gets 87 octane. When I was in Colorado the dealer started it with a tank of 85 octane and it didn't seem to care due to the thinner air. I just used the 87 octane (middle grade where I was and lowest where I am now) because that's what the manual says as the lowest octane to use...
Cheers,
Dave

#71 Guest_JaapH_*

Guest_JaapH_*
  • Guests

Posted 25 January 2002 - 02:52 PM

If the persons with the most intensive hessitation problem tell what sort of gas they are using, we could see if that matters.

Also try to change the gas to a higher octane for a week or so. It might help.

#72 Guest_Legacy777_*

Guest_Legacy777_*
  • Guests

Posted 05 March 2002 - 08:03 AM

I've been bumped to bring up old memories ;)

#73 Guest_SmashPDX_*

Guest_SmashPDX_*
  • Guests

Posted 05 March 2002 - 10:23 PM

Want me to archive this guys?

#74 Guest_Legacy777_*

Guest_Legacy777_*
  • Guests

Posted 05 March 2002 - 10:45 PM

I bumped it because it was brought up again.....but you can archive if you want.....just don't want to see it go bye bye

#75 [HTi]Johnson

[HTi]Johnson

    Head Trauma, inc.

  • Members
  • 1,512 posts
  • Coburg, Or.

Posted 01 July 2004 - 01:11 AM

How's the timing and filters?




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users