Bad Head Gasket - what else to do now?

[kingmc]

Hi Everyone!

 

Brand new to the board - a result of researching my car's overheating symptoms. I have a '97 Outback with 136,000 miles. It has turned out to be the ole head gasket failure. Now, I had it diadnosed at the dealership and then took it to a guy who said he would do it for $600 + parts (and machine shop costs I presume). Definitely will be less that the $1200 the dealers quoted.

 

Now, this guy works on a lot of Roos (seems to be the second most popular means of tranportation in my part of MT - right behind huge pickups), but I don't think he is very familiar with this job. In fact, I'm pretty sure he told me straight up that he hadn't done a HG job on a 2.5. So, he's telling me he thinks it is a cracked head because of the HC in the coolant and come tomorrow morning, I will be telling him some of the good knowledge I picked up lurking here for a few hours. I suspect that since I have not let it run hot and the symptoms only occurred 4 times under different driving conditions, the head is not cracked. Rather, one of the internal HGs is leaking. Nevertheless, the head will be pulled and checked at the machine shop and all will be revealed. Wish me luck.

 

I have two questions right now:

1) should I be extra cautious with a "less than educated" mechanic on this particular issue?

2) what else should I have done while the engine is out? I am already planning on doing the timing belt (I bought it at 123k and don't think it has been done) and maybe the water pump.

 

Any input, advice or smacks to the head will be welcomed.

 

Thanks in advance!

 

-Kingmc

[cookie]

every seal you can get to. The oil pump o ring and crank especially. Check valve clearance.

If your money is still good rear seal and change the plastic seperator for a metal one.

Water pump and tensioner if you have the money.

You will probably find something else too, but if it is a manual tranny this is a good time to do the clutch.

This is what I had done on mine, it does not leak and I hope it stays in the car till the rings wear out.

[Adam N.D.J.]

Any respectable mechanic thats not trying to soak you would got after a head gasket problem after finding HC's in the coolant. Rather than jumping straight to quoting you for an entire head replacement. ALso if he is suppose to be a Subaru Tech then he would know that the 2.5's have a gasket issue. In my opinion, as a mechanic, I would take it to a different shop. One that isn't going to try and take you for all you have, and knows a little more bout what they are working on.

[Clutchbob]

If you haven't seen this before:

 

http://mysite.verizon.net/vze730qe/Head_gasket_replacement.html

 

Good info. Skip admits he's not much of a mechanic, But seems to have tackled this problem well enough, so perhaps experience isn't as important as commitment?

 

Good luck. I had my '98 OB less than three weeks, when symptoms appeared.

It's at the used car dealers for HG's (not Subu mechs, but generally certified), I hope they do it right.

 

Another info site:

 

http://www.troubleshooters.com/tpromag/200005/200005.htm

[kingmc]

Thanks for all the advice and links everyone. I did go by the shop on Saturday and talked with another (i think more experienced) mechanic. This guy was telling me that with these head gasket failures, you never know what you've got until you pull the head. He says he sees about half of these actually end up having a cracked head. I'm just keeping my fingers crossed and hoping for the best.

 

Again, thanks for the advice!

 

-Kingmc

[Clutchbob]

He says he sees about half of these actually end up having a cracked head. -Kingmc

From what I've read in the posts and heard from Subaru techs, your chances are good your heads are fine. They should be checked for warpage and milled if necessary.

 

My engine has been broken down. My heads were o.k. keep us posted.

[kingmc]

Followup: Just got my car back tonight and had a decent amount of work done. Bottom line is the heads were just fine. Bad news was that the machine shop fees were $300, but overall, I think I came out ok.

 

I was told that it was quite obvious, after pulling the heads, that the gaskets were going. I'm not sure if the mechanic actually said that both were going, but it was confirmed that this was the source of the problem. I talked things over with the mechanic and here is the list of what was replaced/done:

 

 

 

 

 

• head gaskets
  
• heads machined
  
• front and rear seals
  
• valve cover seals (whole kit)
  
• plugs
  
• water pump
  
• clutch
  
• timing belt
  
• thermostat
  
• intake manifold gaskets
  
• radiator flush
  

I think that is about it. I'm not a mechanic and may have misphrased something, so forgive me or correct me!

 

Overall, I am very please about all of this. Not that I'm glad that the HGs went out, but glad that no permanent damage was done and glad that I was able to take advantage of this and get a lot of preventative work done. The final bill?? $1922. I think that is a damn good deal considering the $300 machine shop bill and all the parts. They used as many Subaru parts as possible and put in good plugs - $15 apiece. The labor was just over $600.

 

Now, once I get new spark plug wires, a new front left axle and maybe a new PCV valve, she will be good to go, spare routine brake and suspension work.

 

I think I've got a driver now that will last me a while and a good shop to keep it on the road. 136,300 miles and counting.

 

Thanks everyone,

Kingmc

[cookie]

and you paid about what I paid for head gaskets alone.

[kingmc]

and you paid about what I paid for head gaskets alone.

Guess that is what you get for living in relatively low-rent Montana.

 

BTW - I wasn't bragging - Just wanted to give a full report since you all were kind enough to offer advice. Thanks again!!

 

Kingmc