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RX 5 Lug strut question/idea's....


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27 replies to this topic

#1 TheSubaruJunkie

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Posted 28 December 2004 - 10:56 PM

So... im sitting here... pondering the 5lug swap that is about to take place. Ive gathered information from here and there (thanks Tex) and still have a couple questions.

Strut Tops... do XT6 tops bolt in? Or will i need to swap over my EA82T strut tops? No worries if I do, only reason I ask is cause of what im planning to do....

There's a 91 Legacy in the junkyard with a set of KYB GR2's on it. I want to swipe the GR2's to use in my swap. Im not 100% if the strut tops will swap over to the GR2's. I can only hope so (unless Legacy Strut tops will work... anybody?? anybody???)

So... Now that we have the struts out of the way... i'll need springs. I dont really feel like using Legacy springs cause the legacy is alot larger than the RX, and im sure the spring rates will be all messed up. I have a friend who has a set of 2002 WRX Springs, and I was thinking of using them. They're from a WRX Sedan, but not 100% sure if they'll work with the strut tops i am forced to use. Also, if someone could kinda educate me on spring rates... maybe what the RX already has in comparison to the WRX, or suggest springs that would work better? My main concern is really ride height, i want the car to sit about 1"-2" lower than it already is.

Other than that, i believe i have everything I need lined up. Just to find a XT6 to strip and im on my way :)

-Brian

#2 baccaruda

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 07:00 AM

Good timing, Brian... I have a couple of related questions of my own as well as a comment on yours.


In my research so far I've heard that you should match the struts and spindles (and spindles to rotors/calipers) and use XT6 control arms, tie rods, and ball joints. the score on the KYB GR2s would be worth changing spindles if I'm right about them being specific.
You can bolt EA82 strut tops on the Legacy struts directly.


On my wagon, I'm going to use GR2s as well (with RX springs) but I haven't decided if I would be better off using Legacy or Impreza GR2s based on the weight of my car.. or are the impreza struts shorter? in that case i'd probably not want them...

#3 Caboobaroo

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 10:08 AM

Hmm I believe that you'll need to use struts from a GC8 Legacy for the 5-lug swap from what I've read. I'm not entirely sure if the regual Legacy stuff will bolt right in or with the EA82 tops on them. As for the spings, your best bet is to go with a set of coilovers from a '01-'03 Honda Civic. I think it was Caleb who told me that but I can't remember who....

#4 TheSubaruJunkie

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 01:14 PM

WTF is a GC8??? Can we use model years please?

Bacca... so are you saying the legacy GR2's wont bolt to the XT6's steering knuckle??

-Brian

#5 tizzle

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 02:28 PM

As his avatar says, Please disregard, he's probably drunk. :drunk: GC8 is an impreza code, legacy is BH/BG/BD etc

#6 Subarutex

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 02:29 PM

So... im sitting here... pondering the 5lug swap that is about to take place. Ive gathered information from here and there (thanks Tex) and still have a couple questions.

Strut Tops... do XT6 tops bolt in? Or will i need to swap over my EA82T strut tops? No worries if I do, only reason I ask is cause of what im planning to do....

There's a 91 Legacy in the junkyard with a set of KYB GR2's on it. I want to swipe the GR2's to use in my swap. Im not 100% if the strut tops will swap over to the GR2's. I can only hope so (unless Legacy Strut tops will work... anybody?? anybody???)

So... Now that we have the struts out of the way... i'll need springs. I dont really feel like using Legacy springs cause the legacy is alot larger than the RX, and im sure the spring rates will be all messed up. I have a friend who has a set of 2002 WRX Springs, and I was thinking of using them. They're from a WRX Sedan, but not 100% sure if they'll work with the strut tops i am forced to use. Also, if someone could kinda educate me on spring rates... maybe what the RX already has in comparison to the WRX, or suggest springs that would work better? My main concern is really ride height, i want the car to sit about 1"-2" lower than it already is.

Other than that, i believe i have everything I need lined up. Just to find a XT6 to strip and im on my way :)

-Brian


Brian, for the front struts, use the whole complete legacy unit. Strut top, strut, and spring. If, after you get it in, and you aren't happy with the ride height, try wrx springs.

The strut tops will fit in the stock holes. You will need to take a round file or dremel to the holes and make them 1mm or larger out from the center of the strut hole. This will make sense when you go to install.

Why not use the legacy front hub (knuckle), axle, and rotor aswell? Then bolt the XT6 caliper to it. Should match up beautifully.

If you choose to use the xt6 knuckles, you will need to modify them to fit legacy or impreza struts. The bar that goes between the 2 clamps of the strut needs to be ground down about 1/8. It is possible to just bang them on, but I found that to be difficult.

I've swapped 2 vehicles to 5-lug. My RX, and Dan's Turbo wagon.

My setup:
XT6 lower arms (front)
XT6 tie rod ends
Impreza knuckle
Impreza axle
Impreza strut and strut top
Ebay coilovers (all 4)
Impreza WRX rotors
Impreza WRX calipers

XT6 rear hubs and rotors, supra backing plates, supra rear brakes

Dan's setup:
XT6 lower arm (front)
XT6 tie rod ends
XT6 knuckles (ground to fit impreza/legacy struts)
XT6 axles
Impreza strut and strut top
Impreza spring
XT6 rotos and calipers

XT6 rear hubs, rotors, and backing plates

There are some advantages to using the Impreza/legacy knuckles. First, the bearings inside are a much better design. The top hole of the strut mount is oblong shaped, as is the bolt that goes through it. This is a "cam bolt" and will allow you to set some camber in the front. This is not possible with the XT6.

#7 Subarutex

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 02:40 PM

NOTE: Not all struts, springs, and strut tops are interchangable.

For a safe ride, it is imparitive that you match some things.

For a front strut there are several pieces:
Strut
Spring
Upper Spring seat
Washer
Strut top
Nut

Here is a good diagram of how the whole assembly goes together: http://www.subarupar...g/5A/i210-1.gif

The spring must seat into the lower perch on the strut. The Upper spring perch must seat onto the spring. The washer is vital, it will allow you to turn your wheels. The strut tops must fit right, otherwise they will clunk, ask Syphon about that.

#8 tizzle

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 02:44 PM

I'm sorry but I haven't read into this swap much, but could this be done entirely with impreza parts, no xt6?

#9 baccaruda

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 04:26 PM

tizzle: no, the front control arms and the rear brakes are too different.



what about the ball joints? do i need to use xt6 ball joints or can I use leg/imp ball joints in the XT6 control arms?

and how about the impreza vs legacy struts for a GL's weight?

this is what i'm looking at for my swap:

rear
XT6 rear rotors/hubs/backing plates (stock/original calipers)


front
XT6 control arms/tie rods/calipers
impreza/legacy knuckles/hubs/rotors/axles/struts (see impreza/legacy strut question)
??????? XT6 ball joint or will leg/imp BJ work in XT6 control arm? ???????

#10 TheSubaruJunkie

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 04:36 PM

Tex... YOU DA MAN! Answered pretty much all the questions I had. I think i will get the entire setup from that legacy then. I guess that leaves me to find a XT6 for the rear brakes, front calipers & lower control arms... everything else can come from the legacy right?

The strut tops will fit in the stock holes. You will need to take a round file or dremel to the holes and make them 1mm or larger out from the center of the strut hole. This will make sense when you go to install.

That makes perfect sence, and i have just the bit to do it with.


Why not use the legacy front hub (knuckle), axle, and rotor aswell? Then bolt the XT6 caliper to it. Should match up beautifully.

Why cant the Legacy Caliper be used?

-Brian

#11 Subarutex

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 04:37 PM

tizzle: no, the front control arms and the rear brakes are too different.



what about the ball joints? do i need to use xt6 ball joints or can I use leg/imp ball joints in the XT6 control arms?

and how about the impreza vs legacy struts for a GL's weight?

this is what i'm looking at for my swap:

rear
XT6 rear rotors/hubs/backing plates (stock/original calipers)


front
XT6 control arms/tie rods/calipers
impreza/legacy knuckles/hubs/rotors/axles/struts (see impreza/legacy strut question)
??????? XT6 ball joint or will leg/imp BJ work in XT6 control arm? ???????


THe reason for the xt6 lower arms, as best I know, is the ball joint. It doesn't appear to be any longer than the stock one. The ball joint is larger, and the taper through the arm is larger. As far as I can tell, xt6, legacy, and impreza ball joints are all the same.

I've had no problems running the impreza struts on teh front of mine, nor has dan. I think either the impreza or legacy stock struts provide a good match. I don't the difference in weight is really that great over the fronts of the cars.

#12 Subarutex

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 04:40 PM

Why cant the Legacy Caliper be used?

-Brian


No front ebrake on it. If you want to drive without an ebrake, go for it. :drunk:

#13 TheSubaruJunkie

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 04:43 PM

Oh yeah.. the ebrake will be solved with upgrade #2. I gotta find out which nissan rear calipers will bolt on, then i'll move the ebrake to the rear. So maybe I will use the legacy calipers, that will solve one problem for down the road.

Its all comming together now... sawwwweeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeet!

And I gather from the thread that the legacy CV's will work in place of the XT6 CV's? Is that correct? If so, i have a pair of Legacy Turbo CV's i'll have left behind from my TLeg after its dismantled.

-Brian

#14 Subarutex

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 04:47 PM

Rotors, axles, knuckles... all must be from the same car.

Legacy axles willl work... if you are using legacy knuckles.

#15 TheSubaruJunkie

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 04:50 PM

Gotchya. Wonder if TLeg knuckles are the same as Legacy. I'll have to talk to some people over at legacycentral, but it seems the majority of my parts will be comming from the legacy then. I'll have to find a way to use standard Legacy brakes, as the TLeg are larger and already sold.

Wish i had a spare EA82 to work with, maybe I'll goto the junkyard and start matching parts.

-Brian

#16 syphon

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 05:17 PM

Just FYI, WRX sedan springs are almost identicle in ride height to Legacy Sedan springs.

I put WRX springs on my turbo legacy and MAY be < 1" lower, but I think it's roughly the same height.

#17 Subarutex

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 05:19 PM

Gotchya. Wonder if TLeg knuckles are the same as Legacy. I'll have to talk to some people over at legacycentral, but it seems the majority of my parts will be comming from the legacy then. I'll have to find a way to use standard Legacy brakes, as the TLeg are larger and already sold.

Wish i had a spare EA82 to work with, maybe I'll goto the junkyard and start matching parts.

-Brian


I would put money on the knuckles being the same, just bigger brakes.

#18 calebz

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 05:38 PM

Silly question...

for the tie rod.. its just the XT6 outer tie rod end right?

PS.. Tex, aren't you supposed to be working?;)

#19 baccaruda

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 06:21 PM

Caleb: right, it's the outer tie rod end. Leave Tex alone, I'm supposed to be working now too :brow:


I just talked to my buddy at Napa and he gave me the same part number for the XT6 and Legacy and Impreza ball joints. I see that Tex verified this as well. thanks bud. I think you are right about the vehicle weights being close enough not to matter.

now I just need to find out which combo of Legacy/Impreza struts and springs (Leg? Imp? RX?) sits the highest. And get a price on XT6 control arm bushings.. my donor's are all chewed up...

#20 Qman

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 06:29 PM

Brakes must match the knuckle. I have an XT6 that someone swapped the Legacy front suspension from. The XT6 caliper will not bolt to it as it is too small. This may be due to the donor being a turbo. The turbo's definitely have bigger front brakes.

I just picked up Chuck Sands monster XT6. It had a couple of mishaps and isn't quite shaped like an XT6 anymore.(read as multiple rollovers) But it will have the front brake stuff to correct the issues I am having with my XT6. Bonus is that it also came with the engine. Cams and custom air intake will make open class rallyX a little more competitive. Roll bar and harnesses for safety. The air struts are good for someone who may want them.

#21 TheSubaruJunkie

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 06:42 PM

I will get the brakes from the guy buying my TLeg brakes. So I will have all legacy front end (except the lower control arms) and then XT6 rear brake stuff.

Now to find some rear calipers that have ebrake stuff on it that will fit XT6 backing plates.

-Brian

#22 baccaruda

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 06:51 PM

So according to the 2 subaru dealerships in town, the XT6 front control arm bushings do not exist for sale separately. Does anyone have dimensions for them or do I get to be the first to figure that out? :P


this thread is great.. we should move it to retrofitting and mark it for archiving...

#23 Subarutex

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 07:25 PM

So according to the 2 subaru dealerships in town, the XT6 front control arm bushings do not exist for sale separately. Does anyone have dimensions for them or do I get to be the first to figure that out? :P


this thread is great.. we should move it to retrofitting and mark it for archiving...


There are no seperate part #'s for EA series lower arm bushings. Make your own, or by new arms. You'd be the first. I'm using old rump roast **** ones.

Oh, Andy, get outback struts and springs. Max ride height. No idea how it will affect the CV's though.

#24 baccaruda

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 09:05 PM

i'll measure the height of my stock GL struts when I get them off of my car..

maybe i'll decide that the bushings are in better shape from sitting in my storage unit for a month :P

#25 calebz

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Posted 29 December 2004 - 10:22 PM

this thread is great.. we should move it to retrofitting and mark it for archiving...


Done deal:D




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