rfiglia Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 Hello everyone , ive been a VW person for 12 years . I have always wanted a Subaru . I have a 1 year old and our 2001 Jetta is way to small , back seat is rediculously small ! (Just sold it today) . I put a deposit on a 99 Outback with cold weather package ,cd , automatic, with 70k miles . This is a one owner car (it was traded back to the dealer) I ran it through car fax ,all OK. I talked the dealer down to 9000.00 (around here on Long Island its a good price) We ran the vin through the service dept . and at 53k the timing belt was done the master cylinder was replaced and engine oil pump / o-ring . Since im buying it from a dealer (North Coast Subaru Glen Cove NY) they are going over the whole car sevice want needs to be done and NYS inspection and giving me a 2 month 20000 mile bumper to bumber warranty . This is our first AWD vechicle . I heard the head gaskets fail on this year . Should I stay away from this year ? Can I expect this car to be reliable and last 5 more years ? How can I tell if the headgasket has been replaced ? What is the reliability on the AWD and tranny systems .I read the reviews on edmunds.com and some people love it and some people have big problems . Just need some opinions from real Subaru owners .. Thanks.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmdew Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 Regular mx is the key to long life IMHO. As far as the HG issue, look at the coolant overflow tank for any signs of oil. Make sure the coolant is being sucked back into the radiator when the engine cools. Many of the 2.5 engine go for 150-200K without a problem. Others have seen the HG go early. I like the manual trans over the auto, but that's me. Again regular maintenance clean fluid and you should be good to go. For the price you are paying, it should be in GREAT shape! Later, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 Why was the timing belt done at 53,000 miles? This is a car with a well known, and well documented, engine defect. Why are you willing to pay a premium for this car? If anything, I would expect a substantial discount when buying this vehicle. On Long Island, they might soak you for two grand just replace the blown head gaskets. And that's IF the heads don't warp or nothing else fries when the headgaskets blow. Add in towing, and rental car for the time that the car is in the shop. Subaru won't even acknowledge a problem with the 2.5L DOHC engine, so we don't have exact figures on the head gasket failure rates. But I'll tell you this, they're substantial. There is a reason that Subaru went to the expense of developing the 2.5L SOHC Phase II engine. And even the Phase II doesn't appear to have the same bulletproof reliability of the 2.2L. Screw these jokers. Assume that the head gasket WILL fail and pay accordingly for this car. That way if the gaskets blow you won't be getting up a half hour early every morning to kick yourself. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 Congratulations for asking about his car BEFORE buying it. Most posts go," I just BOUGHT a 99 Legacy, what maintenance issues can I expect with this car?". Be very, very careful, frequently the head gaskets just leak "bubbles" into the overflow tank after a hard run before they finally fail all the way. Not surprizingly, some people are tempted to "dump" the vehicle while the head gasket failure is still very hard to detect. You could test test drive one of these 2.5 SOHC equiped vehicles and never know that the head gaskets were on their way out. If you buy this car, make sure you get, and fully read, the owner's manual. Several posters have had their SOHC engines fail on the way home from the car lot. They then had the cars towed back by two wheels. This destroys the transmission. Probably not the best day of their lives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzam Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 Welcome to the board. If you join the Subaru family, you'll get a lot of info here. I'd consider the car a good investment, but I'd ask the dealer for a warranty up to 100K (in writing) for that price. That's a minimal investment for them and you get some piece of mind. They will probably ask you for some $ to cover the cost, so maybe you can ask them to kick it in for free to close the deal or at least a good discount. Also do a search on this board for head gasket failures. Some have posted costs they have paid for replacement. Then if you get a worst case, you'll know what you could expect. Remember, more disasters tend show up posted here than the satified owners. Good Luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 and they got the SOHC phase 2 in 2000. I keep confusing this because I have a phase 2 1999 Forester which got the SOHC phase 2 a year before the Outback and Legacy. If you have a choice buy a phase 2. At least you get a warranty until 100,000 miles and it does seem like Subaru has solved thier gasket problem. If you buy a Phase 1 I agree with the folks who say figure in a head gasket job or get a warranty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
outback_97 Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 FWIW, that price wouldn't be unheard of here in SLC, that doesn't mean it's not a lot of money. Dude asked why the timing belt was done at 53K, I'd guess the oil pump seals leaked and there may have been concern that oil got on the belt. They had to get in there to do the oil pump seals anyway, and so it would have made sense to do the timing belt early. Just a guess... not too far fetched, considering it happened to mine. I have a 97 OB (same engine as the one you're asking about) with just shy of 110K miles. No HG problems yet, but I watch it very carefully and have to admit I worry about it. But, this is the best car I've owned. It has never left me stranded, is very comfortable and easy to work on, and I enjoy it a lot. Steve Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rweddy Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 Hello everyone , ive been a VW person for 12 years . I have always wanted a Subaru . I have a 1 year old and our 2001 Jetta is way to small , back seat is rediculously small ! (Just sold it today) . I put a deposit on a 99 Outback with cold weather package ,cd , automatic, with 70k miles . This is a one owner car (it was traded back to the dealer) I ran it through car fax ,all OK. I talked the dealer down to 9000.00 (around here on Long Island its a good price) We ran the vin through the service dept . and at 53k the timing belt was done the master cylinder was replaced and engine oil pump / o-ring . Since im buying it from a dealer (North Coast Subaru Glen Cove NY) they are going over the whole car sevice want needs to be done and NYS inspection and giving me a 2 month 20000 mile bumper to bumber warranty . This is our first AWD vechicle . I heard the head gaskets fail on this year . Should I stay away from this year ? Can I expect this car to be reliable and last 5 more years ? How can I tell if the headgasket has been replaced ? What is the reliability on the AWD and tranny systems .I read the reviews on edmunds.com and some people love it and some people have big problems . Just need some opinions from real Subaru owners .. Thanks.. Welcome to the board!! These are great cars, you will love it. I have owned 10 subarus and like my outback the best of any of them. But be aware the 2.5 has HG issues. It is a matter of when not if. But the fix is around $1200 so just build this into the price of the vehicle. So if they go you have the $$ for it and if they do not then you are up that same $$. But other than this these are great vehicles, you will find them to have way less issues than your VWs that is for sure. The only issue with the awd and tranny is some auto’s have solenoid issue that cause the AWD to have torque bind, but do a search on torque bind, I have never owned an auto legacy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ranger83 Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 The headgasket issue is real but over-represented on this board. People who don't have problems don't post here. I replaced my head gaskets, pre-emptively, at 140,000 miles. So if you drive double what the average driver does, you might face it in three years. I have friends with Subarus with 125,000 to 212,000 miles, and two have had headgaskets., out of eight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsrxrsx68 Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 Stay Away. Buy a different model wo HG problems. Sell your '97 too. Get different models without the HG problem. Say you need to spend $1500 on a $5000 or $6000 car. The car is still only worth the same after the repair and there is no improvement to the car, plus how could you even sell it without disclosing the problem? I know many people can but I couldn't. F%$# all the subaru's with this problem, it is total bull@#$$. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyB Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 Just wanted to say that Outback_97 was spot on as to why the belt was replaced, when I had the oil pump seals done at 47k, they replaced the timing belt also due to the oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gnuman Posted January 1, 2005 Share Posted January 1, 2005 Go ahead and get the car, but make them replace the head gaskets with the newly redesigned ones from Subaru and make them give you a 100K mile warranty. Other than the head gasket issue, these are fine cars and you will get a lot of good miles out of it. The AWD tranny in a Subaru is built to be very rugged and reliable. The Auto tranny has a problem with the solenoid that shifts power from front to rear, but the manual tranny is rock solid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ballitch Posted January 2, 2005 Share Posted January 2, 2005 way to go gnuman, finally someone says the obvious and stops saying "dont buy the car, or figure the HG job into the price of the car." If you all dont know Subaru has a new HG out that has some sort of titanium filament that is not prone to leakage, alot of people just dont know or care enough to do research, and it is true, only the people with blown HG's post about it, and it may not happen to you, you can't cast away a whole series of engines and say that they are all bad. I say buy the car, get a 2 or 3 year warranty, if they wont get you one go somewhere else, where your money is more appreciated, remeber, your the consumer, oyu have the money and ALL of the power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gsrxrsx68 Posted January 2, 2005 Share Posted January 2, 2005 Why be their test monkey? The hg is not holding up. I think it is the third or fourth HG for this engine. Are the engineers really so inept that they cannot design a HG? Of course not. If that were the case all HG's would fail. Obviously the HG is not the cause of this problem but is rather the manifestation of the problem. It is true the rest of the car is great, but the cost of the repair to this engine is prohibitive on a higher mileage car. Spending that kind of money on an older car puts the true cost of ownership right in line with owning a new car. I would say buy new and sell when it goes out of warranty or buy a year and model that is proven to be defect free, IMHO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shimonmor Posted January 2, 2005 Share Posted January 2, 2005 I've got a 99 OB with 105k miles and haven't had the HG problem...yet. I'm easgerly anticipating the opportunity to fix this problem. If I was you...I would not buy the car. There are LOTS of used cars out there. Why buy a car that has a pretty good chance of having a HG issue. Why put yourself through the hassle? It's not like there is a shortage of used cars out there. Granted you are always taking a chance with a used vehicle, but hedge your bets towards something that would probably be less of a hassle. Now, if you could get the car dealership to properly repair the HG and give you a warranty, then sure go ahead and get it. But I don't think they will. They are in the business of selling used cars, not in the business of making you happy. If you don't want the Subaru, they will find someone else that doesn't know about the HG issue and sell it to them. Do the level headed, unemotional, and fiscally responsible thing and look for something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiscoStu Posted January 5, 2005 Share Posted January 5, 2005 I have a 99 OB with 120K. Never had a major problem. Just had the timing belt, water pump, seals changed as a preventive measure (ran about $500). Buy it and drive the heck out of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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