Jump to content


Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, my lurker friend!

Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, an unparalleled Subaru community full of the greatest Subaru gurus and modders on the planet! We offer technical information and discussion about all things Subaru, the best and most popular all wheel drive vehicles ever created.

We offer all this information for free to everyone, even lurkers like you! All we ask in return is that you sign up and give back some of what you get out - without our awesome registered users none of this would be possible! Plus, you get way more great stuff as a member! Lurk to lose, participate to WIN*!
  • Say hello and join the conversation
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get automatic updates
  • Get your own profile and make new friends
  • Classifieds with all sorts of Subaru goodies
  • Photo hosting in our gallery
  • Meet other cool people with cool cars
Seriously, what are you waiting for? Make your life more fulfilling and join today! You and your Subaru won't regret it, we guarantee** it.

* The joy of participation and being generally awesome constitutes winning
** Not an actual guarantee, but seriously, you probably won't regret it!

Serving the Subaru Community since May 18th, 1998!

Guest Message by DevFuse
 

Photo
- - - - -

87SubaruGL- Help..Stalled..won't start, blocking drive


  • Please log in to reply
18 replies to this topic

#1 swf

swf

    New User

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 9 posts
  • Connecticut

Posted 23 January 2005 - 02:31 PM

Have 87 GL wagon picked up recently. Is starting fine. New battery. Haven't put on road yet. Put in 5 gallons gas and dry gas yesterday. This morning started, maneuvered, went down drive, back up, down, then backed up driveway in snow..lost power stalled. Turned around went up driveway then as going back down at idle stalled out. Can't start. Cranks, no start. Waited 2 hours. Cranks,No start. Tried start fluid, starts, dies immediately.

Need ideas while sun up. Was 10 degrees last night, 19 now..but started and ran fine.

Where is fuel filter on 87 Loyale wagon? Fuel pump?

How to test fuel pump? Pretty sure battery, starter, plugs ok...

Any locations, tricks welcome.

#2 hush777

hush777

    More Subarus than Kids!

  • Members
  • 388 posts
  • Idaho

Posted 23 January 2005 - 02:57 PM

Some more information please.

Is your car carbbed, or fuel injected.
The fuel pump is located under the car right in front of the rear tire on the passengers side. There is a fuel filter there also, and one under the hood by the drivers strut tower.
You should be able to pull a fuel line on the carb or near the injector and see if you have fuel there. Also check your fuzes, and also you may have to check your fuel pump relay.

Hush

#3 MilesFox

MilesFox

    Catch this Fox!

  • Members
  • 10,482 posts
  • Madison/Milwaukee, WI

Posted 23 January 2005 - 03:22 PM

check the disty to see if the rotor turns when u crank. it may have broken a timing belt if it has sat for a long time. start with that first. if the rotor turns youre good ther. if not you need timing belts

the distributor turning sends a signal to the eci to engage the fuel pump(spfi)

#4 swf

swf

    New User

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 9 posts
  • Connecticut

Posted 23 January 2005 - 03:43 PM

Is carburetor. Also car manual says fuel filter is cartridge and doesn't need to be cleaned????

It's 15 degrees and 20" of snow..crawled along passenger side in front of rear tire..don't see anything..where the hell did they hide it? Also in engine compartment don't see one by driver strut. Aren't they usually opaque whiteish plastic?

Some more information please.

Is your car carbbed, or fuel injected.
The fuel pump is located under the car right in front of the rear tire on the passengers side. There is a fuel filter there also, and one under the hood by the drivers strut tower.
You should be able to pull a fuel line on the carb or near the injector and see if you have fuel there. Also check your fuzes, and also you may have to check your fuel pump relay.

Hush



#5 hush777

hush777

    More Subarus than Kids!

  • Members
  • 388 posts
  • Idaho

Posted 23 January 2005 - 04:10 PM

Is carburetor. Also car manual says fuel filter is cartridge and doesn't need to be cleaned????

It's 15 degrees and 20" of snow..crawled along passenger side in front of rear tire..don't see anything..where the hell did they hide it? Also in engine compartment don't see one by driver strut. Aren't they usually opaque whiteish plastic?


The fuel pump is held on with a bracket that is flat on the bottom. And the fuel filter clips on there also.
Pull the big line going to the carb and see if there is fuel there.

Hush

#6 moosens

moosens

    Psychotic Subathusiast

  • Members
  • 1,267 posts
  • Bridgeport CT

Posted 23 January 2005 - 04:27 PM

If this is a manual shift put it in 2nd gear and with the clutch out use the starter to make the car move.It's ok,even Subaru says so.From your post it seems that was a priority,to move the car.

The fuel filter is located up where you were looking,near the driver's strut.They can be metalic and not plastic,depending on the source of the previous owner.

The fuel pump is under the car up front of the rear crossmember,just under the rear passenger's seat.Follow the lines when you get the nerve to lay down on the ground,you'll see it.

Where in CT are you?I can reccomend someone or help you out a little.I can not do repairs right now,sorry.

Nice little powder snow huh?I haven't gone out yet but I was out last night having some fun before it got too crazy.Very light powder for us down here.

#7 Snowman

Snowman

    Midnight Passenger

  • Members
  • 3,538 posts
  • Haines

Posted 23 January 2005 - 05:58 PM

Actually, the EA82 carbed cars only have one filter. None inside the engine compartment. Pull the line from the carb and see if you're getting fuel. If it sat for a long time, there may be junk in the tank that got sucked into the fuel system.

#8 hush777

hush777

    More Subarus than Kids!

  • Members
  • 388 posts
  • Idaho

Posted 23 January 2005 - 08:57 PM

Got your email.

Yes the filter can be removed without taking down the pump, but it is a pain that way. If things are that rusted I would say yes try to get it out without taking the pump down. The filter goes into a clip that looks like a C and the c points in a weird direction. You will have to feel the filter and the clip to know which way to push/pull to get the filter out.
As for not cleaning, They usually are just replaced, but in a pinch you can take the old one out and blow through it backwards then tap in on something and blow again to get things so they will flow a little bit.
As to where the fuel line hooks up. It goes to the drivers side of the carb.
From the Carb going towards the area behind the drivers strut there are 4 lines.
One of these is the fuel inlet line. Not sure if it is the biggest one there or not. There might be the brake booster line there. So either it is the biggest or the next size. Follow the lines and see where one of those hooks into a steel line (the other big one would go to the brake booster). You might be able to pull the line there and check for fuel.

BTW when you get ready to pull the filter, use a pair or vise grips clamped on the line coming out of the tank to prevent getting a face full of gas.

Hush

#9 swf

swf

    New User

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 9 posts
  • Connecticut

Posted 23 January 2005 - 09:43 PM

THX. Very good instructions. Will try when light out and can work on. Problem is gets dark too early.

One easier thing that might be wrong....already checked fuses (ok) but I hear there is a fuel pump relay inside car. I replaced one on another Subaru.

Do you know where it is? How to tell apart from other relays by color or wire conector colors? Also is there any way to tell if bad by sound when turning car to on position but not cranking?

Any suggestions welcome when you have time.

Thanks,
Steve

Got your email.

Yes the filter can be removed without taking down the pump, but it is a pain that way. If things are that rusted I would say yes try to get it out without taking the pump down. The filter goes into a clip that looks like a C and the c points in a weird direction. You will have to feel the filter and the clip to know which way to push/pull to get the filter out.
As for not cleaning, They usually are just replaced, but in a pinch you can take the old one out and blow through it backwards then tap in on something and blow again to get things so they will flow a little bit.
As to where the fuel line hooks up. It goes to the drivers side of the carb.
From the Carb going towards the area behind the drivers strut there are 4 lines.
One of these is the fuel inlet line. Not sure if it is the biggest one there or not. There might be the brake booster line there. So either it is the biggest or the next size. Follow the lines and see where one of those hooks into a steel line (the other big one would go to the brake booster). You might be able to pull the line there and check for fuel.

BTW when you get ready to pull the filter, use a pair or vise grips clamped on the line coming out of the tank to prevent getting a face full of gas.

Hush



#10 hush777

hush777

    More Subarus than Kids!

  • Members
  • 388 posts
  • Idaho

Posted 23 January 2005 - 10:07 PM

Relays are under the dash, above the fuze box. Clipped into plastic holders.

The one you want I believe is the one with 2 black W/ white stripes and a blue with black stripe and a blue with a white stripe. At least that is the wiring on the fuel injected cars. Also the power for the relay is from fuze 11

Hush
P.S. you could pour some gas down through the pipe in top of the carb and fill up the bowl to run it for 20 seconds or so.

#11 swf

swf

    New User

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 9 posts
  • Connecticut

Posted 25 January 2005 - 10:45 AM

Thx everyone. Really excellent help..very much appreciated. Problem is car 200 feet down drive in snow plus cold wave here..usually zero or below when i can get out. Plus need assistant..so maybe during daylight on weekend if I can find parts. Subaru dealer here can't find fuel pump relay or even part number...still looking at auto parts stores....

Have been spraying PB blaster on bolts etc to make weekend easier.

QUESTION:Found one interesting thing in engine compartment.
Never have worked in there on this car. Unplugged electrical connector.
Does anyone know what this is and does?

Is cylindrical plug with two wires..red and green

on front of engine is metal horizontal plate sitting between power steering fluid reservoir and alternator. On top of this wire runs to front of plate into a small black piece that sits above and hangs down in front of flywheel between steering fluid reservoir and alternator. It is the high flywheel on air conditioned GL.

Is this a sensor? What purpose? (revolutions?)

Don't think it just came loose since other side of plug tucked away (like on purpose)

Thanks,
Steve

#12 hush777

hush777

    More Subarus than Kids!

  • Members
  • 388 posts
  • Idaho

Posted 25 January 2005 - 12:32 PM

I believe that that is the EGR solenoid that you mentioned. Usually the place where one of the vacuum lines hooks up breaks off and you have to re-route the hoses or find a new one (I need about 6 if you find any) so I usually just un-plug the connector.


Hush

#13 moosens

moosens

    Psychotic Subathusiast

  • Members
  • 1,267 posts
  • Bridgeport CT

Posted 26 January 2005 - 12:53 AM

I think this time he means the A/C sensor that hangs over the pulley.

Felt like springtime today after the last few days.

#14 TomRhere

TomRhere

    Certified BRAT nut!!!

  • Members
  • 3,975 posts
  • Hillsdale, Mi. USA

Posted 26 January 2005 - 06:03 AM

Pull the gas supply line off of carb, and place in pop bottle, or simular container. Turn key to "on" position to check for gas flow. The fuel pump should run for a second or two. Do this a couple times just to be sure of fuel flow.

If you have fuel flow, chances are pump and related items are good. This would point towards the float in the carb being stuck shut. It happens.. 'specially on one that's sat for a while. Lightly tap the side of the carb where the fuel bowl is, this may free-up the float.

I say this cause it ran for a bit, then died. Will start, but not run using starting fluid. Just makes me think of stuck float....

#15 swf

swf

    New User

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 9 posts
  • Connecticut

Posted 26 January 2005 - 08:35 AM

Pulled battery and recharged...put in at midnight (full moon).

Went down this morning (storm of 6-inches moving in).

Pulled distibuter wire..have spark..

Pulled off gas line in engine where rubber connects to metal line bottom of driver strut...crank gas comes out steady flow.

Put back together.

Tried start..started..ran couple of minutes..was idling ok for cold....was letting warm up because didn't want to die going up drive and completely block drive.

As deciding, died. Won't start. Decided to leave til storm over.

Now not sure why started but I had been putting pb blaster on bolts under fuel pump, also had tapped with hammer. Also had been 29 degrees yesterday in full sun 8 hours.

Would think this means fuel relay ok, that pump can pump (unless intermittent problem).

Have new sparks to put in and fuel filter. Worried about trying to change fuel filter. CAn't chance taking off fuel pump plate. After 3 days of blaster, tapping with hammer, on first gentle try bolt broke. Noticed on ones hidden by lip that another broken. That leaves one bolt holding all.

Will try start again, if doesn't will pull fuel line again and try number of times to see if getting blocked.

Any other ideas?

Thanks,
Steve

#16 Dog1

Dog1

    USMB Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 51 posts
  • Black Forest

Posted 26 January 2005 - 10:08 AM

If this was a carbed vehicle, I would say that your carberator is iced up internally and you need to put a bottle or two of Iso Heet in it. I had the same problem with my 1984 GL Hatchback and this is what cured it. The new cars can run with water in the gas, but it sure was bad news at 8000 ft in the winter here in Colorado in mine. I still add it to every tankfull I get even though I have a Turbowagon now.

Dog1

#17 swf

swf

    New User

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 9 posts
  • Connecticut

Posted 31 January 2005 - 01:14 PM

Wanna thank everyone for many suggestions..may not be solved completely..but car now back at top of drive by house.

Didn't use any starting fluid. was 37 degrees on Sunday.

Didn't start. Started when poured gas into carb , then died.

Pulledgas line at bottom of driver strut.

Fuel coming out when crank...slow steady stream. Tried number oftimes.

Put some iso heet in number of times in carb.

Still nothing.

Pulled distributor cap, is rotating

Replaced fuel filter leaving plate in place.

No difference.

Pulled fuse. No fuel coming out of line. Put fuse in..fuel coming out of line. Think relay ok. Never found computer under dash.

Finally when checking fuel line again no fuel came out.

Tried again no fuel.

decided nothing to lose..didn't want to try last bolt holding fuel filter plate in place. Had soaked all day pb blaster, had tapped, gently tried to turn..broke off...arghhhhh.

Pulled electric connection apart...12 v juice.

Put together. Felt pump..was running.

Pulled gas line..now gas coming out again.

Got it started..warmed up..conked out few times..finally got it up drive..everything seems fine..but tried few times start..some times starts sometimes not.

So not sure if it was warmth of all day, or pump shaken up when dropped or electrical wire to pump (has duct tape on from previous owner).

However pretty doggone sure is just fuel system carb or fuel pump problem.

Will try during week. Problem is now have no way to attach fuel filter plate to car..just hanging now....any suggestions or analysis welcome.

Thanks all,
Steve

#18 85Sub4WD

85Sub4WD

    EA82 Junkie

  • Members
  • 1,244 posts
  • Raleigh NC/Charlotte NC

Posted 31 January 2005 - 03:33 PM

Drill out the old bolts and tap/use nuts to install new ones.
Sounds like a carb issue to me, but I would triple check all vacuum hoses first.
It may be the fuel pump, and I would try replacing that first because its cheaper and easier. (you won't lose much if the old one turns out to be OK)
It may be a good idea to dump the Hitachi and go with a Weber, they are more reliable and easier to rebuild (cheaper parts-wise too). Or SPFI Conversion!!! :D

#19 Dog1

Dog1

    USMB Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 51 posts
  • Black Forest

Posted 01 February 2005 - 10:56 AM

Steve,
Try pouring a couple bottles of ISO HEET into the gas tank, not the carburator. If you are having the same problem that I had, you might also check to see if the airfilter has an ice buildup on/in it. Mine would get warm enough to get the ice on the filter to melt, then the resulting water would mix with the fuel and freeze up the inside of the carburator. Sorry if I wasn't clear the first time. I had to religiously add a bottle of ISO HEET to the tank everytime I refueled to keep the moisture out of my fuel lines. I guess the cheapest gas station in town isn't the best place to fuel up at sometimes. I hope the solution to your problem is cheap and easy to apply.

Dog1




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users