Jump to content


Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, my lurker friend!

Welcome to Ultimate Subaru Message Board, an unparalleled Subaru community full of the greatest Subaru gurus and modders on the planet! We offer technical information and discussion about all things Subaru, the best and most popular all wheel drive vehicles ever created.

We offer all this information for free to everyone, even lurkers like you! All we ask in return is that you sign up and give back some of what you get out - without our awesome registered users none of this would be possible! Plus, you get way more great stuff as a member! Lurk to lose, participate to WIN*!
  • Say hello and join the conversation
  • Subscribe to topics and forums to get automatic updates
  • Get your own profile and make new friends
  • Classifieds with all sorts of Subaru goodies
  • Photo hosting in our gallery
  • Meet other cool people with cool cars
Seriously, what are you waiting for? Make your life more fulfilling and join today! You and your Subaru won't regret it, we guarantee** it.

* The joy of participation and being generally awesome constitutes winning
** Not an actual guarantee, but seriously, you probably won't regret it!

Serving the Subaru Community since May 18th, 1998!

Guest Message by DevFuse
 

Photo
- - - - -

Looking at 2.2 swap parts on Friday, have some questions


  • Please log in to reply
21 replies to this topic

#1 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 04 April 2005 - 08:28 PM

I am looking for this at the junk yard: a 1990 - 1994 Subaru legacy = engine, ecu, wiring harness, (from a manual tranny car, for the simpler ecu and harness)

Ea82 Subaru gl wagon = 4wd 5 speed transmission clutch & bearings

Also an ea82 turbo fuel pump

I will later get the engine swap kit (i emailed mudrat about it) and the transmission swap kit (i emailed jerry)

My questions are;

Have I left anything out (or gotten anything wrong) of the above list? and is there anything I have to be careful about when looking for parts, like is there a wrong type that won't work of the above list? Especially on the engine, is there any type of 2.2 I should avoid?

subarino used a surge tank, is it necessary?

About the exhaust, mine is the same diameter, but cat-back is not stock, it goes dual right after the gas tank, how could I set this up? get the manifold from the ej22 and adapt it to the old exhaust, or would that be too restrictive?

I listed getting a fuel pump from an ea82 turbo because I read it else where, is this because it is easier to install than the legacy pump? Should I just get the legacy pump instead?

Where can I get a wiring diagram for the legacy engine, I have emailed Kennedy engineering, but does anybody know of another (and free-er) source?

That’s all the questions for now, this looks like a very difficult swap, but I am dedicated to getting this done, my brat needs MUCH more power.

#2 SuBaRiNo

SuBaRiNo

    USMB Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 84 posts
  • Perth Australia

Posted 05 April 2005 - 06:13 AM

As requested... im here to do my part.

It doesn't have to be the ea82 turbo pump. It can be any ea82 efi pump. As long as it's the EFI pump u are safe. The external type is what u need.

Surge tank isn't really needed... if you don't put it in though... u will have fuel surgin issues when cornering under a quarter of a tank. This is because the fuel swishes about in the tank alowing some air to get in the line. EFI engines need a constand feed of fuel with no air... unlike the carby engines. I know people running it without a surge tank and they run find.... i recomend... get it going without it first... add it later.


Exhaust... go with the stock headers of the ej22... then get the rest remade. around 2 and quarter and 2 and a half inch i have found sounds good. Definately use the stock headers... they make a big difference in the note u end up with. I don't know much about which muffler to use. Mine is a walker performance muffler.... but i have performance headers too... this sounds more like a motor cross bike than a subaru.

Legacy pump is an intank pump. That will be hard to fit... u will need to remove your existing tank and highly modify it to drop the pump in.... make your own desicions... but the external pump made a lot more sence to me. There is an awful lot of room under the rear seats (under the car) to mount this.

I may be able to help u out with the wiring diagram.... will try and track down what i can and email it to you. Send me some reminders if i don't get around to it... im rather busy and forgetful. The diagrams i have show full ECU pinouts on where each wire should go and colours. That is what i used wi no prior knowledge to ECU systems. Although if your not handy with electrics please do pay someone to do it... u can damage your ECU if your not carefull.

Don't be worried about it being difficult... i thought it would be.... it's a little tricky but i think it is one of the easiest ej conversions u can do. Take your time to do things right.... if u rush it you will only have to come back and re-do it later.

I hope the adaptor plate u are getting is 12mm thick.

If you have more questions drop me an email or put them in here and maybe remind me to drop back in... i don't come on the USMB that much anymore.

Dave

#3 baccaruda

baccaruda

    YOUR FAVORITE MOD

  • Moderator
  • 6,941 posts
  • SpoVegas, WA

Posted 05 April 2005 - 01:11 PM

Hey Dave, I have a question about the surge tank as well. and thanks for those great pictures you posted a while back, they've been really helpful in mking my own adapter.

My wagon, which is receiving an EJ22 swap, is (used to be :) ) MPFI turbo. I've never seen anything like a surge tank during this and the numerous other times i've taken it apart. Is this something that only has to be added to carbureted cars?

I'd be interested in seeing your wiring diagrams too even though i have the "wrong" car for them :)

thanks
Andy

#4 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 05 April 2005 - 08:11 PM

ok, so just get an ea82 efi pump.

and I am going stock exhaust to the end of the headders, after that I'll make a 2 1/4 inch copy of my old exhaust. (its not stock, but still too small) the old is the same diameter as stock, but it Y's off into dual exhausts right after the tank, with nice chrome tips

while waiting for the reply from bratsrus1 and mudrat, I called a local junkyard, they said 350 for a running enigne with a trade, I am going to hoovers yard to see if he can give me a better deal

I got a reply from kennedy, they said they have the diagram if I am using it on a vw transaxle? how would the transmission matter?

oh hey, when I email through the forums, it sends them a regular email right?

#5 baccaruda

baccaruda

    YOUR FAVORITE MOD

  • Moderator
  • 6,941 posts
  • SpoVegas, WA

Posted 06 April 2005 - 12:28 AM

you also need the gas pedal/throttle cable from the legacy. swap them into your brat (i'm assuming that's the recipient?).

the adapter is not hard to make...
take the bellhousing off of an EA82 motor while you're at the junkyard.
get a piece of plywood that's roughly 13x16".
(line up the bottom edges by standing them up on a flat surface and..)
whack the back of the bellhousing behind each of the two bottom bolts.
your plywood is now marked.
drill out the holes and slide the plywood over the studs.
if the alignment pins are in the engine bellhousing (do yourself a favor and make sure they are) you can use the sledgehammer trick to tap their indents into the wood and drill their holes. keep the pins for your donor transmission.
trace the inside of the engine bellhousing (it's the same shape as the inside of the trans bellhousing).
When you get your EJ22, place the plywood over its bottom bolts. (make sure your previous outline is faced to the engine..)
it is hard to trace around the engine in some spots. here's my trick. get the sledgehammer again and tap on the board all around the outline of the engine enough to impress the wood. trace it with a pen/etc. worked beautifully.
you can mark the top holes by applying some paint around them on the EJ22, and on the EA 5sp when you get it, and facing the template up to the marked holes. it will leave an outline for your holes to be drilled.

i cut my template with a scroll saw; i think i have access to a band saw to cut the aluminum when i get it (this week!)

notice that in subarino's pictures, he seems to have tapped the top holes in the adapter.
MTFBWY!

#6 SuBaRiNo

SuBaRiNo

    USMB Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 84 posts
  • Perth Australia

Posted 06 April 2005 - 05:47 AM

Andy... u shouldn't need a surge tank... there should be internel provisions in your fuel tank to avoid surges. Would only be applicable if the car was originally a carby model.

Andy is dead right with that adapter plate.... is SOOOOOO easy to make.

Dave

#7 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 06 April 2005 - 09:48 PM

yeah its going into my brat

I know I can make the plate, I have a machine shop class here at penn college, I can cut it out there, what I was more concerned about was what else was included in mudrats kit, he says adaptor, drilled out xt6 flywheel (how much better is this over a regular one?)how do you drill the flywheel out? and "vairous mounting hardware" I wanted to know what that was to see if the cost was justified. and I am afraid of screwing it up.

also, do i need bratsurus1's kit to make my ea82 transmission fit? or was it just for cosmetic stock looks.

I have recieved a reply from neither of them yet.

updated list:

legacy - engine&stuff, ecu, wiring, throttle cable/pedal, exhaust headders.

ea82 - flywheel (if I don't get his kit), bellhousing & all the clutch stuff, transmission, driveshaft. (repair manual says I need it)

can you look for that diagram subarino? the guy at kennedy is giving me a hard time, and I think it was written specifically for going to a vanagon

subarino, what "heavy duty clutch" did you use on your car?

AND... you modified the ea81 radiator
"Used existing radiator... modified with tripple core and inlets were made larger and bent in the appropriate directions"

how was that acomplished, especially the tripple core?

#8 bratsrus1

bratsrus1

    Race car

  • Members
  • 1,286 posts
  • Selah Washington

Posted 07 April 2005 - 12:16 AM

Hey bud This is Jerry, i emailed you 2 days ago about the kit for the 5 speed. If you want your brat to look stock then this is for you. But if you want to make up something your self then do it. Myself i like the stock look it really works for me and other people that's gotten one of these kits. This kit alows you to unbolt your 4 speed and bolt in the 5 speed its that simlpe. I don't push this on anybody you make up your own mind. Thanks Jerry

#9 bratsrus1

bratsrus1

    Race car

  • Members
  • 1,286 posts
  • Selah Washington

Posted 07 April 2005 - 12:23 AM

Hey AKIRA This is Jerry, if you look under Northguy"s post titled drive train almost complete. Read the post that tells it all about the 5 speed kit. Thanks Jerry

#10 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 07 April 2005 - 02:48 PM

oh crap, thas why I didn't get any mail back from you two, it got sent to my old yahoo email account, which has been deactivated for a long time now.

could you resend it to arachiss@aol.com?

#11 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 07 April 2005 - 03:01 PM

ok, i mailed both of them about what happened, and gave them my working email address

#12 SuBaRiNo

SuBaRiNo

    USMB Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 84 posts
  • Perth Australia

Posted 08 April 2005 - 08:00 AM

Im not sure why u guys are playing wih the CV shafts. My ea81 shafts slid straight on. They should be the same for you guys... unless there is something im missing. Havne't had any problems with mine yet.

Still looking at getting the wiring info i have for you guys... stay tuned. I have a couple of different diagrams on it that i used.

My clutch is a performance type....ummm not sure on the brand... i will have to get back to you on that... sorry.

Radiator was done by a radiator mob who ordered in the tripple core especially for me. Outlets were enlarged to equal the coolant inlets on the engine and bent to alow raditor pipes to fit correctly. I belive the top pipe was modified to bend on a 45 degree angle down towards the engine and the bottom pipe was angled at a 45 up towards the engine.

Flywheel.... get an ea82 flywheel and sit it on your EJ22 engine. You will see they are VERY close... and the cneter collor on the ej engine fis perfectly into the ea82 flywheel. This makes it perfectly center and works as a locator.

You can see the bolt holes are only a few mm out. You can use a die grinder to modify the bolt pattern to make it fit. Don't worry about making it not center... the center color on the engine makes it impossible to fit wonky. U will see what i mean when u attempt it.

Dave

#13 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 08 April 2005 - 08:49 AM

I was leaning toward getting the kit and using an xt6 clutch, probabaly almost as good as the performance one.

well, I am heading off to the yard, wish me luck

#14 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 08 April 2005 - 08:51 AM

oh and do you think I would have any problems using the stock radiator and just rebending the pipes? no tripple core I mean


would a legacy radiator fit in there?

#15 SuBaRiNo

SuBaRiNo

    USMB Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 84 posts
  • Perth Australia

Posted 08 April 2005 - 09:03 AM

I do know of people using the Legacy radiator but i think u have to do A LOT of work to make it fit.

I stadard core should be ok... as long as u rig up the appropriate electric fans. I wouldn't suggest a standard core in an L series though.... these have less air making it through the front grills making them a little hotter. Talk to your local radiator store about it... they should be able to point u in the right direction. The exta $$$ i parid for the triple core i have never regreted... never once had over heating issues.

If you can affrod to get the kit for the flywheel then i would do that.... but if your tight on money and want to give it a blast yourself then give it a go. Really is easier than it looks.... im a more of a wire man myself... i can;t even weld and i manged to pull it off.

Dave

#16 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 09 April 2005 - 04:36 PM

I went to the yard yesterday, he ddn't have any legacy engines, I asked what he would charge for one with everything on it, with the ecu and wiring, he said, $140!!!!!

anyway, the next least expensive is 350 with trade and no eco or wiring

so I am going to check in with this guy every once and a while untill he gets one.

#17 turbophoon

turbophoon

    New User

  • Members
  • PipPip
  • 10 posts
  • Sandy

Posted 10 April 2005 - 09:23 PM

I have recently been given a brat and am looking at doing this same swap.
AKRIA if you could snap some pics of what you are doing to make this work it would help me out a lot. Also how much was your swap kit you got form mudrat? SuBaRiNo when you find the wiring info would you please send the diagrams to me also marq84004@yahoo.com .
Thanks alot guys:)

#18 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 12 April 2005 - 05:07 PM

I haven't done anything yet, I can't find a decent legacy.

mudrat forgot to email me the cost of the kit & shipping - but from his origonal thread he said it was $525. the shipping would be expensive because of the weight of the flywheel and the size of it and the adaptor

yes, SUBARINO! when you get your diagrams, plaese email to arachiss@aol.com
DO NOT USE MY EMAIL ON THE BOARD -IT DOESN'T WORK.

I am going to try an add in the paper to find a rusted out legacy with a decent engine.

#19 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 12 April 2005 - 06:55 PM

I may have found one sheap, but out of state.

but I have to find a diagram for a 93 legacy automatic then

#20 ballitch

ballitch

    Certified Subaru Nut

  • Members
  • 999 posts
  • Salem, OR

Posted 12 April 2005 - 07:08 PM

if that guy qouted you only $140 for ecu, motor, and wiring harness, i would wait, i spent $520 on those three things alone, granted my motor was in perfect running condition and not questionable at all. the guy at kennedy didnt give me a hard time when i emailed him and got the info for the EJ22-Vanagon conversion, dont even mention putting it into another subaru. as subarino said use any type of MPFI EFI fuel pump, the external kind, a breeze to wire up, i wired mine up to a toggle switch so i can cut fuel in a hurry if need be. if you decide to go the DIY route on clutch stuff cool, your going to need the XT6 pressure plate and clutch disc, and new throwout and pilot bearings, best take your EA82 flywheel to mudrat and ask for the XT6 spec grind, well worth it, im going to do that once i get the flywheel off the motor, do all this while motor is out of car. go to G.I. Joes, get the flexible type radiator hoses, get a 15'' and a 17''-18'' one, with 1 1/4'' I.D. i beleive, the longer one goes on the bottom, it will take some muscle to get the motor side of the radiator hoses on, use a soap/water solution, helps alot. i suggest fabbing up some sort of a pitch stopper for the motor,i used one from a legacy and made a bracket to go onto motor. run some grounding cables from motor to chassis, and tranny to chassis. if i were you, i would get a 5 speed D/R tranny, better gearing and takes more power abuse than the 4 speed, if it'll work in a RX turbo, itll work for an EJ22. and dont try to cut any corners on the wiring, TAKE YOUR TIME, cant stress that enough. good luck.



~Josh~

#21 SuBaRiNo

SuBaRiNo

    USMB Regular

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 84 posts
  • Perth Australia

Posted 13 April 2005 - 05:17 AM

I don't mean to sound rude at all... but you stated not to take short cuts on the wiring... and u have used a toggle switch for the fuel pump wiring. Im not sure if you are aware of this but...

The ej22 ECU has a fuel pump wire that is used to trigger a relay for the fuel pump... this is a safety procedure so that if there is an engine problem or accident the pump stops straight away. You can damage other parts of your fuel system by not having this hooked up also but putting extra pressure on your fuel lines and components when it doesn't need to.

Dave

#22 AKIRA

AKIRA

    USMB Reverend

  • Members
  • 614 posts
  • Jersey Shore (Central) PA

Posted 17 April 2005 - 11:45 AM

ballitch, so did you use the stock radiator? any problem with it




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users