MyLegacyIsDoomed Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 hello... during a couple of recent drives, my wife's '96 legacy wagon has sudden lost all power...meaning, all gauges go kapput, no power steering, no a/c, etc. there are no "check engine" indicators when this happens (or any other warning lights)...it just suddenly shuts off. when trying to restart, the starter doesn't catch until at least the third or fourth time. the starter actually tries to catch but never does (it's not just a quick click)...also, the throttle seems very "puttery" (for lack of a better word...okay, maybe "rough") once it does get going. again...this is very random. it happened the first time a couple of weeks ago, then was fine. yesterday it went nuts again and must have stalled at least 6 times in about an 15 minute period...barely got us back home. right now it's at the shop...to me this is clearly electrical. it's possible it could be related to the kill switch on the alarm. if anyone has experienced this strange phenomena, please share you solution... thanks, -jason Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtsmiths Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 Sounds like a bad ground. Check the block to frame ground strap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoobdude Posted May 23, 2005 Share Posted May 23, 2005 block to fram gound would not be culprit for gauges though would it? i would say, check battery and check connection at starter and alternator. on most cars, if you disconnect the starter the circuit cannot complete. next time it happens turn on your headlights. if they work then its probably aa ground inside the car to your main harness or accessory harness. good luck and keep us posted. Joe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forester2002s Posted May 24, 2005 Share Posted May 24, 2005 And check that the battery terminals are tight. A loose battery terminal could give you intermittent loss of electrical power, and might cause the starter symptoms that you have described. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLegacyIsDoomed Posted May 24, 2005 Author Share Posted May 24, 2005 well...the shop suspects a defective battery. apparently this brand (kirkland/costco) has been a recent problem on other cars. so we bought a new battery and they're driving the car around today to see if it happens again. hopefully that's all it is... thanks for all the replies... -j Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLegacyIsDoomed Posted May 24, 2005 Author Share Posted May 24, 2005 ummm...okay. after replacing the battery and the mechanic driving it around a bit with no problem, the moment my wife drives away, not 10 minutes goes by and it craps out again. WTF?!? clearly not the battery itself...the connection? ground issues as mentioned before? hmmm...the mystery continues... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 Next time the engine stalls, see if the headlights, gauge lights, and electrical accessories operate normally. Because, if they do, then the failure is most likely in the engine's electrical system. For example, an intermittent HV ignition pack could cause the problems you described, could it not? In fact, several posters have reported hairline cracks in the ignition pack that caused them to operate imtermittently. Buy, borrow, or steal a digital volt meter. When the engine stalls check the voltage at various points on the engine. Or see if the spark plug is getting voltage, ie sparking. There are a number of ways to skin this cat. However, many mechanics can be counted on to pick the way that requires the least possible effort on his or her part, and the greatest possible expense on your part. Shocking, isn't it? Instead of a diagnosis, replacing the battery was a guess. And a pretty lousy one at that. Maybe replacing the gas cap will fix the problem. Hell, you just never know, do ya? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoodsWagon Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 DO NOT USE A MULTIMETER TO CHECK SPARK! instant death to multimeter. definiately aquire one though. Check breakable things, like the fuse for the ECU and the fusable links. a cracked one could cause things like this. Check the engine block to frame grounds as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiny Clark Posted May 25, 2005 Share Posted May 25, 2005 The '96's had an alternator service bulletin put out on them. Did this shop check the output of the alt?? You haven't seen your brake light come on, have you? If so, my alt did the same thing. Recall is WXX81 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLegacyIsDoomed Posted May 26, 2005 Author Share Posted May 26, 2005 thanks 4 the replies and info... well...after the mechanic noticed a loose connection to the ignition switch, he tightened it, but once again it has done it...happened again today while stopped waiting for a left turn out of a driveway. i hit the left turn signal...and...kapput. interesting things is...after about 5 or 6 tries of restarting (chug, chug, chug)...one of those "chugs" cut out even though i was still engaging the key in the ignition position trying to turn it over...first time it's done that...usually keeps trying to turn over. the mechanic suspects a bad ignition switch...but, of course, isn't totally confident in that diagnosis. i will list what all of you have wrote and have them check each of them (they say they've checked block to frame..and it's okay). would it be a waste of time to go to a subaru dealer and have them run a diagnostic on it? this seems so buried and random that maybe the mighty computer might show something...i dunno. anyhow...if anyone thinks of anything else not already listed...please share. thanks again... -j Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLegacyIsDoomed Posted May 29, 2005 Author Share Posted May 29, 2005 so, now i'm told that unless the "check engine" light comes on when the car stalls, the good folks at the subaru dealer can't hook up the diagnostic computer to check the problem. it'll be done the old fashioned way... this really blows...because often what happens is we leave it with someone and it almost never happens while they drive it. it's so inconsistent... apparently, the last mechanic i brought it to checked everything you all mentioned here...not sure if i believe that. one strange, but possibly totally unrelated this is the right-rear brake light (the larger one below the windshield wipers) is out...doubtful it's related to this, but as you can see i'm reaching for anything at this point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 I would check the fusible links for an intermittant connection problem. Something in the main power buss appears to causing this to happen. Tapping on suspected areas with a screwdriver handle while the car is running may help track this problem down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stu Baker Posted May 29, 2005 Share Posted May 29, 2005 Not my wifes 96 but my 93 would die out everytime I would turn something on. I would wait, say 15-30 minutes later then Try and start it again. Once it was started it would run/drive slugish for about a mile and die out again. My problem was the alternator. Basically my alternator was junk and was not doing any charging. Don't know if this helps or not. ALWAYS check the "easy" things first. sambo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLegacyIsDoomed Posted May 30, 2005 Author Share Posted May 30, 2005 thanks guys... well, this is interesting...it stalled twice after engaging the turn signal...so, what we did was left the key in the "on" position and tapped the steering column area around the turn signal and ignition. suddenly all the lights came back on and we could start the car. yep...i believe we're on to something...FINALLY. could it be the ignition switch? i'll definitely look into the fusable links...although my mechanic said he "checked everything you guys mentioned." doubtful...i say. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ccrinc Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 It could definitely be the ignition switch. Heck, some of the electrics on these things are so weird...one example I know of is to turn on the lighted vanity mirror on passengers side and the tranny will act up...every time! Emily http://www.ccrengines.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 Since tapping near the ignition switch seemed to help it is very likely the ignition switch is the culprit, though it may be a connection to the switch instead of the switch itself. Emily, I would suggest making a ground jumper with one end tied to the battery ground and then touch grounded areas with the other end to see if you can fiand a grounding problem. When things act like what you describe it usually means there is a bad ground. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forester2002s Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 I would suggest making a ground jumper with one end tied to the battery ground and then touch grounded areas with the other end to see if you can fiand a grounding problem. When things act like what you describe it usually means there is a bad ground. If you do this (with a ground jumper), just be VERY careful not to touch the ground jumper onto any live (12V) terminal. Otherwise you'll get one heck of flash, and probably blow some fuses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted May 30, 2005 Share Posted May 30, 2005 a large ring of keys. The car would die on the owner but not when he left one key for the mechanic. Worn ignition switchs are common and can be a pain. A bad ground or positive connection can do the same thing. If tapping the steering column seems to affect it you may have found it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLegacyIsDoomed Posted June 4, 2005 Author Share Posted June 4, 2005 oh, dear....here we go again. after replacing the ignition switch...and a day of driving fine in cooler weather...it happened AGAIN. straight-up dead stall...loss of power. now, as i've mentioned before, it's usually taken a physical act (such as using a turn signal, etc.) to get it to stall. this happened again, BUT, when i was pulled over with the hazards going (remember, all other lights, gauges go kapput), the gauges and dash lights, etc. came back on with NO MOVEMENT or ANY BUTTONS/SWITCHES/ETC. being touched. THEN, within a few seconds...KAPPUT...again, with NO MOVEMENT or ANY BUTTONS/SWITCHES/ETC. being touched. one important thing to note is this always happens in warmer weather. but it happens within a few minutes of starting the car and driving it. unbelievable... i highly, highly doubt the good, honest mechanic checked EVERYTHING you guys mentioned...so, wish me luck...as i do my best to troubleshoot this nightmare...and, please, if anyone thinks of anything else...do share. oh, another strange possible far-reaching connection. the auto door locks have worked very sporadically for a while when using the driver lock that unlocks all others. it takes a few tries before it unlocks all the doors. may have absolutely nothing to do with this, but it's electrical and makes wonderful noises when it happens. also, the beep you hear when the key is in the ignition and you open the door is cuts out quite a bit. lots of strangeness...so i'm looking for any possible connection... i will check all things you've mentioned before myself... vive le rawk, -j Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slegacy96 Posted June 4, 2005 Share Posted June 4, 2005 I had heard of this happening before to one of my co-workers, minus the part about the complete guage failure, and my understanding was that the coil pack needed replacing. However I dont see how you performing a physical action would relate to the pack. Just something to ponder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dude Posted June 4, 2005 Share Posted June 4, 2005 It's your car, so do as you please. But when you get serious about fixing this problem get a DVM (digital volt meter) and a schematic of the car's electical system. When the car has stalled, and will not restart, is the best time to troubleshoot the problem. When the car is stalled, does anything have power? This could be as simple as a loose connection or a loose fuse connector. If your car stalls on a busy highway you could have a serious problem. You could be just guessing and replacing parts for a long time. I don't know why, but it bothers me to see you going through all this, when some time with a DVM could at least point you in the right direction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLegacyIsDoomed Posted June 4, 2005 Author Share Posted June 4, 2005 But when you get serious about fixing this problem get a DVM (digital volt meter) and a schematic of the car's electical system. will do... When the car is stalled, does anything have power? the only thing that has power are the hazard lights...nothing else seems to work. and i can't check headlights because when the ignition is off under normal circumstances, the lights don't come on (it's one of those automatic dealies). thanks for the additional info... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 Have you checked the fusible links for a loose connection yet? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevetone Posted June 5, 2005 Share Posted June 5, 2005 ...oh, another strange possible far-reaching connection. the auto door locks have worked very sporadically for a while when using the driver lock that unlocks all others. it takes a few tries before it unlocks all the doors. may have absolutely nothing to do with this, but it's electrical and makes wonderful noises when it happens. also, the beep you hear when the key is in the ignition and you open the door is cuts out quite a bit. lots of strangeness...so i'm looking for any possible connection... I don't have an answer for your initial problem, but my '95 Legacy does the same thing with the door locks -- it comes and goes on no predictable schedule. So, I would guess that it is not related. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLegacyIsDoomed Posted June 5, 2005 Author Share Posted June 5, 2005 Have you checked the fusible links for a loose connection yet? not yet...wish me luck as i'm a complete novice when it comes to car guts. i'm beholden to the ever *trustworthy* chilton's manual [rolls eyes]... btw...aside from the one i found in the fusebox under the hood (that looks similar to this ), are there other fusible links that can clearly be pointed out to me? i know, i know, my naivete oozes out with each passing word...we all have to start from somewhere though...thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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