frag Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I'm about to replace front discs, calipers (reconditionned) and pads on my car. I will also install special «ONE MAN» bleeder screws. I cannot find any reference to a torque value for bleeder screws. Do you just screw them in «hand tight»? There seems to be a rubber seal inside where the pointed end of the screw is going to seat. I'm afraid I might damage this seal if I torque them too much. TIA for all replys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smurfmiata93 Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I hav installed a set of Speedbleeders in my '99 OBW. for the front I believe they use an 8mm wrench. I tighten that short little 8mm wrench pretty much as tight as i can and everything should be fine. On all of the calipers I have worked with the bleeder screw is tapered on the end and makes contact with a matching taper in the caliper - no gasket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferret Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 If these are the 'Speed Bleeders', they are torqued to the same as the factory. 8Nm / 0.8Kgf-m / 5.8ft-lb. Any others I would torque to the Factory Specs also unless they indicated differently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frag Posted August 9, 2005 Author Share Posted August 9, 2005 Thanks for the info guys. And I had a closer look and you're right the seats are solid, no rubber there. Just a special coating maybe that made it look like rubber. And I guess some teflon tape around the threads would be in order? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adnan Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Hi, I don't believe teflon tape is a good idea on bleeder threads. Teflon tape is used for pipe threads, which have a taper to them. They seal by driving the taper into the seat and hence can use help in the form of teflon tape to both seal and to prevent binding. Bleeders use a seat at the bottom to achieve a seal and tape on the threads will do more harm than good. Regards, Adnan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crashton Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 I use a set of Speed Bleeders on my Miata. They worked great the fist couple of times I used them. After a few uses the sealer on the treaded part wore out. Buy a bottle of the sealer from them so you can clean & then reapply the sealer restoring their function. Don't use teflon tape.Chuck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frag Posted August 9, 2005 Author Share Posted August 9, 2005 I use a set of Speed Bleeders on my Miata. They worked great the fist couple of times I used them. After a few uses the sealer on the treaded part wore out. Buy a bottle of the sealer from them so you can clean & then reapply the sealer restoring their function. Don't use teflon tape.Chuck Yea, on the Speed Bleeders the threads have to make a seal cause you have to back off the idle screw 1/2 a turn for them to be able to operate. Why not use teflon tape for that purpose? Adnan, what harm could teflon tape do? TIA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottbaru Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Teflon tape voids the warranty of most industrial hydraulic machinery. It's good on water and gas pipe. The problem with tape in hydraulics is that bits of tape sometimes end up in the hydraulic fluid and eventually in something critical. We use teflon paste in the industry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adnan Posted August 9, 2005 Share Posted August 9, 2005 Teflon tape voids the warranty of most industrial hydraulic machinery. It's good on water and gas pipe. The problem with tape in hydraulics is that bits of tape sometimes end up in the hydraulic fluid and eventually in something critical. We use teflon paste in the industry. Exactly right! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tcspeer Posted August 10, 2005 Share Posted August 10, 2005 I agree no tape. I just tighten mine down a little more than snug and have never had them leak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jib Posted August 10, 2005 Share Posted August 10, 2005 And I guess some teflon tape around the threads would be in order? No, the bleeder has an integral metal on metal seal. Do not use teflon tape. jib Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottbaru Posted August 10, 2005 Share Posted August 10, 2005 No, the bleeder has an integral metal on metal seal.I think the Speed Bleeders rely on threads to seal during bleeding, he needs a thread sealant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frag Posted August 10, 2005 Author Share Posted August 10, 2005 To tcspeer, jib and scottbaru, the problem with speed bleeders is not holding a seal when the bleeder is closed, it's holding a seal when it's open. There is a one way valve inside those bleeders (probably a ball with spring) that prevents air or old fluid reentering the system when you release the pedal. If the threads do not seal, air will enter the system when i release the pedal. I just found a special yellow sealing tape a little heavier than regular white teflon tape and able to witstand 500°F. Would'nt that be OK to keep a seal on the threads when the bleeder is open 1/2 a turn? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tcspeer Posted August 10, 2005 Share Posted August 10, 2005 Sorry Frag, I was thinking stock bleeder screws, Iam not sure I have ever seen the ones you were asking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevetone Posted August 10, 2005 Share Posted August 10, 2005 Hey, why not use duct tape? Seriously, just use the factory sealant and be done with it -- why take a chance on some mickey-mouse solution with the braking system? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frag Posted August 10, 2005 Author Share Posted August 10, 2005 Sorry Frag, I was thinking stock bleeder screws, Iam not sure I have ever seen the ones you were asking about. They are undistinguishable from the stock ones seen from outside. They have a check valve inside that opens and let the fluid out when you press the brake pedal with the bleeder slightly open and that closes and prevents air entering the system when you release the pedal. It's suposed to be easier and faster to bleed the brake system with these bleeder screws when you're alone to do the job. I'll know for sure when I try them in a few days. That's why the threads must keep a seal when the bleeder is open, i.e. when the but end of the bleeder screw is no longer in contact with the seat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottbaru Posted August 10, 2005 Share Posted August 10, 2005 Can you get new factory sealant? I think the problem is the sealant isn't good after a couple loosenings. Loctite PTFE anaerobic thread sealant is good to 400F, maybe that'd work? I might try it myself with a vacuum bleeder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevetone Posted August 10, 2005 Share Posted August 10, 2005 Can you get new factory sealant? I think the problem is the sealant isn't good after a couple loosenings. Loctite PTFE anaerobic thread sealant is good to 400F, maybe that'd work? I might try it myself with a vacuum bleeder. http://speedbleeder.zoovy.com/product/THREADSEALANT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevetone Posted August 10, 2005 Share Posted August 10, 2005 Can you get new factory sealant? I think the problem is the sealant isn't good after a couple loosenings. Loctite PTFE anaerobic thread sealant is good to 400F, maybe that'd work? I might try it myself with a vacuum bleeder. I wouldn't be as worried about the temperature range as I would be about brake system (i.e., fluid) contamination. When the vehicle is on the road and the temperatures are up, the system is closed, and the thread sealant cannot get to the brake fluid. It's when you are in the process of bleeding the system that contamination can occur. I'd make sure that anything you put on the threads is compatible with the brake fluid and rubber seals of the brake system. Like I said, just go with the speed bleeder sealant and move on to the next challenge... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve530 Posted August 10, 2005 Share Posted August 10, 2005 Does anyone use a Motive Powerbleeder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottbaru Posted August 11, 2005 Share Posted August 11, 2005 I made my own powerbleeder from a MTB innertube: -cut the tube across -roll and clamp one end closed -hose clamp the other end over the (full) brake reservoir -pump up the innertube, gently pressurizing the reservoir -open bleed screws and flow some brake fluid -check reservoir level and innertube pressure -repeat I've had good luck on my VWs and Audis with this, but there wasn't enough pressure for my Landcruisers. All I had was a latex tube, I really needed a heavy-duty rubber innertube for more pressure. It's not as good as manual pumping, there's something better about the surge of pressure getting things moving. It is easier on the master cylinder I suspect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frag Posted August 11, 2005 Author Share Posted August 11, 2005 Maybe worth mentionning that I remember someone here giving what I think is good advice about pedal pumping when bleeding the system and specialy when replacing all of the fluid : do not pump the pedal down to the floor on an old car cause the pistion in the master will get past its usual course and might damage its seal on a ring of oxydized materail or other crap. I intend to put a piece of 2X4 under the pedal when I'll bleed and replace the fluid in a few days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jib Posted August 11, 2005 Share Posted August 11, 2005 I own four vehicles and use the wife method for bleeding brakes. She get a magazine and reads, while pumping on command. It's a lot more expensive than speed-bleeders <grin>, but works really well most of the time. Jack Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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