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Clutch rebuild questions


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8 replies to this topic

#1 tomson1355

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Posted 08 November 2005 - 12:45 PM

1998 Forester 5 spd. 147000 miles. Clutch started smelling and slipping. On getting it apart, I found a bad pilot bearing with several balls missing. The plate and disk look OK to me but I'm an inexperienced judge. I'll know more when the new parts arrive ($113 on EBAy for a clutch kit!) so I can compare. There seems to be some wear on the snout. Do I have to sweat this? Does anyone know the spec for it's diameter?

There is some oil inside the bell housing. Should there be none? It isn't clear if it came from the separator cover, which is plastic and is oily, or the rear main seal, which looks good but did have a little bit of oil around it, or possibly the transmission, which is low on oil (The dipstick is easy to find with the engine out! I'd wondered where it was!). Is the tranny ever the source?

Last: What is the purpose of machining the flywheel, and is it necessary?

Thank you for taking the time to reply. I'd be lost without USMB.

Tom

#2 quantum500

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Posted 08 November 2005 - 12:57 PM

How low is low? I just did a input shaft seal and it would hold just enough oil to touch the dipstick with the seal leaking badly. On your clutch wear question, is your clutch hydraulic or manual? Could of came out of adjustment to slip like that. Is it wearing on the little brass rivots? That is a usually a good indicator of a worn clutch. The snout? Do you mean the fingers that the throw out bearing come against? There has to be some wear there. That is what disengages the clutch when you push the pedal. Machining the flywheel is to get it back into spec if it is warped. Did you notice it jerking when you would engage it? If not and its not scored from the clutch going too far I wouldn't worry about that part of it. Good deal on the clutch kit by the way.

#3 tomson1355

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Posted 08 November 2005 - 01:03 PM

How low is low? I just did a input shaft seal and it would hold just enough oil to touch the dipstick with the seal leaking badly. On your clutch wear question, is your clutch hydraulic or manual? Could of came out of adjustment to slip like that. Is it wearing on the little brass rivots? That is a usually a good indicator of a worn clutch. The snout? Do you mean the fingers that the throw out bearing come against? There has to be some wear there. That is what disengages the clutch when you push the pedal. Machining the flywheel is to get it back into spec if it is warped. Did you notice it jerking when you would engage it? If not and its not scored from the clutch going too far I wouldn't worry about that part of it. Good deal on the clutch kit by the way.


There is still oil on the dipstick, but it is below the low mark. Of course,. I do have the front of the car several inches in the air. Clutch is hydraulic. By the snout I mean the area of the transmission shaft that lives inside the pilot bearing. The clutch operated smoothly and the flywheel appears unscored.

Enjoyed your description of the tranny rebuild, BTW. I'm not chicken, either, but head gaskets and clutches first, tranny rebuilds later. It's all new to me.

thanks for the reply.

Tom

#4 Gnuman

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Posted 08 November 2005 - 01:09 PM

You replace the pilot berring anyway, so I would not sweat the snouth too much unless there is a discernable difference in thickness. Not all of the snout goes into the pilot berring, so if the pilot siezed up that would be where the wear came from. The oil seperator should be replaced with a metal one (get one from an early model EJ22, it is an exact match, only metal) as the plastic ones have a tendancy to fail. Yours is suspect. what color is the rear main seal? if is black, it should be replaced with the brown one. Likewise if it has any nicks in it. where is the oil most heavily concentrated? there should be no oil in this area. I would get the flywheel machined to remove all chance that it has been contaminated by the oil, and to give you a good surface for the clutch to "bite" onto. If the oil is in the transmission side, I would be concerned about the input shaft seal, if it is on the engine side then the source is likely the oil seperator ir the rear main seal.

#5 tomson1355

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Posted 08 November 2005 - 01:29 PM

Most of the oil is on the transmission side. The pressure plate, disk and flywheel are dry. There is a fair amount of oil on and around the separator cover. The RMS is brown with a few drops of oil around it that looked like it dripped there.

The Haynes suggests that a bad pilot bearing could cause excessive shaft movement and, therefore, an input seal leak. Or is that too much to hope for?

Thanks, Tom

#6 Gnuman

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Posted 08 November 2005 - 02:37 PM

Most of the oil is on the transmission side. The pressure plate, disk and flywheel are dry. There is a fair amount of oil on and around the separator cover. The RMS is brown with a few drops of oil around it that looked like it dripped there.

The Haynes suggests that a bad pilot bearing could cause excessive shaft movement and, therefore, an input seal leak. Or is that too much to hope for?

Thanks, Tom


No, not at all. That pilot berring is definitly blown, and could easily have caused enough play to account for some leakage. I'd have to look at the seal to see if it can be replaced without tearing down the tranny. IIRC Quantum500 just did something like this. Perhaps he will cime in with advice on that seal. . .

#7 tomson1355

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Posted 08 November 2005 - 04:58 PM

Well the good news is that the clutch kit arrived today, one day after ordering it. The bad news is that the new pilot bearing fits sloppily on the transmission input shaft, indicating too much wear on the shaft from the bad pilot bearing. I guess I'll be doing some transmission work, too.

Thanks for all the help.

Tom

#8 tomson1355

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 09:02 AM

Before I do anything drastic, I figure I better exhaust all possibilities.

To recap: The clutch pilot bearing was blown on my forester, and the input shaft on the tranny, where it sits in the pilot bearing, is worn. It's worn enough so that when I slip the new pilot bearing on the shaft, it has enough play so that I am able to wiggle it around. I assume it should be a snug fit, or else it will just tear up the bearing again, right?

Has anyone seen this before? Are there any solutions other than to install a used/rebuilt tranny or rebuild the tranny with a new input shaft? Does Subaru have an undersized (smaller hole) bearing?

I'm trying to avoid pulling the tranny, too.

Thanks, Tom.

#9 cookie

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 01:16 PM

If there is a large bearing supply house near you drop in and ask if they have a repair slieve for your application. I have heard on the net of a kit for this but that was a couple of years ago. The best fix is a new mainshaft, perhaps from a junkyard tranny.




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