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diesel subaru?


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52 replies to this topic

#1 Jack in Norfolk

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Posted 30 September 2003 - 01:23 PM

Is there any such thing? I was just thinking with Fuji Heavy Industries being the builder and all.....
I wonder if anything would swap in like a forklift motor or something?
Or maybe they built a diesel model for overseas. I dont know.
But just think, with all the low end torque they already have.
On the other hand, that may be the only way for a subaru to be any slower!

#2 archemitis

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Posted 30 September 2003 - 01:32 PM

it would be slower than a bicycle and only rev to 2500 rpms. i think it would suck alot.

#3 Jack in Norfolk

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Posted 30 September 2003 - 01:35 PM

what about a turbo diesel?

#4 Dennis ex24

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Posted 30 September 2003 - 02:09 PM

deisel justy availible in europe

do a search for it

#5 Snowman

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Posted 30 September 2003 - 04:45 PM

You could turbocharge a Toyota 2.4 diesel (easy, just bolt on the turbo from the gas turbo motor), and swap that into a car like Unhatched. Even without a turbo, the 'yota diesels have plenty of power if you've got the gears to keep it in the powerband.

#6 Flowmastered87GL

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Posted 30 September 2003 - 05:03 PM

Originally posted by archemitis
it would be slower than a bicycle and only rev to 2500 rpms. i think it would suck alot.



But think of the torque possibilities!! :eek:

#7 scopetone

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Posted 30 September 2003 - 06:23 PM

They have them in England, I remember this article about Brits using a gallon of cooking oil because it was cheaper than a gallon of diesel. The bobbies catch them cause they can smell the car fumes, distinctively french frieyyyy.

http://www.guardian....,807299,00.html

Hey anyone into IMPORT/ EXPORT.?

#8 PHATBRAT

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Posted 30 September 2003 - 08:13 PM

Diesel justy? That must get like 65-70 miles a gallon. They are lighter than a rabbit!!!

#9 electryc_monk

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Posted 01 October 2003 - 12:01 AM

remembered hearing of a subie dude doing research in machining an EA81 for diesel reconstruction.

did some google tunneling... rear "somewhere" - don't remember where - that there was something in South Africa being done.

dug some more. Found a few Subaru sites in S.A. and actually got a couple legit replies from these Subaru businesses. One in particular replied with logical curiousity. I replied with a more indepth explination of what i was doing (kinda leaned alittle on the truth) as i was using my university ID and saying that I was considering it as a MAsters project in a physics program. This one place said it was an admirable idea and was very interested in the idea cosidering the specifics i had spit out for them. most of this stuf was from the stuff I had found on the net that others had "talked about back then". the below section are the only parts I vocalized as what "I" was looking into and leaning towards.

RE: thicker sleeves and possibly studs into the sleeves themselves for support of the high CR and keeping a modest turbo from the RHB5 design or something similar. Conservative estimates of a 1.6 design was expressed aat which point the reply was ... keep in touch Because we may be trading notes if we find time to play with the idea down here.

well sad to say i lost their email ID as that PC died last year and took the HD with it.

and, that is all i can remember to this idea/thread/design/et al.

#10 Setright

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Posted 01 October 2003 - 12:16 AM

Subaru doesn't have any Diesel engines in it's range. Something I am very proud of :D

The Euro Subaru with a Diesel engine is a rebadged Suzuki Swift, and I say it doesn't count!

Diesel is filthy. Turbocharging a Diesel engine only makes it more filthy, since the particle size drops in the even higher combustion temperature, the carcinnogenic little bits can cross straight through human lung tissue and into the bloodstream.

It's popular in Europe because there is less tax on Diesel fuel. All the other arguments are phony. I challenge anyone to bring one up :brow:

#11 electryc_monk

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Posted 01 October 2003 - 12:45 AM

BN and SF Railways have a LNG coverted diesel locomotive system in full use.
Many companies world wide are designing bio-diesel or bi-fuel deisel engines systems.

That being a diesel engine converted to run some persentage of diesel and the rest either Propane,CNG, LNG, LPG, or some other blend.

there are Net communities that i have book marked somewhere that are very strong backing in the R&D of LEV and ELEV (Low Emissions Vehicles and Extremely LOw E. V.'s)

sooo yeah its sooty and yes it is bad but, isn't there a difference between the blends and refining processes of diesels now and those of old? I believe that there is even a bit of higher level refinement done in Europe (due to the death of the Black forest et al) that made a manditory sulphur reduction to something less then half the US diesel sulphur emission levels of today.... so how (firstly) wrong am I and how wrong might though be?

anyone else????

#12 Guest_taprackready_*

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Posted 01 October 2003 - 01:16 AM

(due to the death of the Black forest et al) that made a manditory sulphur reduction to something less then half the US diesel sulphur emission levels of today.... so how (firstly) wrong am I and how wrong might though be?

anyone else???? [/B][/QUOTE]

Sulphur lubricates, Low sluphur does not. California has low sulphur diesel fuel and a higher percentage of injector pumps needing to be rebuilt. Cost of injector pump rebuild can be as expensive if not more expensive than a gas engine rebuild. Any part associated with a diesel engine is two or three times as expensive, such as starters, water pumps, injectors.

I say gasoline all the way.

Bill

#13 Frank B

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Posted 01 October 2003 - 05:47 AM

There are reports that there is a diesel EA81 powered forklift made for japan only. I have seen it posted here, try a search.

#14 Setright

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Posted 01 October 2003 - 09:14 AM

Poor old Rudolf Diesel, did you know he comitted suicide from an English Channel ferry? Sometime around 1912, I think. His "Compression Ignition" engine patents were running out, and no-one had made any progress on the engine.

Even so, I still think Diesel engines are filthy. Rudolfs first test engine, a giant single cylinder of several litres displacement blew up, by the way.

However, these fabulous engines do have applications. Jobs that require constant rpm and provide a constant load are ideal. Things like ships and trains are well suited to running on Diesel.

Cars however.....no way. Only thing that makes modern Diesels bearable in cars is the fact that they are turbocharged. I couldn't live with an engine that turns gutless over 4000rpm.

#15 Snowman

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Posted 01 October 2003 - 01:28 PM

Diesel cars actually do really well, it just takes a different driving style in order to keep the rpms within the range that it makes massive torque. Why do you need to rev it up if it makes a bunch of torque at low rpm?

#16 soobme

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Posted 01 October 2003 - 01:50 PM

My input, a turbo D. would kick a$$ in an off road Subaru!!
But after MUCH reserch on the mater, the closest DOABLE solution I found was to get the Kenidy adaptor for an EA82 up to a VW bus trans, and then use a Vanigon D. power plant. But all that is, is a rabbit D. engine laying on it's side. That would be hard to fit in the engine bay and still keep the steering sys. where it is. And it's NOT a Subaru power plant!:banghead:
If ANY ONE can come up with some hard facts on the mytical EA81D that is " in use in south Africa" or " a Japan only eangine" I would LOVE to see it. If it exists it CAN be brought to the US one way or another. But alas, I think the lepricons have them all in there hover fork lifts:brolleye:

#17 reoff

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Posted 01 October 2003 - 04:41 PM

Originally posted by Setright
Subaru doesn't have any Diesel engines in it's range. Something I am very proud of :D

The Euro Subaru with a Diesel engine is a rebadged Suzuki Swift, and I say it doesn't count!

Diesel is filthy. Turbocharging a Diesel engine only makes it more filthy, since the particle size drops in the even higher combustion temperature, the carcinnogenic little bits can cross straight through human lung tissue and into the bloodstream.

It's popular in Europe because there is less tax on Diesel fuel. All the other arguments are phony. I challenge anyone to bring one up :brow:



This is true. No Subaru diesels, at least automotive, and probably otherwise too.

I however will bite on the Diesel being a bad thing stuff. Diesel, traditionally anyway, is a "bad" thing as far as human health is concerned. But there is more to the story.

1 - Diesel takes MUCH less energy to refine, and burns more efficiently than regular gas.

2 - The lower refinement is largely responsible for the "particulate matter" that is bad for our lungs. Similar to asbestos in its effects.

3 - A Turbo-D is usually much more efficient than a naturally aspirated diesel. I have had both, and the turbo is much better for smoke too.

4 - Power with a diesel is relative. Instead of high horsepower, you have massive amounts of torque in a narrow band. Very nice if you know what to do with it.

5 - There are many ways to "clean up" a diesel. In mine, I ran B-100 Biodiesel. That, of course, means 100% Biodiesel. The stuff I used was made from virgin soybean oil, and was actually beneficial to air quality. Even running B-20 cuts down on harmful emissions on a diesel by roughly 55%. That kills the "dirty" stuff.

6 - You can add a secondary fuel system to run as much as 10% CNG in any diesel. This bumps up the efficiency even further, due to higher temps, AND lowers harmful emissions by quite a bit.

Just my thoughts... I love diesels,
Rich

#18 scopetone

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Posted 01 October 2003 - 05:31 PM

Why not put a Raddit diesel in you Sube (with the help of ken...), put it rightside up their dinky it should clear the hoodline. If it sticks out into the grill area do the 80's Audi 4000&5000 trick, have two mini rads looped on each side of the motor.

#19 Setright

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Posted 02 October 2003 - 01:13 AM

Snowman: My EJ22 is usable from 1500rpm up to 6500rpm (yes,yes, things don't start to really get moving until 2500rpm)

A "good" TD will pull produce it's max torque from say 1500rpm up to about 3500rpm.... and then tail off dramatically. Not just talking out of my rear, I have driven many.


So, I would rather have 5000rpm to play with, instead of just 2000rpm. ESPECIALLY during overtaking, no time for stirring the gearstick, see?

Reoff, I gotta run, but will be back soon to offer my counter point :D

#20 bushbasher

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Posted 02 October 2003 - 01:43 AM

it would matter if you only had 2500 good rpms to play with if you had the same gearing as a gasoline car. If you change the gearing, the torque is converted to rpm, and you can get the same acceleration through a gear, and the same speed range. The engine rpm will just increase less per speed increase.

And reoff, though your points are good, I don't see how burning biodiesel could be beneficial to air quality. It's not like it sucks in pollution and spits out air. Any spent fuel ejected into the air is bad, because good air means it has nothing in it.

#21 Hondasucks

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Posted 02 October 2003 - 01:54 AM

ACtually, diesel engines do burn more efficiently than gas engines do. Why do you think that Diesels were exempt having catalytic converters until well into the 80s (Probably earlier in CA though) MY 82 Rabbit has no catalyst. Less HC and less CO emissions, NOx emissions arent' that much less. Most of the "dirty" stuff that diesels put out is particulates (Soot) which can be avoided by proper tuneups and maintenace, and not loading the engine down, shifting properly, etc...
Aside from the smell, the smoke, and the noise, I'd take a diesel over a gas engine any day.

#22 IsraBrat

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Posted 02 October 2003 - 02:59 AM

Hey guys.
as far as diesel engines, I heard that Subaru is going to
put their first diesel engine in the new Legacy.
anyway here in Israel the Subaru can come with a special
gas adapter wich can use cooking gas and still use the regular
fuel system (push button).
I don't know whats the cooking gas price is in the states but in Israel it's about 1/3 of the fuel price.
as far as pollution the gas is much cleaner then both diesel and gasoline.
some reports even says that the engine has more with the gas then the gasoline.
I would have bought the system but I have a carb. engine (94 Brat) so I don't think I can use the system.

#23 electryc_monk

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Posted 02 October 2003 - 12:31 PM

your refering to the CNG or Propane kit?

(smirks to self) "Wow a 1994 Brat, wonder how much dsign change has happened for this car?"

http://www.altfuels.com/

http://www.afdc.nrel.gov/

http://www.alternatefuels.com/

and those came from this search:
http://www.google.co...8&start=50&sa=N

#24 Tin Soldier

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Posted 02 October 2003 - 12:43 PM

I say anyone who can make a diesel out of ea82 or ea81 is a genius. I would buy two then promptly convert them to run on used frech fry grease. I could care less about the emmissions since we don't have testing here and enuff d*** trees and moutains to stop the stuff anyhow. Besides better to burn the old grease then to dump it in the river. :)


I once read where a guy did that with a diesel volvo or vw. He would haul a trailer once a week around to all the mcdonals, burger kings and so on and take it home and run it thru some strainer/cleaner. Put a bit of diesel in it for good measure and run it. :)

#25 Jack in Norfolk

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Posted 02 October 2003 - 05:18 PM

I've read about this too. I think it was in the book "Ship of gold in the deep blue sea." The book is about a guy who figured out how to salvage sunken ships in 8000' of water. The diesel part was discussed when the book was talking about what he was like in college. He had an old benz wagon diesel that he had set up to run on fryer grease. He found over time that if he collected the fryer grease from nicer resturants the car ran better. The nicer resturants changed thier grease out more often and thus had fewer impurities.
There was another fellow who drove across the states in a Diesel Benz powered by hemp oil.
If you read up on Rudolf Diesel you should find that his goal was to produce an engine that could be fueld by the average farmer, i.e. primative biodiesel. No surprise that the oil companies quickly put this idea to the side.
I have doccumentation on Rudolph Diesel's theory, I just have to find it. It was in the local Seattle Sailing publication 38 North last year. If any of you seattlites happen to pick it up.
I know from a mariner's point of view diesel is worlds safer. Gasoline is very unstable. Diesel is much safer to have on a boat or ship or in any moving vehicle or in any situation where an open flame could be encountered or the fuel container could be compressed. Not to mention that diesel engines last much longer and are much more efficient.
My buddy has an f 350 with 35s and he still gets 30 mpg. Most subarus struggle to get that (although they should.)




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