tjZ06 Posted December 27, 2005 Share Posted December 27, 2005 you're not raining, you're bragging and comparing apples to oranges. congratulations. Yeah... I'm bragging. Actually, I went out and bought a Z06 'vette just to come to a Subi board and brag about it... it's my validation in life. Yup, that's pretty much why everyone I know $70,000 on a Z06 Corvette - operating economy. First of all, I have about half that in my car (it's a '02 I bought used). I'm very interested and enthusiastic about Subis. And no, the Z06 is not economical to operate on a daily basis, even if the mileage isn't that bad. Oil changes w/ synthetic every ~2,500miles, $1k clutches, $415+mount/balance/shipping/tax each for my back tires etc. That's why it sits at home 6/7 days of the week and I drive my '89 MazDUH pickup. But the 'DUH doesn't really have anything to offer in the way of driving enjoyment. But a lifted GL on Swampers would for me. Or maybe a 2.5 RS if I can stretch the budget that far. My point in my post (if you read the whole thing, rather than just reading the section you quoted and took out of context) is that I'm considering the very same motor swap into a GL and I was hoping to still see mid-20s mpg. Perhaps if I left the EJ22T bone-stock? -TJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted December 28, 2005 Author Share Posted December 28, 2005 My point in my post (if you read the whole thing, rather than just reading the section you quoted and took out of context) is that I'm considering the very same motor swap into a GL and I was hoping to still see mid-20s mpg. Perhaps if I left the EJ22T bone-stock? -TJ My EJ22T is virtually stock. Other turbo legacy guys don't see much better....if you run separate engine management, you could probably get better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjZ06 Posted December 28, 2005 Share Posted December 28, 2005 My EJ22T is virtually stock. Other turbo legacy guys don't see much better....if you run separate engine management, you could probably get better. Interesting, and thanks for the input. Will an NA EJ22 hit mid 20s mpg? Regardless, very nice power on an almost stock EJ22T. I suppose it's worth the extra bucks at the gas pump. -TJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted December 28, 2005 Author Share Posted December 28, 2005 Interesting, and thanks for the input. Will an NA EJ22 hit mid 20s mpg? Regardless, very nice power on an almost stock EJ22T. I suppose it's worth the extra bucks at the gas pump. -TJ Yeah, an n/a EJ22 should have no problem hitting mid 20's. When my car was FWD & automatic (higher final drive ratio) and I drove sanely, I'd get high 20's or low 30's on the highway. With the AWD & 5MT and in town, 23-26 was sort of the normal. I think I've got some papers of my old mileage if you're interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjZ06 Posted December 28, 2005 Share Posted December 28, 2005 Yeah, an n/a EJ22 should have no problem hitting mid 20's. When my car was FWD & automatic (higher final drive ratio) and I drove sanely, I'd get high 20's or low 30's on the highway. With the AWD & 5MT and in town, 23-26 was sort of the normal. I think I've got some papers of my old mileage if you're interested. Interested, but not worth you going to a huge hassle. If it's quick/easy to find that'd be cool but don't put too much effort in. I'm sure a lifted GL would be significantly worse than your leg' anyway. -TJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted December 29, 2005 Author Share Posted December 29, 2005 I think I have some laying around. I'll look this evening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted December 29, 2005 Author Share Posted December 29, 2005 Here's some numbers for the one sheet I found quickly 22.46 mpg 19.04 mpg 24.62 mpg The last two tanks with the turbo have been 16.52 mpg 20.30 mpg My numbers may be off slightly due to a tad shorter overall tire height then stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted December 29, 2005 Author Share Posted December 29, 2005 Here's some video of the car on the dyno. I unfortunately didn't get any video during the pulls. Please right click and save as. (8.46mb) http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8080/subaru/media/legacydyno1.avi (1.52mb) http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8080/subaru/media/legacydyno2.avi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjZ06 Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Here's some numbers for the one sheet I found quickly 22.46 mpg 19.04 mpg 24.62 mpg The last two tanks with the turbo have been 16.52 mpg 20.30 mpg My numbers may be off slightly due to a tad shorter overall tire height then stock. Thanks again! It looks like the 2nd Turbo tank was much better. More freeway driving? Or perhaps the computer just needed some time to adapt to the new setup? I didn't follow your swap in detail (though if you have links I'd like to) but I imagine you're using the EJ22T computer? One would think its calibration would be pretty close since the chassis swap shouldn't have effected things too much. But who knows. EDIT: just clicked the link in your sig... good stuff! -TJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted December 29, 2005 Author Share Posted December 29, 2005 Thanks again! It looks like the 2nd Turbo tank was much better. More freeway driving? Or perhaps the computer just needed some time to adapt to the new setup? I didn't follow your swap in detail (though if you have links I'd like to) but I imagine you're using the EJ22T computer? One would think its calibration would be pretty close since the chassis swap shouldn't have effected things too much. But who knows. EDIT: just clicked the link in your sig... good stuff! -TJ Yeah the second tank was some more highway driving, plus I wasn't driving around full throttle everywhere In addition to what's on my main site, all the pics for the motor swap can be found here (I think I posted these) http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8080/subaru/images/ej22t/ Yes I'm using the stock ej22t computer. I think the stock computer runs a little on rich side, which contributes to the less-then-stellar gas mileage. You can see evidence of this from the a/f ratio curve while I was on the dyno. Also, that curve is post catalyst, so the a/f ratios are probably still a little higher then that. I'm planning to swap MAF sensors, which will give me some additional room for accurate air flow measurement with higher air flows. When I do that and get the intercooler on, I'm going to have things tuned to bring the a/f ratios into line a little better. Power should increase as well as mileage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tjZ06 Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Yeah the second tank was some more highway driving, plus I wasn't driving around full throttle everywhere In addition to what's on my main site, all the pics for the motor swap can be found here (I think I posted these) http://www.main.experiencetherave.com:8080/subaru/images/ej22t/ Yes I'm using the stock ej22t computer. I think the stock computer runs a little on rich side, which contributes to the less-then-stellar gas mileage. You can see evidence of this from the a/f ratio curve while I was on the dyno. Also, that curve is post catalyst, so the a/f ratios are probably still a little higher then that. I'm planning to swap MAF sensors, which will give me some additional room for accurate air flow measurement with higher air flows. When I do that and get the intercooler on, I'm going to have things tuned to bring the a/f ratios into line a little better. Power should increase as well as mileage. Especially on a turbo car I think it'd be worth the time/effort to weld a bung in your exhaust pre-cat for a wide-band o2. Does your dyno facility have a wideband o2 or do they just use the sniffer in the tailpipe? Hopefully the former not that latter. Anyway, good work and I'll check that other link. Thanks. -TJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted December 30, 2005 Author Share Posted December 30, 2005 They just have a tail pipe wide band....or at least that's what they used on the dyno day. They probably have a wide band, but weren't using it on the dyno day. I am probably going to get a wideband sensor that has a simulated narrow band output so I can leave it in all the time, and still make the ECU happy. We'll see though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACE Posted January 28, 2006 Share Posted January 28, 2006 SWEET! My sled still has more horsepower though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natoe Posted January 29, 2006 Share Posted January 29, 2006 can i ask what your plannin to tune it with? whats the best combo with a wideband? those are really great numbers, now if only i could get my tps to work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted January 29, 2006 Author Share Posted January 29, 2006 can i ask what your plannin to tune it with? whats the best combo with a wideband? those are really great numbers, now if only i could get my tps to work I've got the perfect power 6 from rallitek. However I've been having issues with hesitation/stumbling. Some other guys are having issues as well. So we'll see if I keep it or try something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natoe Posted February 1, 2006 Share Posted February 1, 2006 it seems that bmxpunk tuned out his hesitation after he put the sti 550's in. does the PP get rid of things like fuel cut since the ECU is pretty limiting? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted February 1, 2006 Author Share Posted February 1, 2006 it seems that bmxpunk tuned out his hesitation after he put the sti 550's in. does the PP get rid of things like fuel cut since the ECU is pretty limiting? Fuel cut is based on boost pressure. The perfect power does not alter the boost signal to the ECU. You can get an external fuel cut defender to trick the ECU. I'm still reluctant to say the 550 injectors 100% solved his issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natoe Posted February 2, 2006 Share Posted February 2, 2006 Fuel cut is based on boost pressure. The perfect power does not alter the boost signal to the ECU. You can get an external fuel cut defender to trick the ECU. I'm still reluctant to say the 550 injectors 100% solved his issues. yeah it would make sense that they would make hesitation worse if anything. you cant hook up a boost controller to the PP and have it read boost? i thought it could handle one more sensor or something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted February 2, 2006 Author Share Posted February 2, 2006 yeah it would make sense that they would make hesitation worse if anything. you cant hook up a boost controller to the PP and have it read boost? i thought it could handle one more sensor or something. I think you may be a little confused. The PP can read boost pressure, I'm doing that. It also has an optional output to control an extra injector. You can use this output to control the stock boost controller solenoid. However you have to program in all the PWM settings yourself. I'm sure with some time and tweaking, you could get it right, but for me right now, I'm not messing with it. Plus it'll probably give you a CEL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted February 6, 2006 Share Posted February 6, 2006 What kind of turbo did the EJ22T have and what years were the Legacy Turbos available in the US? I LOVE my 300 hp / 325 flbs., 2.3 L Turbo, intercooled, inline, four SAAB 9000 Aero 5-speed! Mitsu. TD-04 baby, and 3" cat and exhaust! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legacy777 Posted February 7, 2006 Author Share Posted February 7, 2006 The stock turbo legacy came with the IHI VF11 turbo. The first gen turbo legacies were available from 91-94. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 Were they intercooled and what kind of boost did they make in stock form? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Natoe Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 non-intercooled and 8.7psi factory. that extra injector was what i was thinkin of, i think i get it now, cool. my friend is going to do a bunch of editing his e-prom on his DSM, he gets to learn some basic hex yipee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meeky Moose Posted February 7, 2006 Share Posted February 7, 2006 just to chime in, i have a 93' turbo legacy.. saw 20-23 mpg on the feeway on my last road trip (65-80 mph avg) all stock and 115k.. no hesitations, or anything, just smooth power.. now in town i am seeing like 17-19mpg.. gas mileage ain't great, but thats the nature of the beast.. i need to get some exhaust work done though.. where and how much?? lol btw.. i do love being able to do a 200 yard burnout in fwd mode all the way through 2nd gear with my automatic, on brand new dry pavement .. accidentally left one across 3 lanes of traffic pulling out and trying to get over into the turn lane real fast.. forgot it was in fwd.. never saw a z06 do one that long.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortlid Posted February 8, 2006 Share Posted February 8, 2006 non-intercooled and 8.7psi factory. that extra injector was what i was thinkin of, i think i get it now, cool. my friend is going to do a bunch of editing his e-prom on his DSM, he gets to learn some basic hex yipee SWEET what will they pump if you intercool and what kind of boost can they take in stock form?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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