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Changing Timing Belt


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44 replies to this topic

#1 PetterFan

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Posted 07 August 2006 - 09:59 PM

Looking in the manual, the step-by-step brings up tool ST499977000.
It says, "Using Holding tool ST499977000 or equivalent, remove the bolt that secures the crankshaft sprocket and remove the sprocket."

What is tool ST499977000??

thanks, Phil

#2 rweddy

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Posted 07 August 2006 - 11:20 PM

Looking in the manual, the step-by-step brings up tool ST499977000.
It says, "Using Holding tool ST499977000 or equivalent, remove the bolt that secures the crankshaft sprocket and remove the sprocket."

What is tool ST499977000??

thanks, Phil

You do not really need this tool, you can break the bolt loose using the breaker bar and the starter.

#3 porcupine73

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 07:27 AM

Hi Phil. That tool has like four prongs on it that fit into the holes on the front of the crank pulley. You can get it from subaru.spx.com, but I think it's over $150. I just used a huge chain wrench from Harbor Freight and a breaker bar, and it was tight, I estimate it took me 250-300 ft-lbs to break it loose.

I haven't tried the starter method, where you brace the breaker bar against the the garage floor or body of the car and bump the starter to break the bolt loose, but I hear it works pretty well.

When reinstalling the crank pulley, it is very very important to get the crank pulley bolt installed correctly. If it loosens up and the crank pulley starts wobbling on the crank, it will probably damage the keyway (not good).

The tool I found worthwhile is the cam sprocket holding tool; I think I bent one of the cam sprockets by using a chain wrench on it. If you want to replace the cam seals you'll have to remove the cam sprockets.

Also you might want to check other threads for other things to check out while the timing belt is off if you're not already aware such as oil pump o-ring, cam seals, crank seal, water pump, etc.:)

#4 Dickensheets

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 08:47 AM

Looking in the manual, the step-by-step brings up tool ST499977000.
It says, "Using Holding tool ST499977000 or equivalent, remove the bolt that secures the crankshaft sprocket and remove the sprocket."

What is tool ST499977000??

thanks, Phil


Find the flexplate access hole on the rear of engine. Remove dust cap, insert large screwdriver. This locks engine from rotating. Remove all bolts with old belt in place. This holds everything still. No expensive tool required.

rd

#5 kimokalihi

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 09:23 AM

Autozone. They hook you up. You can go there and rent a chain wrench for 20 bucks or maybe it's 18 and if you don't want it, bring it back when you're done and they'll give you your money back and it's free to rent it. Or don't bring it back and keep it. I kept mine. Comes in handy sometimes.

#6 mikeshoup

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 09:39 AM

OR, if the engine is still in the car and its a manual, put the car in 5th (yes, 5th), and pull the parking brake. There will be some slack in it, but only to a point. Works for me whenever I need to take the crank pulley bolt off.

#7 rlsimpso

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 11:58 AM

I did the timing belt in my 98 Legacy 5spd a few months ago. I had mine in 5th, on rams, with the wheels chocked. With a 4 foot pipe on the end of the breaker I was able to move the car quite easily.

I found the parking break could use some help. If you have a second person, have them sit in the car and hold the brakes on.

I have used an impact on auto engines. Use a good universal joint and be sure to keep clear of the AC condensor.

There is not much space even with the rads out, so the breaker is probably the best way to go.

The starter bumpers are much more courageous then me.:)

#8 rweddy

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 04:09 PM

I did the timing belt in my 98 Legacy 5spd a few months ago. I had mine in 5th, on rams, with the wheels chocked. With a 4 foot pipe on the end of the breaker I was able to move the car quite easily.

I found the parking break could use some help. If you have a second person, have them sit in the car and hold the brakes on.

I have used an impact on auto engines. Use a good universal joint and be sure to keep clear of the AC condensor.

There is not much space even with the rads out, so the breaker is probably the best way to go.

The starter bumpers are much more courageous then me.:)

If you use the starter method (have done this many times) just be sure you have a good breaker bar and socket. I have tried the 5th gear, parking brake with little success.

#9 porcupine73

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 06:08 PM

Here's a pic of how I got the crank pulley off on '00OBW auto. The chain wrench is Harbor Freight, I think it was $20. Used piece of old drive belt to protect crank pulley from chain damage. Had to put piece of pipe on breaker bar to get it loose. -Louis :)
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#10 tcspeer

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 06:16 PM

I have this same tool and yes it works good you dont even need a helper to hold anything their is enough leverage to take it off by yourself.

Here's a pic of how I got the crank pulley off on '00OBW auto. The chain wrench is Harbor Freight, I think it was $20. Used piece of old drive belt to protect crank pulley from chain damage. Had to put piece of pipe on breaker bar to get it loose. -Louis :)
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#11 PetterFan

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 11:42 PM

Thanks for all of the responses. I think I'm ready to change it now, before it breaks and destroies my interference engine.

#12 hohieu

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Posted 08 August 2006 - 11:52 PM

Cover the inside face of the condenser with cardboard in case your breaker bar slips. You don't want to have to repace that pricey part.

Good luck.

#13 sixstar97

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 06:32 PM

Use A 2ft. breaker bar with 24mm socket. there is enough room to rest the breaker bar on the fender well right next to the battery. Unplug the coil and "hit" the key a few times to break the crank pulley bolt free. It has to bee a 2ft bar and nothing else.

#14 jmickelct

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Posted 09 August 2006 - 08:50 PM

Hi,

Just back from picking up parts, to do the timing belt (plus) in my 1996 OBW 2.5 EJ25 DOHC.... Since this is my first time through (will be *very* happy if I dont have to get *too* much experience), have combed several postings and combined here, with the following list of things that various folks have suggested to do "while you're in there".....

Parts listed (for other newbies) are all OEM from a local (CT) discount Sub dealer.. (they said their online discount is 20% and they gave me 25%, and their prices are very comparable to those listed at 1stsubaru.com). Seem to be about to be cheapest I could find.

Basics, timing belt (get cover gaskets, just in case old ones are oil swollen), water pump, thermostat and gasket, spark plugs (and gaskets),valve cover gaskets, valve cover breather gaskets, cam seals (4), spark plugs, spark plug gaskets, crank pulley key, oil pump O ring (opted out of replacing the oil pump itself, after I heard the parts list total!), front crank seal (in oil pump), and then , again just in case, the idlers and tensioners and adjuster (which rings the price up quick!).

TIMING BELT $67.00
WATER PUMP $71.12
THERMOSTAT $11.21
THERMOSTAT GASKET $2.57
OIL PUMP O RING $2.06
FRONT CRANK SEAL $5.55
CAM SEALS (4) $24.04
TIMING BELT COVER GASKETS $31.36
TENSIONER $92.02
TENSION ADJUSTER $59.29
TOOTHED IDLER $76.23
SMOOTH IDLERS (2) $112.42
SPARK PLUGS (4) $50.64
SPARK PLUG GASKETS $18.16
VALVE COVER GASKETS $15.82
VALVE COVER BREATHER GASKETS $11.84
VALVE COVER "BUTTONS" $29.28
CRANK PULLEY KEY $1.74
SUB $682.35
TAX $41.87
GT $724.22!!!

I already have purchased both v\drive belts (AC, Alt, etc...), upper and lower radiator hoses, antifreeze (actually the Sub Dealer guy threw in a gallon on my way out the door, little things like that are nice..)


In addition

Permagasket UltraGrey
Rust breaker fluid PB Blaster
Draining Pan
White paint, marker (for timing clarification)
Loctite blue\medium
Coolant system anti-leak sealant
Distilled water
22mm socket and 24" Breaker bar
Torque wrench (loaner?) FtLbs and InchLbs
12, 14mm sockets and range of extenders, knuckles
Gasket remover
Alcohol (to wipe down grease)
Engine degreaser (car wash before..)
a few well placed prayers..

Coming up fast on $1k (incl tools); (hoping I wont need all of the idlers), but, if I succeed in fixing more things than I break, it will be a well spent couple of days.

(BTW, this site rocks!).

John

#15 porcupine73

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Posted 10 August 2006 - 11:31 AM

Wow John that looks like a pretty good list. Looks like prices weren't too bad either! But wow it does add up fast! I never add mine up b/c I don't want to know...

I just did pretty much that same list for the first time also. Things I learned were to loosen the cam pulley bolts before removing the old timing belt, or get some cam pulley holding tool (maybe $60). Make sure all bolts are removed from oil pump before prying on it like a mad man, else get new oil pump for $100 (whoopsie on my part :clap:). Check the screws on the back of the oil pump rotors' rear cover for back out, maybe tighten and use some locktite. Put oil pump back in before putting water pump in; i had some trouble with oil pump hanging up on that rubbery thing on the water pump. Make sure crank pulley bolt is retightened properly - don't want that thing to loosen up! Clean around valve covers before removing; I got a lot of grit down in there on mine (but I have a plan to flush oil through before restarting).

#16 jmickelct

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Posted 10 August 2006 - 07:55 PM

Thanks Porcupine,

Yes, I plan on Gunking off the whole engine before I start and, since the weather is looking to be very nice this weekend, plan on going very slowly, to make sure I have some sense of what I'm doing.

The cams are the one part that are still something of a mystery (those and the spark plugs!) (stopped by local Sube dealer today for coolant additive and to see if I could sweet talk the use of the cam holder tool for the weekend.... that got lots of laughs...).

Since I am gunning for the valve cover gaskets, an hoping that it wont go too badly, since I can at least see whats flailing around.

Fingers crossed..

-John

#17 porcupine73

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Posted 11 August 2006 - 07:02 AM

Sounds like a plan. I need to do valve cover gaskets and stuff on '96 Legacy after I finish '00OBW; but wondering if there's any risk of those lash adjusters losing prime or whatever in the process?

From what I see on other posts here, you might be able to get away without the cam holder tool if you break loose the cam sprocket to shaft bolts before removing the old belt. Do you have the DOHC engine, cause if so the cams should be locked from turning before removing belt?

The valve cover gaskets were pretty easy to do on '00OBW, there were I don't know 6 to 8 bolts to take off, and they weren't in very tight. I was a little wrestle to get the cover out and off 'cause it has to come out over the spark plug silos, I think I dropped them out the bottom instead of pulling out through the top. Taking out the battery, washer fluid tank, all that air intake stuff made it a lot easier. The gaskets are different than I expected; they push the long way into a groove in the valve cover gasket which holds it in place.

#18 brus brother

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Posted 11 August 2006 - 07:11 AM

John,
Parts seem reasonable and service appears satisfactory. What's the name of the supplier you used in CT?
Good luck this weekend

Hi,

Just back from picking up parts, to do the timing belt (plus) in my 1996 OBW 2.5 EJ25 DOHC.... Since this is my first time through (will be *very* happy if I dont have to get *too* much experience), have combed several postings and combined here, with the following list of things that various folks have suggested to do "while you're in there".....

Parts listed (for other newbies) are all OEM from a local (CT) discount Sub dealer.. (they said their online discount is 20% and they gave me 25%, and their prices are very comparable to those listed at 1stsubaru.com). Seem to be about to be cheapest I could find.

Basics, timing belt (get cover gaskets, just in case old ones are oil swollen), water pump, thermostat and gasket, spark plugs (and gaskets),valve cover gaskets, valve cover breather gaskets, cam seals (4), spark plugs, spark plug gaskets, crank pulley key, oil pump O ring (opted out of replacing the oil pump itself, after I heard the parts list total!), front crank seal (in oil pump), and then , again just in case, the idlers and tensioners and adjuster (which rings the price up quick!).

TIMING BELT $67.00
WATER PUMP $71.12
THERMOSTAT $11.21
THERMOSTAT GASKET $2.57
OIL PUMP O RING $2.06
FRONT CRANK SEAL $5.55
CAM SEALS (4) $24.04
TIMING BELT COVER GASKETS $31.36
TENSIONER $92.02
TENSION ADJUSTER $59.29
TOOTHED IDLER $76.23
SMOOTH IDLERS (2) $112.42
SPARK PLUGS (4) $50.64
SPARK PLUG GASKETS $18.16
VALVE COVER GASKETS $15.82
VALVE COVER BREATHER GASKETS $11.84
VALVE COVER "BUTTONS" $29.28
CRANK PULLEY KEY $1.74
SUB $682.35
TAX $41.87
GT $724.22!!!

I already have purchased both v\drive belts (AC, Alt, etc...), upper and lower radiator hoses, antifreeze (actually the Sub Dealer guy threw in a gallon on my way out the door, little things like that are nice..)


In addition

Permagasket UltraGrey
Rust breaker fluid PB Blaster
Draining Pan
White paint, marker (for timing clarification)
Loctite blue\medium
Coolant system anti-leak sealant
Distilled water
22mm socket and 24" Breaker bar
Torque wrench (loaner?) FtLbs and InchLbs
12, 14mm sockets and range of extenders, knuckles
Gasket remover
Alcohol (to wipe down grease)
Engine degreaser (car wash before..)
a few well placed prayers..

Coming up fast on $1k (incl tools); (hoping I wont need all of the idlers), but, if I succeed in fixing more things than I break, it will be a well spent couple of days.

(BTW, this site rocks!).

John



#19 srs_49

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Posted 11 August 2006 - 09:05 AM

I used the breaker-bar/starter motor trick to break loose the crankshaft pulley on my old '69 Camaro.

#20 jmickelct

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Posted 11 August 2006 - 09:08 AM

Hi Guys,

Thanks Porcupine, this is valuable.

I am hoping that everything will be locked down (though will crawl around and try to find the sealed port on the fly wheel that folks have mentioned, to stick something in to... though I'm wondering, will the whole drive train (crank) really rotate, if the AT is in park?). Next option (to break cam bolts) will be to look for the "grab point", with the valve cover gaskets removed; (anyone know where this point actually is?).

And as for the parts, I went through SUBARUPARTSFORYOU.COM (which is actually run out of the parts dept. of Dan Perkins Subaru in Milford CT). I emailed in a list and drove over to pick it up, just so that I knew exactly what I'd have in my hand for the job. Good guys, very helpful.

Hunting for an inch pound torque wrench now and with that, will be ready to go.

John

#21 porcupine73

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Posted 11 August 2006 - 11:29 AM

Sounds like a plan John! Having a local dealer with prices like that is nice to avoid the shipping charge.

I would say yes, the crank has to be able to turn with the AT in park, else the engine couldn't be started or left run in park.

Sears has their inch-pound clicker type wrench on sale right now for like 54.99 I think; seems to work OK, if you don't mind the calibration issues that may come with clicker types. I never found an inch-lb torque wrench in the beam style. There is the dial type but those were $$.

#22 jmickelct

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Posted 12 August 2006 - 09:16 PM

Ok,

Half way in, so far, so good.. (spark plugs are a PITA)... but found that extra 3/4" that you get when you remove the valve covers to be most useful..

My big challenge at this point is geting the crank *pulley* off... the bolt came out instantly with the starter trick (though my old rachet isnt too happy)... but I'll be darned if the pulley is budging at all.. Have half a can of PB Blaster on it (got a late start, having chickened out on the torque wrench and ran down to SEARs (thanks again Porcupine... I stopped at the one by work yesterday, they were out... had to head into NJ Strip Mall land this morning to get an inch pound unit (do they *really* not make a metallic, rachet kind of click (versus, what the manual suggested was this way subtle kind of bump...) need to practice a bit before I start to button up.

But would love folks secrets on getting the crank pulley off... (do I need a puller?.. doesnt look like theres much to grab on to). Have been twisting a bit with a chain wrench, while tapping with a hammer to try and get it to crack; nada.

Thoughts?.

Also, looking ahead to closing up, theres obviously no possible way to get a torque wrench in to tighten up the valve cover gaskets (or spark plugs???), so do folks really just do it by feel? (they came off *very* easily, so hope thats some indication).

Oh and, on the T belt, getting to TDC, it appears that whoever put the last belt on kind of winged it, and didnt bother lining up the belt marks with the cam sprocket alignment marks. Following all of the descriptions and graphics I have, I've gotten to where I can get each side's double hash marks (6 oclock for uppers, 12 oclock for lowers) to align, which also seems to put the intake cams 12 oclock marks right at the gap\marks. The arrows, as per the manual, are all at (about) 1\2 Oclock) so that looks all right, and the exhaust\lower cams are both pointing to 9 and 3 but when I get the cams here (obviously havent seen the crank sprocket), the white belt marks are nowhere to be seen. Could the last guy just have counted teeth, rotated to this point and prayed?


John

#23 tcspeer

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Posted 12 August 2006 - 10:10 PM

I dont know which engine you are working on but it sounds like the 2.5. The marks on the 2.2 belt if you line them up with the marks on the cam spockets covers and the line on the crank spocket and then rotate engine around a full turn they will not line back up again I dont know how many rotaions would be needed to get that to happen again but it had me concerned on my first belt change, but it started and ran fine.
Also I have a In. torque wrench with the beam I got it from sears about fifteen years back I dont know if they still make them. I dont use it much, I like the clicker In. from Harbor Freight. It is to hard to read the beam wrench in most positions. If you will grab the crank pully at twelve and six and wriggle then grab at nine and three and do the same it should come off.

Ok,

Half way in, so far, so good.. (spark plugs are a PITA)... but found that extra 3/4" that you get when you remove the valve covers to be most useful..

My big challenge at this point is geting the crank *pulley* off... the bolt came out instantly with the starter trick (though my old rachet isnt too happy)... but I'll be darned if the pulley is budging at all.. Have half a can of PB Blaster on it (got a late start, having chickened out on the torque wrench and ran down to SEARs (thanks again Porcupine... I stopped at the one by work yesterday, they were out... had to head into NJ Strip Mall land this morning to get an inch pound unit (do they *really* not make a metallic, rachet kind of click (versus, what the manual suggested was this way subtle kind of bump...) need to practice a bit before I start to button up.

But would love folks secrets on getting the crank pulley off... (do I need a puller?.. doesnt look like theres much to grab on to). Have been twisting a bit with a chain wrench, while tapping with a hammer to try and get it to crack; nada.

Thoughts?.

Also, looking ahead to closing up, theres obviously no possible way to get a torque wrench in to tighten up the valve cover gaskets (or spark plugs???), so do folks really just do it by feel? (they came off *very* easily, so hope thats some indication).

Oh and, on the T belt, getting to TDC, it appears that whoever put the last belt on kind of winged it, and didnt bother lining up the belt marks with the cam sprocket alignment marks. Following all of the descriptions and graphics I have, I've gotten to where I can get each side's double hash marks (6 oclock for uppers, 12 oclock for lowers) to align, which also seems to put the intake cams 12 oclock marks right at the gap\marks. The arrows, as per the manual, are all at (about) 1\2 Oclock) so that looks all right, and the exhaust\lower cams are both pointing to 9 and 3 but when I get the cams here (obviously havent seen the crank sprocket), the white belt marks are nowhere to be seen. Could the last guy just have counted teeth, rotated to this point and prayed?


John



#24 avk

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Posted 13 August 2006 - 12:28 AM

John, I ran into the same thing when trying to remove the pulley and posted aboout it a few weeks ago. I did use a 3-jaw puller to take it off. As to the marks, it takes hundreds of crank revolutions to line them up again. The exact figure is number of teeth on t-belt, times 2 (for 2.2 l, it's 422).

#25 rweddy

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Posted 13 August 2006 - 12:30 AM

But would love folks secrets on getting the crank pulley off... (do I need a puller?.. doesnt look like theres much to grab on to). Have been twisting a bit with a chain wrench, while tapping with a hammer to try and get it to crack; nada.

Thoughts?

Get a dead blow hammer and whack it on either side back and forth. This will lossen it up.




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