PhizzleSubarizzle Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Hello peoples, I have an '87 GL 4 door sedan with a 1.8L SPFI motor that was running just fine the other day. I Took the dash apart to instal a new speedometer cable and had not started the car at all that day before I installed the cable. Now that it is all back together, the car will not start:confused: . I know the fuel pump is not coming on because I cannot hear it buzz on and off when the key is in the "on" position. All of the fuses are fine, and the wires from the fuse to the relay have 12V traveling through them. I removed the fuel pump relay, tested it, and it is works properly when testing, however when it is plugged in and i turn the key you cannot hear it click on and off the way it should, and they way it did when I tested it. I am begining to think there is a problem with the computer, but when the relay is pluged in and the key is turned to the "on" position there is 12V through the wire coming from the computer to the relay:confused: . -ALSO- My heater fan quit working at the same time. You can't even hear the quiet hisses of the vacuum lines changing when you adjust the settings. I do not have any wiring diagrams for the heater system so I am at a bit of a loss:banghead: . I am thouroughly confused:confused: and any knowledge/input would be much appreciated. Please help. Thanx Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 The fuel pump relay is always powered, it's ground is controlled by the ECU to close the relay. Sounds like perhaps you disconnected or otherwise disturbed one of the grounds for the ECU. Just a guess. When the press the buttons on the dash, it uses engine vacuum to power the actuators - that's the hissing you hear. Without the engine running or having recently run there will be no vacuum present in the accumulator to run the controls. Not sure, but the fan problem might be related as the actuators may switch it on once the reach position.... or it could also be a ground issue. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhizzleSubarizzle Posted August 10, 2006 Author Share Posted August 10, 2006 The fuel pump relay is always powered, it's ground is controlled by the ECU to close the relay. Sounds like perhaps you disconnected or otherwise disturbed one of the grounds for the ECU. Just a guess. When the press the buttons on the dash, it uses engine vacuum to power the actuators - that's the hissing you hear. Without the engine running or having recently run there will be no vacuum present in the accumulator to run the controls. Not sure, but the fan problem might be related as the actuators may switch it on once the reach position.... or it could also be a ground issue. GD Do you know where I can find a decent wiring diagram for my car. The only one I have is out of a Chilton book and its pretty weak. And/or do you know a way to check the ground on my ECU? I have triple checked all of the wire plugs to ensure they are connected and I'm 99% sure I didn't miss any. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 Check out the SPFI conversion manual - I know you already have SPFI, but it gives a nice rundown of how the fuel pump is powered and how it's wired. As well as the pinout of the ECU conectors, and some wireing diagrams: http://mshoup.us/docs/spfi_conversion_manual.pdf Here is also a partial 89 factory service manual that has a lot of good info on the SPFI and such: http://mshoup.us/docs/fsm/EA82/ Thank mikeshoup for hosting this stuff for us.... GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thealleyboy Posted August 10, 2006 Share Posted August 10, 2006 "All of the fuses are fine" I would pull that fuse, and swap it with another one. This happened to me before with that same circuit. Had me stumped for a good long while, until I physically changed it. Apparently, it wasn't making good contact at the box for some reason... good luck, John Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 Did you check the fusible links to see if they are ok? They are in the plastic box mounted on the coolant reservoir. My guess is that one of them is open. Check the green ones particularly. The problem may also be with the ignition switch or the connector to it. Along with checking the fuses you need to check for power at the fuses to see if there is really power there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daeron Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 cougar has a good point, wiggle them all thoroughly, and try to have someone wiggle them while you try to start it. just be careful with em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhizzleSubarizzle Posted August 11, 2006 Author Share Posted August 11, 2006 when I first checked the fuses I had found two blown, then I checked them with a meter and all but two were reading 12V with the key "on", one of the two recieved 12V while trying to start the motor, and the other blew again because I had one of the plugs on the back of the gauge cluster rotated off one pin...I believe, but that I will check as soon as I get home from work tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhizzleSubarizzle Posted August 11, 2006 Author Share Posted August 11, 2006 I checked the fusable links, and they all looked visibaly ok...but I have found before that looks can be decieving. I will check again, also soon after work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted August 11, 2006 Share Posted August 11, 2006 A link can be bad internally and you wouldn't know it just by looking at it. You either need to feel the flex in it or use a meter to check it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhizzleSubarizzle Posted August 12, 2006 Author Share Posted August 12, 2006 SHE RUNS!!!! Hallelujah, it finally runs!!! Ok, so I'm not entirely sure what I did, but here's what happened. I started today by checking my fusable links all but one looked good. The end of the gray one looked toasted like it had blown, but it still had continuity, so I removed it and attached a jumper wire...no luck. I then went on to check various plugs and other things (again) under my dash and decided to remove my computer (as it had been covered in oil from the speedo cable) I opened it up and cleaned it off and put it back in...still no luck. I then remembered the blown fuse (which had blown about four times throughout the week) and replaced it. IT WORKED!! Boy do I feel like a dunce!! So I'm thinking what happened is by having the plug on the back of the guage cluster off by one pin it blew the fuse which in turn kept the fuel pump relay from working. Or it's all mystic and decided to work today, I'm not really sure. So anyway I finally have a running car:burnout: ...but the speedometer is still not working properly (I will adress that issue in a new thread). Thank you to all of you who offered me your advice and knowledge. May God bless you all of your waking hours!! Thanx again Phill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cougar Posted August 12, 2006 Share Posted August 12, 2006 Your welcome for the help Phil. Glad you got it running. I suspect you are correct about the fuse blowing because the connector pins were not aligned correctly. There may have been aproblem with the fusible link also. You need to make sure they have good contact with the connectors. God bless you too. Glen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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