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hard start on EJ22 wagon


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15 replies to this topic

#1 Numbchux

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Posted 06 November 2006 - 04:05 AM

my loyale just hates starting when it's cold. plenty of power from the starter/battery. but it jst doesn't want to fire for a good 10 seconds or so. sometimes I have to floor it to get it to run. but once it does finally start, it hesitates for a second, and then comes up to idle, perfectly smooth....

while it's warm, it runs awesome, and starts immediately, but every morning I go out, and it just doesn't want to start. it's always started eventually *knock on wood* but I hate cranking it that long....

it's not throwing any engine-related ECU codes (just the starter relay, and Vehicle Speed Sensor ones....)

any ideas?

#2 NoahDL88

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Posted 06 November 2006 - 05:07 AM

Could be the engine's temp sensor, if its reading warm, it won't go into cold start enrichment mode.

#3 mellow65

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Posted 06 November 2006 - 12:03 PM

genraly when you floor cars this puts them into a flood mode and doesn't pump gas so you can clear out the flooded engine.

Just a thought.

#4 Snowman

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Posted 06 November 2006 - 06:55 PM

What's with the starter relay code you speak of? I know when I did my swap, the ECM needed a start signal, which causes it to richen the mixture while cranking, sort of like a choke on a carburetor. It may also cause the IAC to open farther during cranking, but I'm not sure about that.

#5 Numbchux

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Posted 07 November 2006 - 12:49 AM

What's with the starter relay code you speak of? I know when I did my swap, the ECM needed a start signal, which causes it to richen the mixture while cranking, sort of like a choke on a carburetor. It may also cause the IAC to open farther during cranking, but I'm not sure about that.


I don't know. it never did it before, but I just checked the codes a couple days ago, and one of them was #12....starter relay/circuit.


I don't think I have the throttle cable adjusted quite right...so floor it on the pedal might not be quite WOT....and therefore might not be flood mode...


noah. good call on the temp sensor. IIRC, when I was hooking everything up, I hooked up the wrong temp sensor to my gauge cluster. I wonder if I ever got it hooked back up to the ECU...I'll check that

#6 WoodsWagon

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Posted 07 November 2006 - 05:58 PM

The two pin one has to be hooked to the ECU. If it fails hard, it will throw the fans on all the time. If it gets sketchy, the computer won't be able to tell.

#7 Numbchux

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Posted 07 November 2006 - 08:57 PM

ECU doesn't control the fans anymore....

#8 Snowman

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Posted 07 November 2006 - 10:29 PM

A problem with the temp sensor could still cause it to not get the enrichment it needs when starting. I think that's what 91loyale was getting at.

#9 Numbchux

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Posted 02 December 2006 - 05:27 AM

OK, bump for a couple other questions. I haven't had time to pull things apart enough to really even look at them...however:

if the coolant temp sensor wasn't hooked up, it wouldn't know when to reduce the idle, would it?

for example, when I first start it, it has the normal high idle at about 2k rpms, then once it's been running for a few minutes, it drops down to ~700. but once I've been driving it for awhile, and it's already warm, if I restart it, it immediately idles at ~700 rpms. every time.


another possibility, I've got a small leak in a metal fuel line near the pump. I haven't had time to fix it (and I'm afraid to touch it, as judging from the rust on all the metal lines around it, it's not going to cooperate), is it possible that this is reducing my fuel pressure enough that it's having trouble starting? maybe as it sits it drains all the fuel out of the line between the pump and the engine, and it takes a few tries for it all to prime again like it should...

but I'm having no signs of any troubles while it's running, at any rpm range, even under WOT.


maybe I'll take a clip of me trying to start it here in the next couple days and post it...so you guys can hear what I'm dealing with...

#10 GeneralDisorder

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Posted 02 December 2006 - 11:07 AM

Fuel LEAK?!?! Christ man - fix that FIRST.

Worry about the starting issue when you don't have flammable fluids dripping from your car.

GD

#11 Numbchux

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Posted 02 December 2006 - 04:45 PM

Fuel LEAK?!?! Christ man - fix that FIRST.

Worry about the starting issue when you don't have flammable fluids dripping from your car.

GD


I'd love to. but I don't have much time, and the only place I have up here to work on the thing is outside on a gravel parking slab. it's a very slow leak, just a drop every few seconds. I don't like it, but I'm going to have to live with it for a few more weeks until I get to my parent's place where there's a garage.

#12 GeneralDisorder

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Posted 03 December 2006 - 01:48 AM

What about just replacing the rusty section with some rubber FI hose as a temp fix?

GD

#13 Numbchux

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Posted 03 December 2006 - 02:46 AM

What about just replacing the rusty section with some rubber FI hose as a temp fix?

GD


I've thought about it. but all the lines back there look so scary, I'm afraid to touch anything until I'm prepared for a serious project. all the metal lines (fuel and brake) are VERY rusted. and the couple rubber lines immediately attached to the tank are cracked...and could give way soon.

but I know what that problem is, and how to fix it. I haven't a clue why it's so hard to start. and would like to get this figured out if possible. if they're related, I'll be tickled pink....but I just don't know...

#14 stinky

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Posted 04 December 2006 - 01:26 AM

Why not just use a dollop of that perma-weld goo stuff ? That'd probably patch the fuel up as a temp. measure.

#15 Numbchux

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Posted 04 December 2006 - 04:15 AM

Why not just use a dollop of that perma-weld goo stuff ? That'd probably patch the fuel up as a temp. measure.


tried it. doesn't stick well enough to the lines. and still leaks. although not as bad.

#16 hooziewhatsit

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Posted 04 December 2006 - 11:55 AM

to test and see if it is the fuel system losing pressure, turn the key to 'run' and hold it there for a couple seconds. Do that a few times then try to start it

That should pressurize the system and let you know if that's why it cranks so long.

If it still cranks a long time, I'd bet the CTS is having issues.

-Dave




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