SubyTub Posted December 1, 2003 Share Posted December 1, 2003 Helllo. I am in the planning stages of having a Porsche Speedster replica built using a Subaru engine. The engines I have been told about include the following: 1. 2.5L DOHC rated at 165bhp. I understand that this may be one to avoid. 2. 2.5L SOHC I assume rated the same 3, 2.2L SOHC which I understand is a jewel 4. Same as above but with a (emissions) legal cam which bumps the hp up to 155bhp. This one sounds pretty cool to me. Any thoughts on which would be the best choice for durability, maintainability and a measure of spirited performance for a 1900# car? Thanks in advance John H. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted December 1, 2003 Share Posted December 1, 2003 I think most would agree the 2.2 is a gem and maybe the most reliable engine Subaru has built. There are some late versions that had a few changes you might not want. I suggest you search the archives here. I would be tempted to go with a phase 2 2.5 if you want a four. They seem as peppy to me as the four cam phase one with more reliability. The DOHC phase 2 engine can now be made pretty reliable with the latest head gaskets. I remember a real Speedster from when I was a kid. It spent most of its time apart in the local garage. Any Subaru engine should do better than that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alias20035 Posted December 1, 2003 Share Posted December 1, 2003 The SVX's 3.3 H6 is far and away Subaru's best normally aspirated engine. For turbocharged ones, get the closed deck EJ22T used in North American 91-94 Legacy Turbo sedans and wagons. It was 160 HP in the Legacy, but the block can do 300+ hp very reliably. For a smaller normally aspirated flat four, the Phase II EJ22 SOHC used in the 99 Legacy is probably the best choice, followed by the EJ22 SOHC that preceded it. There were a few DOHC EJ22's, but only in 91 Legacy LS 5MT models (only car that I routinely see the DOHC on), and only in Canada? From having driven both the EJ22 SOHC and DOHC models, I can tell you that the DOHC version is a lot more lively and powerful. If going the EJ25 route, get the Phase II EJ25 SOHC, it develops its power a lot lower in the rev range, and does not eat as many head gaskets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted December 1, 2003 Share Posted December 1, 2003 I just noticed that I said phase 2 DOHC. I meant phase 1 DOHC, and phase 2 SOHC. I merely plead senility. I would have to agree with alias that the six is a nice engine and I have heard a lot of good stuff about the turbo fours. I was under the impression that what was desired was a naturally aspirated four. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alias20035 Posted December 1, 2003 Share Posted December 1, 2003 Originally posted by cookie I just noticed that I said phase 2 DOHC. I meant phase 1 DOHC, and phase 2 SOHC. I merely plead senility. I would have to agree with alias that the six is a nice engine and I have heard a lot of good stuff about the turbo fours. I was under the impression that what was desired was a naturally aspirated four. For 99 only there was a phase II SOHC EJ22 engine in the Legacy, and it may have been in the Impreza as well. The Phase II EJ22 had about a bit more hp and torque, but it also developed its peak torque a lot lower in the rev range. Phase 1 EJ22 are very good... It is the Phase 1 EJ25 DOHC that should be avoided because of head gasket problems. I added the turbo engine for information only... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted December 1, 2003 Share Posted December 1, 2003 I had heard from friends that the DOHC 2.2 that was a one year engine was good to avoid. Rumor was that it required premium fuel, was an interference engine, and caused more problems. This was the 2.2 I was trying to recall that might not be a good choice. Waht have you heard from owners of this engine? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubyTub Posted December 2, 2003 Author Share Posted December 2, 2003 Thanks for your answers folks. Decision time is on the horizon and it sounds like the 2.2L may be the way to go. Can you tell me anthing about the cam choice I mentioned? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted December 2, 2003 Share Posted December 2, 2003 Do you have a link or other info on the cam? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubyTub Posted December 2, 2003 Author Share Posted December 2, 2003 No information available. What I heard from my builder is that he was made aware of a retrofit which would keep the car emissions legal and would bump the bhp from 137 to 155. That's what I heard and I hope someone is aware of this and can share info about it. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevinsUBARU Posted December 2, 2003 Share Posted December 2, 2003 Check out Cobb Tuning Stuff on the site is for 2.5 engines mostly, but it will either work in the 2.2 or they have stuff that will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted December 2, 2003 Share Posted December 2, 2003 subytub, there is a thread over at http://www.nasioc.com about cams and mods on the 2.2l . Also, maybe http://www.paeco.com can offer some advice. Also, you might search at http://www.i-club.com , http://www.obsportal.com I've been so many places on the web trying to educate myself for the probable purchase next year of an OBS that I'm losing track of where I've been! Also MRT and other places in Oz have complete stroker kits and other stuff for the 2.2l maybe they would respond with an email? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubyTub Posted December 3, 2003 Author Share Posted December 3, 2003 OK, I'll do some looking. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chip Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 Being a big Porsche/Volks fan I have to wonder why you wouldn't go with a modified aircooled VW motor,(not that there's anything wrong with the Subie engine), for the sake of simplicity and originality. No electronics do deal with. No liquid cooling system..(rad, hoses, fans,overflow etc...). Extremely easy to modify. Parts availability..(cheap too). Going the liquid cooled route you'll have to mount the rad in the front,with the fan(s), and run plumbing all they way to the back of the car...(unless of course you were going to build a front-engined porsche....God forbid). For a few thousand $$ you can get yourself a real solid, dependable bug engine with about the same HP as the Subie....(and it'll sound like a Porsche too) !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 After running bugs for several years in the 70s I question this. This guy seems to be going for one of the most dependable engines available for this car. For the low mileage of a toy car it is true that a bug engine could work. If I was going to drive it frequently I would much prefer the Subie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 Well if you open up the original post to all engine choices, there is some merit to going with a ground up custom VW style engine. And, you cannot compromise on cooling the soob engine either. You may need to consider weight issues as well. An EJ20t would be cool if the rad can be worked out! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 sorted this kit with Subies. If he has to do it himself I would reccomend going with a 912 engine. The VW has been made to do high HP, but has the life of a mayfly. It was designed to do 25 HP reliably. It does. When you stretch the thing it has everything fail from its magnesium case to the overheated exhaust valve on number three. By the time you replace everthing to upgrade it to take serious power you have made it into a Porsche at a heavy cost. I hot rodded these things and had a gas with them while they lasted. With a Subaru you can put out horepower for more than 100,000 miles reliably with just normal maintence. There is a reason VW bought Audi to get the designs for a water cooled engine. VW is back now from the horrible repution it gained in the 70s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meep Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 emissions: I had to get our 2.2L sniffed every 2 yrs for MD smog tests. Dyno and neutral rev. Being that it was SO clean, I mean, like at only 5-10% of maximum limts, I'd think you can do quite a bit before pushing past the limits. It sounds like a fairly mild cam, but valving is definently the bottleneck in the motor--oem intake and exh is already pretty good (tho it may not matter as much for your use). You WILL want to play with intake tuning. Go ahead and pull the entire stock intake with the motor. Lots/most aftermarket intakes induce low/rev "bogging" which is annoying/downright dangerous sometimes. Learn from the oem intake design while fabricating your own, or even mix 'n match parts. Sounds like a great project! Mike Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubyTub Posted December 3, 2003 Author Share Posted December 3, 2003 Guys, apparently Subaru engines in replicas are more common on the other side of the pond. I've been there....done that with VW power in a Speedster replica and now I believe I'm taking a step up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 My toy car is currently a BMW M Roadster as I like the reliability of the big water cooled six. I have seen Subarus fitted to everything up to an airplane in New Zealand. I am sure someone has done some sorting work on how to cool a Subaru in a Speedster? If they can get it to cool in a VW bus they must have. How are you going to work that out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SubyTub Posted December 4, 2003 Author Share Posted December 4, 2003 Subaru engines started showing up at the EAA fly-in in Oshkosh, Wisconsin in the early eighties. They have been overshadowing the converted VW power plants ever since. Check out this website for information in the Suby powered Speedster and Cabriolet: http://www.specialtyauto.com/ I think this is where it is going to happen for me. The owner is pushing the 2.2L as the best engine for the car, although his prototype has a 2.5L installed. He has the mentioned the 2.2L with the cam and this is why I have been looking for opinions. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookie Posted December 4, 2003 Share Posted December 4, 2003 I took a look at the website. looks like they have done all the hard stuff. I agree that the 2.2 is a very good engine for a car like this and may have a lot more power than an original engine stock. The 2.5 is noticeably pepier though. I have never driven a modified Subaru 2.2 so I will leave that to the experts here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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