p3pppx Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 Why don't subaru door window have "frames", the window glass has no support other than itself. After washing the car water is between the glass and gaskets (though it doesn't get in the car). And with my first snow storm as an outback owner it took a few minutes to open the door because the moisture between the glass and gasket and snow/ice on the outside nicely froze to form a tightly sealed door. The AWD, however was good. Was able to pull in/out of parking spaces over mounds of snow, no spinning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lothar34 Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 I don't like them either. Supposedly they're for better visibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adge_082 Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 But i live in Australia, so freezing isnt much of an issue, and i have never noticed water build up in there, probably will now though. Actually come to think of it my 96 liberty (legacy) has a sheild at the top of the window to prevent water getting in there, or at least thats the way it seems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alias20035 Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 Frameless window pros: * better visability * lighter door weight (better reliability and safety) * door less likely to jam as the result of an accident (safety) * stronger roof (safety) Frameless window cons: * even a minor window misaligment causes wind noise (but some framed window designs are no good such as the 94-00 Honda Civic and have substantial windnoise all the time) * can freeze shut (but framed doors do as well, and in some cases a lot worse than Subaru's) I just wish Subaru would use thicker glass and have a stiffer mechanism to hold the window in place, and eliminate the "window down door closing rattle". The Hyundai XG350 also has frameless windows, and they do not rattle, I am sure Subaru could fix this. All in all I have had far fewer problems with Subaru's frameless windows than on most GM vehicles with framed windows. For your freezing problem, apply silicone spray lubricant to a paper towel and apply it to the door and window seal. It will help with the ice problem a lot. There are also silicone sticks and other chemicals that will work well. See this post: http://usmb.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8092 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setright Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 Silicone spray is the only difference in terms of doors freezing shut. I am a real maintenance nut and my 13 year old seals are softer than new, and I have never had them freeze shut. BUT, I have seen many people struggle in the morning with all sorts of cars, and it's down to treating the seals right, not the door frame design. One pro for the frameless: I can get all sorts of big things, like chairs, onto the back seat of my sedan, because winding down the window frees up space, that would have been filled by a conventional door frame Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooskie Posted December 9, 2003 Share Posted December 9, 2003 Another advantage, or so to speak, of the frameless is that you can slam your fingers in the door and not break skin! The window just puts pressure on your fingers & molds around them...just another safety feature for subaru. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1ABAJA Posted December 9, 2003 Share Posted December 9, 2003 Framless doors are pimp...sooo much lighter and easier to open / close. I had to drive a ponty schmack around for a couple of months....those stupid doors....SUCKED! By the way, while I am on that stupid car, those stupid doors froze all the time, and the fact that they are so heavy made it almost impossible to open! Framless!!!!!!!! Josh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
p3pppx Posted December 9, 2003 Author Share Posted December 9, 2003 Thanks for the replies everyone. I'm glad to know that I can safely slam my finger in the door I'll treat the seals with silicone after I wash all that salt of the car, and make a note to do it on a regular basis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warp3 Posted December 9, 2003 Share Posted December 9, 2003 FYI: power frameless windows seem to seal better if you raise them THEN close the door (as the motors have trouble overpowering the rubber weatherstripping at the top of the window). In fact, if you roll up the windows then open the door and hit the up switch again, the window will usually rise another 1/4" or so. I've gotten in the habit of rolling up the windows then closing the doors before washing the car as it seems to seal much better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frag Posted December 9, 2003 Share Posted December 9, 2003 You dont have this problem with the Legacy luxury model (I mean the Brighton). You get manual crank windows doubling as natural a.c. and much more... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrxsubaru Posted December 9, 2003 Share Posted December 9, 2003 Yeah you can really slam the door with your fingers in the way on the window, about 4 years ago my family was driving from seattle WA to michigan in a 90 legacy and we stoped at a sube dealer for a front turn signal light assembley, and as we all got in the car to leave a sales man came up opened the drivers door while my dad was in it and slamened it shut on his hand, thats how I and my family learned about that one, i guess it was a very desperate atempt to sell us a new sube:D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alias20035 Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 Originally posted by wrxsubaru Yeah you can really slam the door with your fingers in the way on the window, about 4 years ago my family was driving from seattle WA to michigan in a 90 legacy and we stoped at a sube dealer for a front turn signal light assembley, and as we all got in the car to leave a sales man came up opened the drivers door while my dad was in it and slamened it shut on his hand, thats how I and my family learned about that one, i guess it was a very desperate atempt to sell us a new sube:D I slammed the door of my 93 Legacy on my hand once, I happened to have my hand on the part of the rear door that extends past the edge of the window. I re-broke my finger that I had broken 6 weeks earlier mountain biking. Not only did I break my finger, but I also required help to free myself. On the 93 Legacy there is no unlock switch on the passenger's side front door (the lock/unlock is keyed to the drivers door lock), and I happened to get my hand stuck on the passenger's side rear door. I did note that my 01 Outback has more foam rubber on the seal of this area of the door than my 93 Legacy, so perhaps this was an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LegacyT Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 I love em!!! easier to get in and out. And when working on a car with the window down the missing frame is so much more conveinient. When I work on a car with a framed door I always at first bump into the frame. Subaru's spoiled me Mark, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Setright Posted December 10, 2003 Share Posted December 10, 2003 Agreed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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