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Guest Message by DevFuse
 

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Grimmspeed gear oil cocktail made shifting worse!


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24 replies to this topic

#1 eryque

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 11:16 AM

I changed my gear oil with the cocktail that Grimmspeed sells, and shifting is actually worse than it was before. There is a little more crunching going into 2nd and 3rd, and I can't get it into 1st without forcing it unless I'm at a dead stop.

The drain plug did have a few shavings on it and the old oil smelled burnt, so I'm guessing that this tranny was not treated very well and will one day either need a rebuild or replacement. It's only got 95,000 miles on the tranny now.

#2 dhise

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 12:03 PM

ahhh, tranny fluid..... cut and pasted from the nasioc (hope this is cool)....I pesonally use the redline 75w-90ns...

orignal thread: http://forums.nasioc...d.php?t=1370930


I guess I should chime in here...

Scotty's cocktail is just about the worst thing you can use in a Subaru manual transmission! The extremely high sulfur content destroys the Subaru uncoated baulk rings (part of the syncro). The excessive wear I have seen in the transmissions that people have doctored with this stuff in horrible. You cannot fix a mechanical issue with a fluid change! You are only masking the issue!

The OEM Subaru Extra S This fluid is just standard gear oil with a friction modifier in it (like what old timers use in Detroit lockers). I sent a sample in to be analyzed by my oil guy. The results in viscosity breakdown are no better than a standard 75w90 dino oil.

Royal Purple- ugg what can I say about this stuff and be nice about it..hmm
It has an organic base stock on which it gives it very similar qualities to regular dino oil except a slightly better breakdown under heat aka a complete wast of money.

Redline oil- They do make the 75w90NS which is a low sulfur fluid that will not harm the baulk rings although we did see a lot more 3-4 grinds. Shockproof seems to work pretty well in the rear diff without any side effects. Please not that I rebuilt dwx's 6mt in December the shockproof literally had to be scooped out of his trans like pudding
I would not recommend it for anyone in cold climates.

Valvoline 75w90 Synthetic- This is what I use in my customer's and my own car. It holds up extremely well in street and competition use. It also has an organic base stock like the Royal Purple but has a slightly better additive package like the Subaru Extra S. The best part about this particular fluid is how well it reacts to cold. Even with the coldest days here in Chicago I've never had it get sluggish.

As a side note to all who drive their cars more aggressive than "normal" or who make more power than stock:

Change your fluid every 10-15k miles!

Change your fluid after every track day, HPDE, Auto-X, Rally-X, etc!!

The better condition you keep your fluid in the longer it will be before you have to come see me or Ben for a rebuild!

Dylan @ DS1

This public service announcement has been brought to you by SOA who reminds you "Gears? Crunch all you want, we'll make more"

#3 eryque

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 12:51 PM

After so many good testimonials about the cocktail I figured I couldn't go wrong! Live and learn.

It doesn't surprise me that the shockproof had to be scooped out like pudding, because it kinda looks like blue pudding going in!

I'll change the tranny fluid at the next oil change with regular stuff. I still bet I get another 100,000 miles out of this tranny before it's useless.

#4 fnlyfnd

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 01:26 PM

I tried the cocktail and hated it. I am using redline 75w-90NS right now and am pretty happy. Valvoline synpower also made me happy.

#5 seanski06

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Posted 24 November 2007 - 04:16 PM

i love the cocktail...but this is coming from dino oil, where every morning i'd have to shift from 1st to 3rd, b/c 2nd wouldnt go in

#6 Setright

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Posted 25 November 2007 - 02:25 PM

Seriously folks, Valvoline Synpower is the best oil to use. I've just used it to fix the 3rd gear crunch on a 19 year old XT-Turbo :clap:

#7 fnlyfnd

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Posted 25 November 2007 - 08:48 PM

The problem I had with valvoline synpower is the douchebags that put it in my car. As I said, it made me happy, but when I cant buy it unless I have to pay some douche at a quick lube to change it for me then I will use another oil. I couldn't find valvoline synpower gear oil anywhere except at the valvoline drive thru oil change locations, and they only sell it if they do the work.

If I could get valvoline synpower gear oil shipped to my house, or buy it locally, I would change it on a warm day.

#8 Setright

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Posted 26 November 2007 - 01:52 AM

I understand.


You could try Motul "Motylgear" - they even make a 75W-80 to ease shifting, but the 75W-90 stuff isn't too bad either.

#9 RallyKeith

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Posted 26 November 2007 - 12:48 PM

I'm going to have to chime in on the Valvoline 75w90 Synthetic. We run that in a modified WRX Rally car and it works well. I run the Valvoline dino 75w90 in my street cars usually and don't have any issues.

#10 RallyKeith

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Posted 26 November 2007 - 12:52 PM

and I can't get it into 1st without forcing it unless I'm at a dead stop.


One other comment... The transmissions aren't engineered to be put into first at any speed above a crawl. 10 years ago I proved that by bending a shift fork in a brand new, at the time, 97 Impreza. If that is something you are trying to fix with fluid I suggest you fix it by working on your driving habits.

#11 eryque

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Posted 26 November 2007 - 03:10 PM

I thought you were supposed to be able to put it in first while rolling, just like any other gear. My bad :)

#12 Sushi

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Posted 26 November 2007 - 11:16 PM

With the old pt4wd tranny in my Loyale I could put it into 1st at around 30mph without an issue. The new awd tranny won't go in over 15mph

#13 Virrdog

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Posted 27 November 2007 - 10:02 AM

And this is where I come in and remind everyone again that getting fresh or Group-N transmission mounts will help out also.

All my symptoms practically disappeared after changing the mounts and putting in fresh regular tranny fluid. :cool:

#14 rweddy

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Posted 27 November 2007 - 01:06 PM

ahhh, tranny fluid..... cut and pasted from the nasioc (hope this is cool)....I pesonally use the redline 75w-90ns...

I also love redline 75w-90ns has fixed several of mine and freinds subaru shifting issues.

#15 Setright

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 01:06 AM

Shifting on the move:

YOu could try to teach yourself about "rev-matching" and "double de-clutching".

Basically, car still rolling, gear stick in neutral, clutch pedal up, tap the throttle to rev the engine to maybe 2000rpm, clutch pedal down, shift into first (double-de-clutch) then, before releasing the clutch pedal, tap the throttle again (rev matching) to avoid excessive engine braking.

With practice, you will become super smooth and able to select a lower gear smoothly.

#16 RallyKeith

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 08:44 AM

I guess I forgot that it depends on what year of car you have. The Early AWD 5 speeds do not like going into 1st gear unless at a crawl. I don't have much experiance past that 97, which did not like going in above about 10mph.

However... I just picked up an '06 2.5i Impreza monday night and decided to try down shifting to first at speed last night. It went right in at 30mph.... So they've defenitely made some changes on that.

Keith

#17 fnlyfnd

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Posted 28 November 2007 - 09:58 AM

rev matching always helps


I just ordered a group N tranny mount for my OBW!!!!

#18 Setright

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 01:07 AM

Keith, my 1992 Legacy was capable of this "feat" ;)

Any car is, really, provided you do the right dance on the pedals :)

#19 RallyKeith

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 08:52 AM

Keith, my 1992 Legacy was capable of this "feat" ;)

Any car is, really, provided you do the right dance on the pedals :)


I know all about pedal dancing and Rev Matching and so on. I don't need to justify my knowledge there. The '06 did it with no pedal dancing or excessive force or rev matching. It surprised me how easy it was, unlike any other subaru I had driven before, including the 6spd STi.

#20 edrach

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 09:10 AM

I vote for the Redline 75W-90NS. I have 203K on our '91 Legacy daily driver and the gearbox is still going strong. I started the Redline when I bought the car at 93K because of a slight crunch going into 2nd. I installed Lucas gearoil at 196K and the car would crunch almost all shifts. Drained out the Lucas stuff and installed Redline again and the transmission (and I) is happy again.

The '97 Impreza is currently on Castrol 75W-90 synthetic. Car is my wife's daily driver and my occasional rallycross car. Car seems to like the Castrol and is currently approaching 135K.

#21 mellow65

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 12:48 PM

+1 for the redline 75-90NS

it's taken grinds out of 2 or 3 trannys now.

#22 Setright

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 02:56 PM

Redline couldn't do it for my old Legacy.

#23 mellow65

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Posted 29 November 2007 - 03:49 PM

Redline couldn't do it for my old Legacy.


its not a cure all, but it defiantly helped in a couple legacys and an older corolla. all of them had grinds into 2nd and after swapping fluid and driving it for about an hour all grinding was gone. you have to make sure you get the NS version.

but no it wont take away bearing noise or anything big, nothings that good.:rolleyes: but even with bearing noise it shifted awesome.

#24 DS1 Motorsports

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Posted 28 December 2007 - 11:58 AM

I've actually seen the Redline 75w90NS make the 3-4 shift worse on early WRX boxes.

Also here in IL when it gets really cold all the redline gear oils (except mt-90?) look like pudding when I open the boxes up. :(

Glad to see you guys are getting good results with the Valvoline 75w90 syn. We run it in every box we build from stock to PPG's and have never had an issue.

Dylan @ DS1

#25 ringe

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Posted 19 January 2008 - 09:42 PM

I've actually seen the Redline 75w90NS make the 3-4 shift worse on early WRX boxes.

Also here in IL when it gets really cold all the redline gear oils (except mt-90?) look like pudding when I open the boxes up. :(

Glad to see you guys are getting good results with the Valvoline 75w90 syn. We run it in every box we build from stock to PPG's and have never had an issue.

Dylan @ DS1


I have to say that I concur with your experience with a worstened 3-4 shift. I put Redline in my WRX after about 5k miles as part of a general upgrade to the shift quality of the vehicle (shifter bushings and fluid). I found after a while that if I revved 3rd gear past 4k rpm it would crunch going into 4th. This winter the Redline has been exceptional, but I will try the Valvoline Synpower stuff this summer.

The never-ending oil battle...

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