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Cold Starting Problems


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8 replies to this topic

#1 jimbo747

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Posted 13 December 2003 - 04:30 PM

1987 Loyale, 1.8L SPFI. 5 Spd.

First of all, I live in the Phoenix area, so this doesn't happen very often, but for the third time this year I couldn't start my car this morning.

Seems that whenever it is cold enough for frost to form on my car, it won't start. It will crank, and usually fire and run for about 1 second, then quit. After that, it will just crank and crank. I have spark, but no signs of flooding (i.e. wet plugs and/or gas smell from the tailpipe. :banghead:

I'm thinking maybe water in the fuel system is freezing. Last time this happened I installed a new fuel filter. Today I bought some STP fuel system water eliminator and anti-freeze, which I will put in when I get home.

I was wondering if any of you in the colder areas of the country had any other suggestions to help me diagnose this?:confused:

Thanks

#2 torxxx

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Posted 13 December 2003 - 04:48 PM

You gots the same problem I have. Your Fast idler is messed up.
But I'm runnin a carb on my 86 so I'm not sure what it equates to in fuel injection. Your choke also sounds like its not functioning.

I have to spend 5 minutes revving my engine every morning when I start it..

Also what kind of plugs are you running? If they aren't NGK plugs, change em to NGks.

#3 northguy

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Posted 13 December 2003 - 05:53 PM

I was just listening to "Car Talk" this A.M. and there was a call that sounded similar to your problem. They said it might be low compression not building enough pressure to get to ignition temperature. Check the compression. Add some Heat - that'll take care of the water problem - buy a magnetic oil pan heater and plug it in.

#4 Skip

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Posted 14 December 2003 - 12:02 AM

My check mark goes beside the fuel injection thermosensor. It's not telling the ECU the engine is cold and so it is not richening the mixture.
Check the connections and then test the unit
It is screwed into the upper rad hose connection and has a wired pig tail (other coolant sensor there is for the dash gauge).
Do a search for coolant sensor - read all about it
Hope this helps


#5 Vertigo

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Posted 14 December 2003 - 01:28 AM

skip quick question would this problem be the same thing:? at first startup it will bog down to really low rpms but when its warmed up it runs right where it should. What I don't get is shouldn't it rev higher at colder temps then lower?

#6 Skip

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Posted 14 December 2003 - 09:33 AM

Ah Vert. I really do not like stepping on other peoples threads. Your problem could be the thermosensor but may be the IAC valve. I do not want to sound like an arseorifice, but please email me or start a new thread and we will discuss it in detail.

#7 jimbo747

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Posted 14 December 2003 - 10:01 AM

and discovered that I have no fuel pressure. It appears the fuel pump is not turning on. I unplugged it and applied current directly to it, and it started working. So now I'm wondering if I could have a bad fuel pump relay. Problem is, I don't know what the relay looks like or where it is located. :confused:

Help, please!

#8 Skip

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Posted 14 December 2003 - 10:25 AM

Jimbo are you aware of the fact that the fuel pump only runs for about 2 seconds when you first turn the car to the "run" position?
It is controled by a timer in the ECU, this short run period re-presurizes the fuel system.
It also should run when the ig sw. is in the crank to start position and then once the car has fired.
Now if you get niether of these "run periods" I would look to the FPR (fuel pump relay) or it's control circuit.
Note: the FPR is in a closed (providing the positive side of the fuel pump operation) any time the ig switch is in the run position, the ECU then provides the negative side to the pump. So you can test the relay simply by checking for + voltage at the pump harness.
If you have no positive voltage the relay is located above and to the drivers side of the steering col. You must remove the trim panel to see them. There will be several realys in a row, they are all the same so you could swap one to see if it cures the problem.
Hope this helps
Here is what a relay looks like

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#9 jimbo747

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Posted 14 December 2003 - 10:52 AM

During my diagnostics, I detached the fuel line at the filter, and turned the ignition switch on. I cranked (and cranked and cranked) but no fuel ever came out of the line. I also checked the voltage at the pump, but I was unaware of the "2-second" rule. Still sounds like a relay. I'll check these relay.

If I undersatnd you correctly, I'm going to need to pull the panel from underneath the steering column same on the covers the ECU?

Thanks again! This board is the best!




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