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EJ25 - Is head work easier with engine in or out of the car?


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22 replies to this topic

#1 jelly man

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 04:33 PM

I just got a 96 Outback with an EJ25. I picked it up cheap because of serious mechanical problems. It has either something loose in the top or bottom end that sounds as bad as a thrown rod. I can't pin the noise down to either side or the center. My question is if it is easier to work on or replace a head with the engine in or out of the car. That's considering total labor including pulling the engine. If it's close to a tossup then I'll just pull the engine anyway cause it will need replacing if the problem is in the crankcase. Any advice from somebody who's tried head work on an engine in and out of the car would be much appreciated. TIA

#2 nipper

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 04:37 PM

I would pull it and properly inspect the engine.

nipper

#3 Skip

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 05:20 PM

I second what Nipper says 100%

If you find major toast
the EJ22 swap if you choose this route
is about half done.

#4 subaru360

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 05:49 PM

X3- Pull the engine it's not hard to get it out.

#5 grossgary

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Posted 25 February 2008 - 08:33 PM

i'm confused? why put new headgaskets on a motor with rod knock?
yank it and give it a good look over, sounds like it needs a new motor anyway.

#6 bheinen74

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 12:54 AM

simple.
yank the engine
put in ej22
never pull the engine again for some stupid "ej25" problem once you got the ej22

#7 lostinthe202

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 07:46 AM

the EJ22 swap if you choose this route
is about half done.


Is the other half putting it back in?:)

Will-

#8 aircraft engineer

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 11:37 AM

It's always easier to work on the engine when it is out of the car (lots easier access) - now just how easy is it to GET it out of car? :grin:

#9 Skip

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Posted 27 February 2008 - 12:24 PM

Getting the engine out is easy with
a proper crane
(note: equalizer and electric winch make
doing it "one man band" style much nicer)
Posted Image
And a few tools.
Posted Image

#10 merkatroid

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Posted 06 March 2008 - 11:23 AM

Ive done it both ways and pulling the engine is way easier. The ej25 is really easy to pull.

#11 frag

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Posted 06 March 2008 - 11:41 AM

Getting the engine out is easy with
a proper crane
(note: equalizer and electric winch make
doing it "one man band" style much nicer)
Posted Image
And a few tools.
Posted Image


Skip, the shade-tree and side-of-the-street mechanic I am is looking at your pics like a poor child at a candy store. I need an icon for «drooling».
What's that hanging from the rafters?

#12 mnwolftrack

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Posted 06 March 2008 - 02:48 PM

The EJ25 is the easiest engine I've ever pulled. The last one took me about 1 hour 50 minutes to yank out. Way easier to work on outside the car. Subi sure screwed up the headgaskets on this engine, but they must of put some thought into making it easy to remove the engine. If I was doing this frequently, I bet I could get the engine out in an hour.

P.S. I also have a cherry picker hoist which helps a lot (available typically for about $129-169 from tool houses like Northern Tool).

#13 jelly man

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Posted 11 March 2008 - 10:02 PM

Thanks to all who replied to this thread. I pulled the engine, heads and oil pan. I can't see where the problem is but it sure is hard (near impossible) to see the crank and rods. The heads look ok. I'm just going to replace the engine with a jdm engine and keep the heads, manifold and accessories.

#14 2X2KOB

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Posted 13 March 2008 - 01:33 PM

You going to take it apart and see what's wrong with it? Kinda curious now.

#15 jelly man

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 04:05 PM

I pushed each lifter down when the camshafts were off. They all pushed down uniformly and smooth. The crank spins freely but causes a slight knocking sound when pistons 3 and 4 top out and 1 and 2 bottom out. I turned the crank with my hand pushing in on each piston. Piston 3 has a slight click or knock when it passes both top and bottom. The others move smoothly. It seems like too much work to fix the rod knock when I can get a jdm engine shipped to my door for $910 and they'll throw in a tranny for another $250. I'll probably wind up junking the block and keeping the heads and intake manifold.

#16 subaru360

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 07:05 PM

I pushed each lifter down when the camshafts were off. They all pushed down uniformly and smooth. The crank spins freely but causes a slight knocking sound when pistons 3 and 4 top out and 1 and 2 bottom out. I turned the crank with my hand pushing in on each piston. Piston 3 has a slight click or knock when it passes both top and bottom. The others move smoothly. It seems like too much work to fix the rod knock when I can get a jdm engine shipped to my door for $910 and they'll throw in a tranny for another $250. I'll probably wind up junking the block and keeping the heads and intake manifold.


Be careful with the JDM EJ25's they don't have an EGR valve or any provisions to mount one, if you need one. The places that sell them won't tell you that.

#17 2X2KOB

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 08:59 PM

I pushed each lifter down when the camshafts were off. They all pushed down uniformly and smooth. The crank spins freely but causes a slight knocking sound when pistons 3 and 4 top out and 1 and 2 bottom out. I turned the crank with my hand pushing in on each piston. Piston 3 has a slight click or knock when it passes both top and bottom. The others move smoothly. It seems like too much work to fix the rod knock when I can get a jdm engine shipped to my door for $910 and they'll throw in a tranny for another $250. I'll probably wind up junking the block and keeping the heads and intake manifold.


That's a very good price, especially for the trans. Where or who is selling these?

#18 subaru360

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Posted 14 March 2008 - 10:48 PM

That's a very good price, especially for the trans. Where or who is selling these?


There are plenty of them on ebay at that price. But the JDM EJ25's have no egr if you need one, which is a big issue if you live somewhere that has emissions inspection. You will have a CEL on if you use one of these in a car that had egr.

#19 2X2KOB

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Posted 15 March 2008 - 06:46 AM

There are plenty of them on ebay at that price. But the JDM EJ25's have no egr if you need one, which is a big issue if you live somewhere that has emissions inspection. You will have a CEL on if you use one of these in a car that had egr.


That's important to know, thanks. I think that if I ever had to replace my EJ25 I might look into using a 2.2 instead, because I like the non-interference engines. I guess the time to learn about doing something like that is now, before I need it.

#20 3Pin

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Posted 15 March 2008 - 04:40 PM

If you go with a JDM with no instake, Couldn't you just swap intakes from the current motor and get the EGR?

#21 subaru360

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Posted 15 March 2008 - 05:02 PM

If you go with a JDM with no instake, Couldn't you just swap intakes from the current motor and get the EGR?


No, there is no hole on the JDM head to connect the egr pipe to.

#22 jelly man

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Posted 15 March 2008 - 10:36 PM

I replaced an carbureted EA82 with a fuel injected one. I had to drill the head to put the pipe in for the egr. There was a indent in the casting that just needed to be drilled. Does the JDM EJ25 have a similar indent in the casting that I could drill and tap?
I was quoting a price from tiger japanese before but after doing some quick searches online I decided not to go with that company. Does any one have any experience with JDM engine suppliers they'd like to recommend?

#23 2X2KOB

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Posted 16 March 2008 - 05:07 PM

I replaced an carbureted EA82 with a fuel injected one. I had to drill the head to put the pipe in for the egr. There was a indent in the casting that just needed to be drilled.


What size hole was that? (Approx) Did you tap it to a standard pipe thread, or what's it take?

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