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2 row radiator adventure


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43 replies to this topic

#1 Frank B

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Posted 26 July 2008 - 10:50 AM

92 Loyale

I have orderd a two row (1 5/16" core) radiator from Radiator Barn, got the 5/8", one from Complete Radiators, got the 5/8" one, one from JC Whitney, got the 5/8" one. The ones from JC, and Complete were the same exact rad from the same manufacturer, and of very high quality, just different stickers on the box. The one from Rad Barn was crap and I would not have used it anyway. But, every place sent me a return tag without a problem. But none of them has any intentions to change their webpages to reflect thet the two row, or thicker core rad has been superseeded by the thinner 5/8" core rad. They all kept trying to feed me this crap that they are a high efficiency rad and would do the job of the thicker two row. Well, that would be fine but the rad they send me is a copper/brass unit with the same cooling fins per inch and same amount of tubes from tank to tank as the aluminum one that's in the car now!, How is that more efficient? I know full well that it's the same rad as if I ordered the 5/8" one.
I even called first to confirm that it was still availabe! Confirming the dimensions with them too! I even called the manufacturer, both of them, to confirm that it was still available, and all these phone operators say yes it's available and it is a 1 5/16" core rad, then act dumbfounded and surprised when I call back and tell them I got the wrong one. But still won't change the website to make it easier for future customers.

I believe I had a Spectra Premium from JC and Complete, and Rad Barn was a Modine.


So, has anyone ordered a 2 row rad lately, and who did you order it from?

If I can't find one by monday, I'm ordering the 5/8" from JC for $99. The 1 5/16" one was $153 from them, and I got the 5/8" one, so I might as well save myself some cash if that's all I'm going to get right?

#2 brokebill

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Posted 26 July 2008 - 11:23 AM

not to hijack, but i'm also probably gonna have to get one so good to know your hassle with the 2 rows.
by the way, autozone can 1 day the 1 row $99 if yours is the same application as mine.
good luck and thanks for saving the rest of us the trouble/time of reordering the wrong parts due to their misinformation/crap.

thanks, Bill

#3 Dr_RPM

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Posted 26 July 2008 - 10:13 PM

92 Loyale

I have orderd a two row (1 5/16" core) radiator from Radiator Barn, got the 5/8", one from Complete Radiators, got the 5/8" one, one from JC Whitney, got the 5/8" one. The ones from JC, and Complete were the same exact rad from the same manufacturer, and of very high quality, just different stickers on the box. The one from Rad Barn was crap and I would not have used it anyway. But, every place sent me a return tag without a problem. But none of them has any intentions to change their webpages to reflect thet the two row, or thicker core rad has been superseeded by the thinner 5/8" core rad. They all kept trying to feed me this crap that they are a high efficiency rad and would do the job of the thicker two row. Well, that would be fine but the rad they send me is a copper/brass unit with the same cooling fins per inch and same amount of tubes from tank to tank as the aluminum one that's in the car now!, How is that more efficient? I know full well that it's the same rad as if I ordered the 5/8" one.
I even called first to confirm that it was still availabe! Confirming the dimensions with them too! I even called the manufacturer, both of them, to confirm that it was still available, and all these phone operators say yes it's available and it is a 1 5/16" core rad, then act dumbfounded and surprised when I call back and tell them I got the wrong one. But still won't change the website to make it easier for future customers.

I believe I had a Spectra Premium from JC and Complete, and Rad Barn was a Modine.


So, has anyone ordered a 2 row rad lately, and who did you order it from?

If I can't find one by monday, I'm ordering the 5/8" from JC for $99. The 1 5/16" one was $153 from them, and I got the 5/8" one, so I might as well save myself some cash if that's all I'm going to get right?


Frank B,

I happen to work for radiatorbarn.com and we do not sell Modine radiators, Modine does not actually sell a product under that name any longer. Our site only lists the 5/8" core. I checked into it a little and the manufacturer that we would cary for that vehicle is CSF. CSF does show a listing in their catalog for the heavy duty model but they have discontinued that item, they show two remaining in stock but that would most likely be an error. We at radiatorbarn.com would never intentionally mislead a customer, and we would not tell a customer that a radiator which is half the thickness of another would be as efficient, physics is physics. I do not mean this as an argument I just happen to take pride in the fact that we have established ourselves as a very honest and reputable business and I take it to heart when someone advertises otherwise. Viva la Subaru!

#4 brokebill

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Posted 26 July 2008 - 10:51 PM

experiences vary.

any chance of moving this to the vendors forum and giving some good deals in these hard times?

thanks, Bill

#5 Turbone

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Posted 26 July 2008 - 11:28 PM

I've bought 3 rads from the Barn, all at the same time. They actually called me to make sure of the order.
The Double row one in my RX is doing great, I have had no leaks or cooling issues in almost 20K. The one in my Hatch is also doing great, wish I could put one on my PS :rolleyes:
As far as I know, the 3rd one is still going, in my 86 GL-ao Turbo Wagon.

#6 NorthWet

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 12:08 AM

I have 2-row which I believe I got from Radiator Barn, but 1-2 years ago.

BTW, a copper core will be much more efficient (2x+) at cooling than an aluminum core. And the aluminum cores have a nasty habit of developing a thermal-insulating oxide coating as they age. Aluminum is used for 4 reasons:
1) It is cheaper
2) It is lighter than copper (OEM reason)
3) "Tuners" think it is "cool" and "racy" (Tuner reason)
4) It is cheaper
4a) It is cheaper

#7 McDave

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 05:41 AM

If I can't find one by monday, I'm ordering the 5/8" from JC for $99. The 1 5/16" one was $153 from them, and I got the 5/8" one, so I might as well save myself some cash if that's all I'm going to get right?

I bet you end up with an aluminum one if you do that. If the size is going to be the same, the difference must be in the materials.

#8 Andy FitzGibbon

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 10:43 AM

I tried to order a two row from Radiator Barn a while ago and they called me to say they were out of stock and that the manufacturer was out also. They were very nice about it. At that time they still showed the two row on their site but that was a few months ago. I ended up buying one from another place, it looks OK but I haven't used it yet (can't remember the name of the place, but will post later).
Andy

#9 Frank B

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 10:55 AM

Frank B,

I happen to work for radiatorbarn.com and we do not sell Modine radiators, Modine does not actually sell a product under that name any longer. Our site only lists the 5/8" core. I checked into it a little and the manufacturer that we would cary for that vehicle is CSF. CSF does show a listing in their catalog for the heavy duty model but they have discontinued that item, they show two remaining in stock but that would most likely be an error. We at radiatorbarn.com would never intentionally mislead a customer, and we would not tell a customer that a radiator which is half the thickness of another would be as efficient, physics is physics. I do not mean this as an argument I just happen to take pride in the fact that we have established ourselves as a very honest and reputable business and I take it to heart when someone advertises otherwise. Viva la Subaru!


Your're right, it wasn't modine, it was csf, csf 933 I believe, and in my opinion it was crap. I didn't like the craftmanship at all. I spoke to Holden when I called to confirm the dimensions of the 1 5/16" rad and he was awesome! Very professional, very thorough, in fact he called to the Dallas warehouse and had someone go out, open the box, and measure it. But that man had no idea what part of the rad was the core and ended up measuring the tank! I'm not too sure why he had Dallas do this, my order came out of Philli, or Pittsburg, I can't remember now. And I even wrote in the notes area of the order form for them to confirm the core thickness before shipping and to contact me if it was different. I didn't get any response, just the wrong rad at my door. Isn't Visteon, or Valeo Modines new name? I remember Holden talking about that and that's where I got modine from I guess. They were very professional, very easy to deal with, and they weren't misleading at all, the manufacturer is by selling a 5/8" rad in place of a 1 5/16" rad. But, radiator barn hasn't changed the website to reflect this have they? Isn't that close to misleading?

If they show two in stock, is there some way that you could confirm this, like have someone actually look at them? I would order it if I knew that's what I was going to get.

I've been driving to work in 90 degree heat with the heater on to keep it from overheating! Mostly on hills. Four weeks I've been going back and forth with this, order a rad, send it back, order another one, send it back. One is in route now to be returned, and one is sitting here next to me and will be sent back tomorrow. Both I have payed for! Almost $300 of my money just out there.
I worked in the parts business for a while, I know what it's like to have a customer get irate and angry with me when I did everything right and the manufacturer is the one that screwed up. It sucks, but that's just the way it is.

#10 Frank B

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 10:57 AM

I just checked the website, they did chamge it and do not show the heavy duty 1 5/16 rad anymore!
Good job :banana: .

#11 Frank B

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 11:12 AM

Proliance is the name for Modine now. Which is also Traspro, and Ready-Rad which is what I got from Complete radiators, and is also what Autozone carries. But, the one I have here form JC Whitney is the same as the one I got from Complete Rad, same rad, same box, both made in Thailand, but this one say Spectre Premium.

No wonder I'm cunfused!

#12 McDave

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 11:17 AM

I've been driving to work in 90 degree heat with the heater on to keep it from overheating!

Dude, put one of the quality 5/8ths inch ones in there before you or your car blows a head gasket! We've had 30+ days over 100 here in Texas this summer and I've been using A/C like crazy with one of the good copper/brass radiators. The gauge never gets up to the half way mark.

BTW... How well is your fan clutch working? It should be moving lots of air (you can hear it with the hood up) when you first start it cold. Then after about 30 seconds it should quiet down, then when it gets good and hot it should start moving lots of air again. Also when hot, the fan should stop spinning the instant you shut the key off and the motor stops.

#13 Frank B

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 11:41 AM

Thanks,
The clutch fan is working, the electric fan is also working. I hope and believe that the headgaskets are ok at this point. Or at least not the cause of the high temps. When I go to work at 12-3 PM, its hot and the temp goes up unless I turn the heat on. When I come home 12-3 am, it's cool out and the temp doesn't go up.

I have to swing by autozone today anyway to return something, I'll see if they can get that 5/8 rad for me. Transpro, or whatever, is what I have right here in a Spectre Premium box so I know what I'll get.

#14 Scoobywagon

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 12:48 PM

ordered one from Performance Radiator a couple days ago. I'll let you know how that works out when it gets here and I get it put in.

#15 Petersubaru

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 02:04 PM

92 Loyale

I have orderd a two row (1 5/16" core) radiator from Radiator Barn, got the 5/8", one from Complete Radiators, got the 5/8" one, one from JC Whitney, got the 5/8" one. The ones from JC, and Complete were the same exact rad from the same manufacturer, and of very high quality, just different stickers on the box. The one from Rad Barn was crap and I would not have used it anyway. But, every place sent me a return tag without a problem. But none of them has any intentions to change their webpages to reflect thet the two row, or thicker core rad has been superseeded by the thinner 5/8" core rad. They all kept trying to feed me this crap that they are a high efficiency rad and would do the job of the thicker two row. Well, that would be fine but the rad they send me is a copper/brass unit with the same cooling fins per inch and same amount of tubes from tank to tank as the aluminum one that's in the car now!, How is that more efficient? I know full well that it's the same rad as if I ordered the 5/8" one.
I even called first to confirm that it was still availabe! Confirming the dimensions with them too! I even called the manufacturer, both of them, to confirm that it was still available, and all these phone operators say yes it's available and it is a 1 5/16" core rad, then act dumbfounded and surprised when I call back and tell them I got the wrong one. But still won't change the website to make it easier for future customers.

I believe I had a Spectra Premium from JC and Complete, and Rad Barn was a Modine.


So, has anyone ordered a 2 row rad lately, and who did you order it from?

If I can't find one by monday, I'm ordering the 5/8" from JC for $99. The 1 5/16" one was $153 from them, and I got the 5/8" one, so I might as well save myself some cash if that's all I'm going to get right?

...TWO row available..$112.. at Rockauto.com ...they also have the One row available for $75

#16 McDave

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 02:12 PM

...TWO row available..$112.. at Rockauto.com ...they also have the One row available for $75

What part numbers or year/model categories did you use to search with? I've looked on that site many times and always drew a blank.

#17 Petersubaru

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 02:53 PM

What part numbers or year/model categories did you use to search with? I've looked on that site many times and always drew a blank.

Thankyou for pointing that out...it was a mistake on my part...the info given was for a hatchback...I guess I should read first...the demensions are close, but no cigar

#18 McDave

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 04:28 PM

.the info given was for a hatchback.. the demensions are close, but no cigar


Man they are close, but the taller height would probably be a deal killer. Check out this disclaimer:

This manufacturer reserves the right to change design and construction materials without notice. For example, a radiator listed as copper/brass may be supplied as plastic/aluminum, a radiator listed as 3 row may be supplied as a 2 row, or a radiator for a manual-transmission vehicle may be supplied with oil cooler fittings (which are unnecessary for a manual transmission but allow the same part number to be used for both manual and automatic vehicles). Regardless of design, the manufacturer offers the same warranty and the same assurance that the part will fit the vehicle application listed and perform as well or better than original equipment.



#19 edrach

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 08:25 PM

Having replaced at least four radiators over the years in four different cars (all subarus), I've never needed a two row and never had to replace a single row radiator that I installed. I can't see paying 50% more for a double row.

#20 DaveT

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 08:56 PM

ordered one from Performance Radiator a couple days ago.


I got a 2 row there a number of months ago. All copper & brass, and not made in china junk.

I shouldn't need a new one for 5-10 years, but If they become unavailable, I will get an old one re cored.

#21 beataru

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Posted 27 July 2008 - 09:25 PM

yeah I ordered the csf one from rad barn, I returned it because 1, I accidentally ordered the single row, and 2 It looked like garbage the way it was made, and they still have not given me the refund on the radiator... I got insurance and tracking and did everything they asked me to do, there going down if I dont get my money soon, I believe performance radiator has the 2 row. (there main place is down here) thats where my next adventure is going to be...

#22 Frank B

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 03:29 AM

...TWO row available..$112.. at Rockauto.com ...they also have the One row available for $75


I checked them too, all the rads they offer are the same as the rad websites, which means Rockauto can't get the 2 row anymore either.
All these places are just a catalog store, meaning the rad are drop shipped from the manufacturer. The only difference is the price and how fast you want to have it.

I wanted a 2 row, or thick core because I had replaced the one in an 89 GL-10 turbo a few years back with one and even with the turbo, and ac, and my heavy foot, the temp never came up!

Oh well, all good things............

#23 Frank B

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Posted 28 July 2008 - 03:32 AM

I ordered one(5/8" core) from Autozone today, have it tuesday which is good, that's my first of three days off so I can FINALLY get a new rad in the car. It's a Transpro, same part number as the one I just got, and returned from Jc Whitney, which was the same as the one I ordered from Complete radiators, just a different sticker on the same "made in thailand" part. Just cheaper, $99.

#24 brokebill

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 06:23 PM

update results,opinion on this radiator when you get done please.

thanks, Bill

#25 Frank B

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Posted 29 July 2008 - 06:39 PM

update results,opinion on this radiator when you get done please.

thanks, Bill


I got it in today, just finished about a half hour ago. It was a Ready Rad brand, which is a Proliance, which is Transpro, which was Modine at some point. It was just like the stock one, aluminum with plastic tanks but the lower hose connection is at a steeper angle which crimped the hose. It couldn't make the turn. There was a flex hose for the upper hose which I don't like so I bought a new upper hose to replace it. I ended up using the flex hose for the lower. So keep that in mind. It also has an extra fitting, or two fittings in the right tank for the fan switch. One where the stock one is, and one on the side. I used the one on the side and if I ever get to replacing the driven fan with an electric, I'll get another switch and put it into the other fitting. It also has the tranny cooler in it for autos. It does the job, that's apparent already.
It's funny that all four of the 5/8" ones I got that were supposed to be 1 5/16" were all metal, brass and copper. This one which was supposed to be 5/8", is plastic and aluminum. Whatever. It was $99 and I had it in two days, one if you order it on a weekday.

Oh, and it was made in China!!
The others were made in Thailand, and I can't remember where the CSf one was made.




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