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engine noise


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10 replies to this topic

#1 pacerven

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Posted 09 January 2004 - 12:18 AM

I have a 1991 subaru loyale, 1.8L engine w/ 4wd. It started with a cold start in -10 degrees f. My engine turned over a little rough but this was normal for cold starting. It has been making lifter noise all winter but always went away when the engine was at normal operating temp. After starting on the particular day the temp dropped, however, it was making more noise than usual. Unfortunately i thought this was possibly another lifter making noise due to the abnormal temp. However, it never went away, even after warming up. I let it sit and restarted a day later to try and figure out where exactly the noise is coming from. I am afraid to drive my car or even start it again. It seems the whole engine is making a metal to metal chattering. Sounds very valve train sounding for sure, but could be making crank noise too. (Its hard to tell, it is loud.) The engine still runs like normal as far as running. It runs and idels smooth, and seems no loss of power. The oil pressure has lowered a little, but not significantly since all went bad. Could the oil pump have given out? Could an oil channel have plugged. I am baffeled. I am sure with the noise internal damage is being done everytime that thing runs. I am not driving it, for I can guarentee it won't go far before dying completely. The car ran fine the night before, no probs. ANY HELP OR SUGGESTIONS. I am thinking the engine will have to come out for overhaul but don't know for sure. Anything you can suggest please let me know. Thanks a bunch.

#2 GLCraig

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Posted 09 January 2004 - 12:40 AM

Lifter noise is very common with that engine. Probably the most common cause; is that the o-ring and seal for the oil pump have worn out. What happens when they wear out, the pump will suck air into the oil, the air will circulate through the oil and when it reaches the lifters it compresses and causes the lifters to collapse and cause noise. Typically there isn't any damaged cause by this.

#3 GeneralDisorder

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Posted 09 January 2004 - 06:03 AM

Yep - I've heard some with HORRIBLE sounding lifters that run for years like that. It doesn't cause any damage really. Try some Marvel Mystery Oil - if that doesn't help then it's time for a new pump, or a reseal. For the cost and the time I would probably just get a whole pump - I think they are on the order of $60 or so...

GD

#4 pacerven

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Posted 10 January 2004 - 02:21 AM

It looks like around here parts stores are getting around 140 for the pump. If it is seals that typically go bad, are there rebuild kits available? Could rebuilding the pump solve the problem or do you highly recommend getting a whole new pump? Thanks for the input.

#5 GeneralDisorder

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Posted 10 January 2004 - 02:41 AM

Yes - you can just reseal the pump - ask your parts stores for the oil pump seals..... if done right, this can often fix the problem.

GD

#6 Turbone

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Posted 10 January 2004 - 03:00 AM

When was the last time you changed the oil? And what grade are you using? It might help if you used a 10-W40 for colder temps, maybe even 10-W30. If you re-seal the oil pump, go with OEM parts.
Rob

#7 ccrinc

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Posted 10 January 2004 - 09:46 AM

If the engine's shaking like that, are you sure it's firing on all cylinders?
Like, is there a plug wire loose, or a bad spark plug? Another good possibility...a vacuum hose broke in the cold or came loose.

In cold weather, you're going to have a lot of lifter noise anyway, but it wouldn't make the engine shake like that.

Emily
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#8 pacerven

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Posted 10 January 2004 - 05:03 PM

The oil I am currently using is 10w-40. I used some of that "mystery oil" at last oil change which was about 1000miles ago. The engine is not shaking, it is just makeing loud clanking. Also, like i said, all cylinders are fireing...the engine runs just like it always did, just very loud. Beieve me, this is louder than normall lifer noise, and doesn't go away when the engine is at its normall operating temp. Even the outside temp has restored to its norms and has made no difference. I guess I will start with resealing the oil pump and see if that does anything. Thanks again.

#9 Skip

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Posted 10 January 2004 - 05:25 PM

Pacer, are you a aware of the fact the front of the engine needs dismanatled to service the oil pump?
The driver's side cam belt also turns the oil pump.
You may want to arm yourself with some other maintance parts if you are going to attemp this.
The list is:
cam seals
front seal
belts? (idlers if ness.)
H20 pump
Please help me out here guys if I missed something.

One other thing I just thought I might mention. The lifters are pumped up by oil pressure which is held in check by relief valves in the cam cases. Since this came on rather suddenly maybe you have a stuck relief valve allowing the pressure in the lifter gallery to not come up to the proper pressure. They can be accessed by removing the cam covers and the "banjo" bolt found under the cover.
You can see these relief valves circled in this scan


Posted Image

#10 pacerven

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Posted 11 January 2004 - 04:39 AM

Hmm, I was not aware of that...thank you for the heads up. If that is the case I will just go with a new pump so i don't have to do it all over again. If major work is required I may have to wait till spring or find a friend with a heated garage to make things a little easier. I will try inspecting those checkvalves. (Thanks for the pic.) What exactly should I be looking for in them. Are they simply a ball and spring arrangement? Also, how easy is it to get at them with the engine in the car, it looks tight.

#11 viceversa

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Posted 11 January 2004 - 10:47 AM

I had almost the same thing happen yesterday. "loud clanking" and did not immediately go away when engine got warm. It took another 5-10 minutes for it to stop. But unlike your case, it did stop.

No other symptoms - no loss of power, etc.

The temp. was lower than usual, about 12F.




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