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official build thread.........this is monstaru2


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149 replies to this topic

#26 Numbchux

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 05:43 AM

alright...you got my gears turning :eek:

so I went downstairs. hmmm....look at that, an empty r160 case, and a ring gear sitting right next to it from my last LSD conversion. first thing, the bolt pattern for the rear cover definitely is symmetrical. so you really could just throw it on upside-down.

but, the pinion gear is off center, in both dimensions. obviously it's near the bottom of the case (presumably why you want to flip it), but it's also off to the right side. so, putting the ring gear on the other side would mean the helical cut on the gears would be the wrong way around. but also the center of the pinion shaft would line up about where the back of the ring gear would be...


I don't think it would work, even with a custom-made gearset. cool idea, but looking at it, I just don't see a way it would work (boy.....I wonder where I put my camera.....)

#27 VaporTrail

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 10:34 AM

the old USRM article has some pics...

http://www.indysworl...ap/lsdswap.html

#28 bheinen74

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 11:35 AM

on turning the diff upside down, no
It has a low sump that is designed to help drain, circulate the oil to the pinion. Then when the pinion is turning, it throws gear oil upward, which hits the case and circulates around. The low sump passageway drains the oil back to it, thus it recirculates the oil. Same on the rear at the ring gear.

#29 The Beast I Drive

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 01:27 PM

Hey Brian, why not look for a Nissan pick up front diff? Cant you get some 4.444s to stuff into one of those?

On a side note, I always thought you could just put the rear diff in the front, no need to do anything special, I swore Ive seen it that way on several rigs, so Im not quite sure why you are trying to flip it :confused: but I could be wrong, I never really looked into it. Good luck!
-Bill

#30 monstaru

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 01:37 PM

yeah,i realized that too chux.....i just never looked at the case with that in mind ya'know.we get so tuned in to what others have done with their rigs because those are the "standard operating procedures" that we forget to think outside the box.......


and bheinen,if you flipped it upside down you would just need to figure out another thrower system,or keep it at a level just at the splines of the pinion in order to oil.because it is the bearings that need lubed back in there,nothing else.i don't care what the FSM says........i care what practical experience from taking these apart and expirimenting says......
:)cheers, brian

and billy, it does go in with no issues up front,i was talking about using a high pinion for the back.if you look at that last pic....it appears i could stuff it upside down and clear the torsion bar and fuel tank.and give mad clearance.......


alright...you got my gears turning :eek:

so I went downstairs. hmmm....look at that, an empty r160 case, and a ring gear sitting right next to it from my last LSD conversion. first thing, the bolt pattern for the rear cover definitely is symmetrical. so you really could just throw it on upside-down.

but, the pinion gear is off center, in both dimensions. obviously it's near the bottom of the case (presumably why you want to flip it), but it's also off to the right side. so, putting the ring gear on the other side would mean the helical cut on the gears would be the wrong way around. but also the center of the pinion shaft would line up about where the back of the ring gear would be...


I don't think it would work, even with a custom-made gearset. cool idea, but looking at it, I just don't see a way it would work (boy.....I wonder where I put my camera.....)


Edited by monstaru, 01 February 2009 - 01:39 PM.
reply to beastie too


#31 bratman18

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 01:57 PM

Oh I get what you were getting at now. I thought you were talking about putting it in the front. oops my bad

#32 The Beast I Drive

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 03:15 PM

Ahhh, I see now. So are you thinking about flipping it over, and putting the pinion shaft over the torsion tube? That would net you like a foot of centerline clerance!
-Bill

#33 monstaru

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 07:09 PM

yeah, kinda like this....
Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image

i only had to turn the front bracket upside down,trim a bit for the pinion to fit....then massage the gas tank with a BFH.........and it fit.

i will be making new axles.which is ok,i always wanted to anyway.cheers, brian

#34 bratman18

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 08:19 PM

That's sweet! I'd never thought of that before. But yeah Those axles are gonna need to be longer and maybe a cup that allows for a higher angle. Cool idea

#35 Psyko

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 08:24 PM

I'd be interested in seeing what happens to the axles if left like that. Whatever it is, I'm sure you wouldn't have to wait long.

#36 monstaru

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 08:32 PM

winks...........just for you kid, I'll see what i can do...:grin:there is no flex left,it would break outta there like a jailbird outta the hokie......fast and hard.....


it seems that all of the jabber about the 510's and porsches may pan out.i have wanted to rebuild some axles for a long time.i think now is the time.i think i will probably stick to some u-joints though...............cheers, brian




I'd be interested in seeing what happens to the axles if left like that. Whatever it is, I'm sure you wouldn't have to wait long.



#37 bheinen74

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 08:52 PM

i don't think any axle can take that angle coming right off the diff.


O
/ . \
| . |

the "o" means diff
the / \ are axles
the | | are tires

#38 monstaru

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 09:10 PM

no?ok.....i'll gather some parts,and we shall see.
re-build i guess i should have said.......................


cheers, brian:)

i don't think any axle can take that angle coming right off the diff.


O
/ . \
| . |

the "o" means diff
the / \ are axles
the | | are tires


Edited by monstaru, 01 February 2009 - 09:13 PM.


#39 The Beast I Drive

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 11:18 PM

Hey Brian, heres an idea for the axles, my 76 4wd wagon has double u joints with slip yokes, see here
Posted Image

You could prolly have something like that made to work, I could sell you these so you could have them lengthend and just use regular Brat axles on my rig, if you want. lemme know eh?
-Bill

#40 Numbchux

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 11:18 PM

absolutely awesome idea. love the train of thought. lubrication is AN issue, but I don't think it's THE issue. I just don't think there's a way to get it to spin the right way in that case.

#41 bheinen74

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Posted 01 February 2009 - 11:38 PM

Hey Brian, heres an idea for the axles, my 76 4wd wagon has double u joints with slip yokes, see here
Posted Image

You could prolly have something like that made to work, I could sell you these so you could have them lengthend and just use regular Brat axles on my rig, if you want. lemme know eh?
-Bill


HOLY CRAP....nice :eek::banana::grin:

#42 [HTi]Johnson

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Posted 02 February 2009 - 12:45 AM

:eek:

....:popcorn:

#43 bratman18

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Posted 02 February 2009 - 08:08 AM

Bill where did you get those? What are they from?

#44 VaporTrail

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Posted 02 February 2009 - 10:13 AM

Bill where did you get those? What are they from?


those are stock... I think it was 77 or 78 when they went to the non-u-joint axles.

#45 bratman18

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Posted 02 February 2009 - 10:20 AM

those are stock... I think it was 77 or 78 when they went to the non-u-joint axles.


no kidding! Those would work well if they were lengthened for the newer ones!

#46 The Beast I Drive

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Posted 02 February 2009 - 11:59 AM

Subaru shouldve stuck with the U joint setup IMO, prolly woulda worked for the front on the DOJ side of the axles too. I cant imagine brakin one of those things unless you land on a pile of rebar and it goes through your ujoint.
-Bill

#47 bratman18

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Posted 02 February 2009 - 12:12 PM

Subaru shouldve stuck with the U joint setup IMO, prolly woulda worked for the front on the DOJ side of the axles too. I cant imagine brakin one of those things unless you land on a pile of rebar and it goes through your ujoint.
-Bill


yeah exactly!! Looks like a pretty strong setup

#48 monstaru

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Posted 03 February 2009 - 08:21 AM

well, i get to work today.at least i can think about something else for a change.yay,concrete!:rolleyes:

i got the u-joint mania........keep thinking about those damn rear axles.

well, this week will be slow as i picked up a suzuki driveshaft in good shape to hack up to make another driveshaft.i should have all of the suzuki flanges i need now.

after a look last night , the u joints are amazingly close in size, so i will see if subie u-joints fit into suzuki flanges.if not i will take a trip to brown bearing and see what they say about it.

if they are bearers of bad news i will just cut and weld.cheers, brian

#49 baccaruda

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Posted 03 February 2009 - 03:20 PM

I'm surprised you don't have a sponsorship from BB yet! :grin:

#50 monstaru

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Posted 04 February 2009 - 08:36 PM

got some mounting for the subframe done today,cut some mounting tabs for the front,also cut the "z" pieces which i do not know if i will be able to use.DOH!!

also been doing some legwork for the rear axles.findings are interesting so far.cheers, brian




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