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Replace 2.5L for 2.2L in '99 O/B


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13 replies to this topic

#1 JoeKrepps

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Posted 20 April 2009 - 02:57 PM

Hi everyone,

First time post. Sent here by an outstanding member of the Outback Yahoo Group.

My '99 O/B, s/w, 5mt has just under 249k miles. It _appears_ the main bearings are going south. My mechanic, at Hartlaub's Auto Service (a former dealer mechanic who went out on his own) & I are considering putting a 2.2L in it. He's always wanted to try it but never had a guinea pig.

My goal is for the car to run another 3 years which, at the current annual mileage, will put it at ~325k miles. (I've also just dumped a new exhaust into it, starting at the 2nd cat to the end of the car + new tires in Dec.)

I'm looking for any/all advice! I'm told this is the place to be.

I already know I'm taking a hit on power (though I suspect someone out there has upped their 2.2L) but gaining reliability and a few more MPGs. I currently get 27-30MPG, combined/mixed. The 5 speed stays - it's got some bearing noise in 4th but that can wait. I have an early '99 so, of course, the fool thing is a DOHC and hardly worth rebuilding. Just had a pulley on the timing belt nearly seize, bending the water pump shaft + jumping the timing on one cam by 1 or 2 teeth...and what DOHC 2.5L is complete without doing the HGs? Can you tell I'm just not that into my 2.5L any more?

MANY MANY sincere thanks for your time & experiences! :)

Heck...I'd toss in a 2.2L Turbo ouia' WRX if I could get one (worth having) cheap! :banana:

Joe
'99 O/B, s/w, 5mt, 248k miles...and hammering shortly after a dead cold start :eek:

#2 Drakien

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Posted 20 April 2009 - 03:26 PM

Go for it! Get the 2.2l There are far less problems with them. From what everyone says they are a pretty easy swap. Just make sure the 2.2l motor you buy is in Sound mechanical condition. You don't want to get it in and realize its crap. :rolleyes:

And the 2.2l are cheaper for the engine in the first place.

#3 Hondasucks

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Posted 20 April 2009 - 11:01 PM

Yeah, it should be pretty easy, however you'll need the wiring and computer to go with it, since I THINK the intake between the 2.2 and 2.5L is different, but I don't know for sure since I've never had a 2.5 and a 2.2 apart at the same time.

#4 davebugs

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Posted 20 April 2009 - 11:05 PM

Intakes won't swap - but you shouldn't need to.

Search around here.

I just answered this about someone else asking within the last week.

I'ts plug and play. Only items are plumbing for EVAP system and sometimes valve cover breathers. PS lines don't fit into the bracket is the only real shortcoming and who cares?

Good folks here to help. But please do some research first.

#5 grossgary

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Posted 20 April 2009 - 11:07 PM

you'll need the wiring and computer to go with it,

not true. it's a bolt in and plug and play affair. remove EJ25 - install EJ22. no need to swap any wiring or the ECU.

#6 JoeKrepps

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 04:32 PM

THANKS everyone! This is really encouraging! My mechanic, on vacation 'til Sunday, was concerned about the ECU also. Not needing one for the 2.2L is really good news.

Really quick question: just put a rebuilt alternator in it - will that transfer to the 2.2L? May as well save a buck.

It just occured to me that I might be in the wrong forum. (Yeah, playing the uninformed newbie here.) Should I take this to the "Subaru Retrofitting" side?

Again, many thanks. I'll let every one know how it went. Feel free to continue to post your thoughts OR off-list messages are welcome too: occupant (at) ytpress.com

Joe

#7 davebugs

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 06:49 PM

Basically you'll need all the accessories and brackets of the old engine.

#8 grossgary

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Posted 21 April 2009 - 06:59 PM

you can search for more info because you'll need to transfer some items from the EJ25 to the EJ22. and yes the alternator will work fine.

#9 disrespectedSUB

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 05:45 AM

New to the forums, and just bought a 99 OBW with blown 2.5L as well. I'm a certified GM tech, so I haven't done many Subi's. This one has a brand new clutch, tires, and brakes, so even with 238,000mi it's gonna do for a backup car for the girlfriend when it snows or she wants some cargo room without taking my truck.
Anyway, I understand the 2.2 should fit in where the 2.5L was. I seem to be finding more info on going from an EA to an EJ. I tried a search for 2.5L to 2.2L and haven't come up with much(though I'm told there is a lot on here abuot it).
Mainly my question is this:I only saw it in one place but want to make sure...I can use a 2.2L from an Automatic car in my manual car, right? From what I understand it has 4 bellhousing holes instead of the 8 on a manual... Is this right?
And just to clarify, I'm a little fuzzy on the year changes, what year 2.2L swaps in? That's DOHC as well, correct, not the SOHC?

Thanks gang! Can't wait to check out more on the forums! Photo section should be a fun place to visit ;)

#10 grossgary

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 06:48 AM

search for EJ22, EJ25, and/or SWAP. and maybe look in the USRM.

ignore all the bolt hole commentary.

here's answers to your questions and all you need to know:

DOHC/SOHC means nothing here, you're dropping a SOHC EJ22 into a DOHC EJ25 vehicle. you want 95-98 EJ22 with EGR. if you get a 96-98 you'll need the single port exhaust manifold with it.

1997 and up EJ22's are interference engines, install a new timing belt kit (pulleys, belt, tensioner) with the new engine.

most (if not all) EJ25's have EGR. if yours does, then you want an EGR equipped EJ22. nearly all 95 automatics have EGR. other years there's a small percentage that don't have EGR, so you need to verify.

#11 disrespectedSUB

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 12:54 PM

Thank you! It seems to me you're saying the 95 alone is the muchmore simple "plu/play" option. Getting a newer one with the other manifold port is just for the egr I presume.

Also, when you say to ignore the auto/man commentary you mean either engine doesn't matter, it does bolt up?

Gonna do more searching for an engine now =)

#12 grossgary

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 02:24 PM

Thank you! It seems to me you're saying the 95 alone is the muchmore simple "plu/play" option.

that's up to you, personally i'd look for them all, to install a non-95 engine all you need the exhaust manifold, big deal. it's one part. you're going to be swapping brackets, hoses, removing an entire engine, disconnecting all sorts of clamps, bolts, wires, connectors...i personally don't see where one more part (the exhaust manifold) is a big deal!

the exhaust has nothing to do with the EGR set up, EGR is all engine/intake related. 95 EJ22's = dual port exhaust. 96+ EJ22's = single port exhaust. the EJ25 is dual port (like 95 EJ22's). so for a 96 EJ22 you'll need the manifold to match. but it's a bolt on affair.

like i said get a 95-98 with EGR. if it's a 96-98 get the exhaust manifold with it. it's that simple.

auto/manual DOES NOT MATTER!!!! it will bolt right up.

#13 disrespectedSUB

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Posted 22 April 2009 - 04:31 PM

all sounds simple enough! I understand the exhaust port deal now. I took it as needing an egr port for an egr line to come from manifold to egr on intake.
WOW! EJ22's much easier to come by for a better price as well! It's not a "tuner", so here we go....WOOHOO!

#14 grossgary

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Posted 23 April 2009 - 12:38 AM

Yeah the EGR set up just goes from the intake to the back of the head on the engine, not the actual exhaust pipes.

WOW! EJ22's much easier to come by for a better price as well!

that's because EJ22's don't have piston slap, head gasket, and rod bearing problems. more EJ25's go to the grave at a young age, meaning less make it to the used market and the demand for those that do is high. this means nothing individually but in terms of the big picture, the high mileage reliability of the EJ22 is a step up from the EJ25.




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