monstaru Posted April 26, 2012 Share Posted April 26, 2012 Evidently you shouldna have anything to worry about if your Heims are quality. http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ruffstuff&Product_Code=HORIZ4LK&Category_Code=LNKBrackets Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ioku Posted May 8, 2012 Author Share Posted May 8, 2012 (edited) So I've made a good bit of progress lately. Got the engine finished and ready to go in I also swaped the 23 spline stub shafts in the D/R trans with the 25 spline shafts form the FT4wd trans so I can just use any Legacy or Impreza front axles instead of trying to find FWD Impreza axles. I forgot to get a pic of the inside of the trans but here is a comparison pic of the 4WD pinion and FT4wd pinion shaft 4WD top FT4wd bottom I'd like to try welding a 4.44 pinion to the FT4wd shaft and using it in the D/R case but need to see what the machining will cost. and 23 and 25 spline shafts these swap right over no other parts needed. I then got the trany in, installed the front axles and drive shaft and hooked up the brake lines and installed the hub adapters. with these my bolt patter is now 5x4.5 Also extended the shifter linkages and got the hooked up, but decided to do something different for the 4wd linkage I put it between the gear shifter and ebrake, like it would be in most trucks and suv's, and I have something special planed for the Hi Lo shifting, but thats staying secret for right now. And cut out the fenders put the wheels and tires of and saw how she sat. oh and this came in recently, SJR adapter plate, now I just need to file the holes in my fly wheel and I can install the engine. Edited May 8, 2012 by Ioku Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ioku Posted May 8, 2012 Author Share Posted May 8, 2012 Evidently you shouldna have anything to worry about if your Heims are quality. http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ruffstuff&Product_Code=HORIZ4LK&Category_Code=LNKBrackets Cheers Good to know its been done successfully for the last 20 years, hopefully I wont have any problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WoodsWagon Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 (edited) Evidently you shouldna have anything to worry about if your Heims are quality. http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=ruffstuff&Product_Code=HORIZ4LK&Category_Code=LNKBrackets Cheers Again, that's the joint being used to control axle rotation and placement, not to support the weight of the vehicle. That bracket mounts over the top of a solid axle differential and the coil overs would mount out on the axle tube, not on top of the links. As the axle tries to twist back or forward under power, the links and joints are being put in tension and compression, not side load. After doing some looking around, there's a few different ratings for rod ends. You've got static load in the radial and axial directions and dynamic load in both those. Static load is the max strength for it trying to hold something in position without it rotating, dynamic is the amount of load it can hold while rotating without wearing out prematurely. Axial load is the side loading of the joint, in line with the bolt hole going through it. Rod ends seem to average about 1/2 the static axial load rating of their radial load rating. So if your joint is rated to 28k static radial, then it's about or less than 14k static axial. Dynamic loads are rated less than static loads because they take wear into account. If you can find the dynamic load ratings of the upper joint you're using that would be good. Going from a chart SKF has, depending on the material of the joint the max dynamic load is anywhere from 1/3 to 2/3's of the static load. Edited May 8, 2012 by WoodsWagon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shortysayhi Posted May 8, 2012 Share Posted May 8, 2012 Where did you get the hub adapters? and how thick are they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uberoo Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 theres a familiar tool!There was a time that I thought vice grips were only for locking tailgate struts.Then I learned that they are also extremely useful for transferring the intense heat of welding to your hand... a more permanent solution is to get a thin piece of metal as long as the travel of the strut and fold it over the the top of the strut so when its in place it locks the strut.Just make the piece loose enough that you can slip it on or off relatively easy but tight enough that it locks the strut. Bonus is that you can paint the piece of metal to look like it belongs,and it frees up the vice grips for more important things....like transfering the intense heat of welding to your hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstaru Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Again, that's the joint being used to control axle rotation and placement, not to support the weight of the vehicle. That bracket mounts over the top of a solid axle differential and the coil overs would mount out on the axle tube, not on top of the links. As the axle tries to twist back or forward under power, the links and joints are being put in tension and compression, not side load. After doing some looking around, there's a few different ratings for rod ends. You've got static load in the radial and axial directions and dynamic load in both those. Static load is the max strength for it trying to hold something in position without it rotating, dynamic is the amount of load it can hold while rotating without wearing out prematurely. Axial load is the side loading of the joint, in line with the bolt hole going through it. Rod ends seem to average about 1/2 the static axial load rating of their radial load rating. So if your joint is rated to 28k static radial, then it's about or less than 14k static axial. Dynamic loads are rated less than static loads because they take wear into account. If you can find the dynamic load ratings of the upper joint you're using that would be good. Going from a chart SKF has, depending on the material of the joint the max dynamic load is anywhere from 1/3 to 2/3's of the static load. yay, a bunch of math jargon that is different from every manufacture. Plain and simple.It's gonna work.And they are replaceable parts.You are splitting hairs.It is not a race car. I posted the link to rescind MY statement earlier in the thread.And spread more chaos evidently. I think it looks cool.Curious to see how it works. CHEERS Ioku! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanurys Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 ^^far from jargon. I think it's cool that you designed your own control arms with nice welds. I think it's very lame that you reject and overlook the input from other board members. My experience has been that if there is any question about the feasibility of a proposition, that you should probably pay attention to that and thank the member for their concern. Even if you don't follow their advice (which this thread is fraught with) you can take the high road. That's what this board is all about. Practical applied input. Maybe you could ask the objecting members what they would do in place of the lateral-links. You know - incase the thing does fail. You'd have a backup plan. On another note, it does sit very nicely as you have designed it. We'll see how it holds up under dynamic loading. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ioku Posted May 10, 2012 Author Share Posted May 10, 2012 ^^far from jargon. I think it's cool that you designed your own control arms with nice welds. I think it's very lame that you reject and overlook the input from other board members. My experience has been that if there is any question about the feasibility of a proposition, that you should probably pay attention to that and thank the member for their concern. Even if you don't follow their advice (which this thread is fraught with) you can take the high road. That's what this board is all about. Practical applied input. Maybe you could ask the objecting members what they would do in place of the lateral-links. You know - incase the thing does fail. You'd have a backup plan. On another note, it does sit very nicely as you have designed it. We'll see how it holds up under dynamic loading. I think your getting me and monstaru mixed up I never blew off WoodsWagon's explanation for the loading of the ball joints its good info and I'll look into it, but for right now my plan is to get this finnished and running and then test it out I'm breaking new ground here as I don't know of anyone else that has built a suspension like this on a Subaru and am planning on having some failures and needing to make changes. I've just never been one to sit and crunch a bunch of numbers to see if something will work, I'm more of the build it test it break it learn what went wrong and improve form there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ioku Posted May 10, 2012 Author Share Posted May 10, 2012 Where did you get the hub adapters? and how thick are they? I got them off Ebay form this seller http://myworld.ebay.com/lugs-n-stuff/?_trksid=p4340.l2559 they're 1 inch thick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smackvt Posted May 12, 2012 Share Posted May 12, 2012 Yeah if worst comes to worse, you can always put those Toyota upper ball joints back on ..... That should take like a whole hour. Ü Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monstaru Posted May 15, 2012 Share Posted May 15, 2012 ^^far from jargon. I think it's cool that you designed your own control arms with nice welds. I think it's very lame that you reject and overlook the input from other board members. My experience has been that if there is any question about the feasibility of a proposition, that you should probably pay attention to that and thank the member for their concern. Even if you don't follow their advice (which this thread is fraught with) you can take the high road. That's what this board is all about. Practical applied input. Maybe you could ask the objecting members what they would do in place of the lateral-links. You know - incase the thing does fail. You'd have a backup plan. On another note, it does sit very nicely as you have designed it. We'll see how it holds up under dynamic loading. Not my car... Oh how I just love keyboard builders.People that take on projects like this are from two schools.Those that are pretty sure it will work.And folks that think it needs to be engineered like a spacecraft.(and never finish) Woodswagon: I have also seen heim joints layed down like that when utilized in 4 link setups.Defenitely weight bearing.As a matter of fact bouncing and jumping , and, and, and.... cheers still looks good,cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kanurys Posted May 15, 2012 Share Posted May 15, 2012 (edited) Good job on the build. I don't mean to be nagative in previous posts. If it work, it works. You seem to have good fab skills and I'm following your thread for that reason. I'm no keyboard builder, either. I might be very concise and plan differently than just jumping in and figuring it out, but I have a lot of respect for people who can jump right in and cut some sheet metal. I would never give advice on something I didn't have experience in. Oh, and I finish ALL of my endeavors. That's where persistence and "engineering" come in very handy. Good luck on the project. I'll be watching intently. Edited May 16, 2012 by kanurys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smackvt Posted May 16, 2012 Share Posted May 16, 2012 Yah what I said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maniac Posted June 22, 2012 Share Posted June 22, 2012 any updates? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aki Posted July 6, 2012 Share Posted July 6, 2012 Very cool build! Dig the color scheme as well, nicely sedate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ioku Posted December 27, 2012 Author Share Posted December 27, 2012 I know its been awhile but its time for an update I've been both busy and lazy and haven't gotten around to it. I Got front and rear tube bumpers built and a roof rack and winch installed I also got the engine in and running along with the onboard air system, converted an ac comp to a air compressor. and had to swap out the old front springs for some off a supra because the old one couldn't hold the weight once the engine was in. And added some limiting straps I'll tray and get some better and more updated pics soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subruise Posted December 27, 2012 Share Posted December 27, 2012 bout time!! i LOVE this build. also the surrounding controversy makes me anxious to see it in action. get back to work! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyfun Posted December 27, 2012 Share Posted December 27, 2012 Looks excellent! I'm SO gonna copy those bumper designs! Can you tell us more about your onboard air setup? Been working on something similar, just haven't actually worked on it, lol. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4play Posted December 28, 2012 Share Posted December 28, 2012 I really like this and would like to see it in action. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herb Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Looking forward to seeing this on the road. Let me know when you start manufacturing this setup for resale! My thoughts exactly, I would pay good money for a setup like this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numbchux Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 My thoughts exactly, I would pay good money for a setup like this... You say that....but I bet there wouldn't be a single who would pay fair value for a long travel suspension setup for an old gen subaru A similar performing kit from Total Chaos for an '86-95 Toyota truck/4Runner costs about $2k. And that's just upper and lower A-arms and hardware: This would require custom knuckles and engine crossmember too, at the very least. That said, I think it's awesome. That camber change through the range of motion kind of makes me nervous, but it might still function well. I'm anxious to see how it performs, and how those front axles hold up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ioku Posted December 31, 2012 Author Share Posted December 31, 2012 You say that....but I bet there wouldn't be a single who would pay fair value for a long travel suspension setup for an old gen subaru A similar performing kit from Total Chaos for an '86-95 Toyota truck/4Runner costs about $2k. And that's just upper and lower A-arms and hardware: This would require custom knuckles and engine crossmember too, at the very least. Very true, for me to come up with a bolt on kit like this I would have to get at least 4K for it and it still might not be worth it and I don't see many people wanting to pay 4 times the value of the car for a suspension kit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oregoncoast Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herb Posted December 31, 2012 Share Posted December 31, 2012 Very true, for me to come up with a bolt on kit like this I would have to get at least 4K for it and it still might not be worth it and I don't see many people wanting to pay 4 times the value of the car for a suspension kit. I'll start saving my pennies 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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