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EA82T performance & longevity mods


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Hey all,

I have an '87 XT Turbo, and an '88 RX, and I'm starting work on turning them into awesome cars again.

 

I'm keeping the EA82 primarily because I want to keep the cars looking original and discreet, to keep their original transmissions (complete with locking differentials and the RX's dual-range), and to keep the RX's spare tire mounted under the hood.

For me, an EJ swap would only be worthwhile if it were 250+HP, and would be best paired with its own transmission and the 5-lug wheels and associated suspension bits, and that's not really what I'm after here.

 

So, I've had a few brainwaves about small mods to make in addition to beefing up the engines. The big stuff so far is for the RX's impending engine rebuild; the XT will need some rust correction and an as-yet unscheduled rebuild before it gets any mods. Any constructive additions or critiques are welcome.

 

*In an effort to keep the oil temperatures down (and ultimately minimize the possibility of overheating the RH head), I'd like to run the turbo's oil outlet through the radiator's transmission oil cooler before sending it to the RH head. I figure the combination of the length of the hoses involved and the pass through the cooler would keep temps reasonable.

 

*In another effort to keep the temps down on the RH head, I'd like to take the turbo's coolant return and T it into the upper radiator hose, maybe with a one-way valve to keep the main coolant flow from backing into the turbo. This would mean capping the turbo coolant drain port on the RH head. Anybody know if the head relies on that flow, or if it's extraneous?

 

*Bigger turbo, with an ideal target of 17 PSI. I plan to run it at 15 at most, but if I need a couple extra PSI to compensate for loss in the aftercooler or through the intake, it'd be nice to have. I'm thinking a VF-8 or 11, or if I have to change the exhaust flanges anyway, a Garrett T3 or something.

 

*I'm working on getting an air-to-water charge cooler. I'd like to model it off of the form of the factory air cleaner box, which would be convenient and ease installation greatly; given the size, it should have enough area to provide effective cooling for my 200HP target. The heat exchanger could be discretely mounted in front of the radiator, or even in the RH wheel well when the resonator chamber is removed.

 

*A recirc BOV. Not sure where I'll source it yet.

 

*The factory air cleaner box and MAF are being ditched when the new engine management system is installed.

 

*I've chosen to run a MegaSquirt system to replace the factory ECU, partly because it's fully programmable, but it also has an MAP sensor, can make use of a wide-band O2 sensor, and can be configured with an integral boost controller and knock sensor. It can be upgraded later to control extra fuel injectors should I end up needing them, and I can also switch to a distributorless and/or direct ignition system should I choose to do so.

I've read that the MegaSquirt can be configured to run two separate maps, so ideally I'll have a switch that I can set that will allow me to go from 7PSI economy mode (for stop-and-go and long-distance cruising) to 15PSI performance mode by simply resetting the switch and cycling the ignition.

 

I also had thoughts on the transmission. Since I'm not too bothered by downshifting to get/keep the engine in its optimum power band, and the fact that the average highway speed limit has increased by 15MPH since these cars were introduced, I'd like to put taller gears on 4 and 5. Right now when cruising, I'm in 5th gear at 35MPH @~2000RPM, and 75MPH turns the engine at ~3750RPM, which kind of sucks. Even though I still get about 30MPG like this, I'm more interested in longevity and quieter operation than anything else with this one.

I've read that some of the older transmissions had slightly lower ratios (I don't have the particulars in front of me just now...), so I'd like to swap out those gears (and install new bearings, because, why not?) while the engines are out anyway. I've done rough calculations and would save 500~700RPM @75MPH by changing to a lower 5th gear (I think the current one is about .925, and the one I'd want is .735 or something). Anybody have experience with doing this sort of thing, or have a source for some gear sets?

 

tl;dr: Kinda difficult to summarize it all succinctly; you should read it in full.

 

Thanks!

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getting it to 200 hp, and\or running 17 psi of boost is not something that will be attainable with a few mods. anyone running that kind of numbers that I have heard of were completely built with lots of custom work. One of the first suggested mod to me was an exhaust temp gauge. this will allow you to monitor your combustion chamber temps, which is the real killer.

 

the major thing is that the stock fuel system cant keep up with any major mods to the hp or boost. the injectors are rated for the motor and wont keep up, you need to replace them or rebuild them to higher output (heard of people using thunderbird supercoupe injectors). megasquirt is a good idea, but you need to measure the flow of the injectors, pump, and lines to make sure the whole package is up to the task.

 

Most common turbo is a VF from an early legacy running around 10-11 psi of boost. even major builds with custom everything dont run much bigger, or if they do they use a boost controller to turn it down most of the time.

 

if your really serious about 200 hp, then you will need to do custom pistons, or run N/A 9.5 to 1 pistons, custom cams and head work, fuel system and ignition system mods, exhaust, spider intake, intercooler. I've also heard that people were using copper head gaskets that some company was putting out. even after all of this most people said they had to watch and be ready to take their foot out of it.

 

i would first install an exhaust temp gauge and intercooler. niether will hurt anything, and will be needed anyway. then do the complete fuel system and get it running well. then add your VF turbo and a boost controller to tune it down to stock levels. at this point you can keep increasing boost and retuning the car until you hit a problem or wall. even if you decide to go further, these pieces of equipment will be needed, but I think they will give you a good increase without too much risk.

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Thanks for the info.

I'm getting ready to send the RX's ticky little 200k-mile engine off to be rebuilt, and it will not be cheap; I'm already aware of the pricetag, and it'll be higher than the purchase price of the majority of cars that I've ever owned (my most expensive car was $7500 for a '99 Legacy B4 RSK). My intention is to keep my RX forever and ever, barring any catastrophes.

I'm trying to get a set of gen 3 heads first, because if I'm going to spend the money for a P&P job and larger valves, I'd like to do it to the heads with the lowest probability of developing fatal cracks.

I've already got most of the mods you've listed lined up. The only one I'd rather avoid is using the XT's spider manifold, because it would likely interfere with the spare tire mounting under the hood. I'm only hung up on the spare tire because there have been many instances where a can of fix-a-flat wouldn't do anything for me, and I'd rather not lose cargo space to the spare. Anyway, I figure enough boost would overcome any restrictions in the flatter manifold. If I absotively, posilutely have to change to a spider manifold to exceed ~150HP, then I'll do it; otherwise, the stock one stays.

If the stock turbo can regularly produce 10-15PSI without being over-taxed, I wouldn't mind keeping it; I'm only looking to replace it as I figure it'd be run ragged at those figures. A much bigger turbo I'd like to avoid, as I'd rather keep lag down. So yes, a VF8 or 10 will likely be the replacement for the VF7 should I need to go that route. I don't think I'd go with a TD04, because if I'm going to change all sorts of stuff anyway, I may as well go with an unrelated unit with better figures, like a Garrett. I'm still kind of thinking about using a variable geometry unit...

As for fuel, yeah, a higher-flow pump and injectors would be good ideas. I've heard that 240SX injectors fit right in.

 

Also, a lot of my goals aren't fixed: if I can get close but not quite to 200HP, that's ok. If I only need 12PSI to hit my target, then I won't push for more. As I said, I intend to keep this car for a very long time, including to overseas locations where I can bring my car (pretty much any normal tour except Japan). So, I'm after performance, but longevity is a close second.

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Just so you understand, this has been covered many times before.

 

Everyone (including myself back in the day) thinks/thought that he's gonna be the one who builds the magic EA82T that won't overheat, crack heads, and blow itself apart.

 

You won't be. You'll end up with a very expensive, melted engine. Then you'll either hate subarus or be ready for an EJ20g. But you will have alot less money.

 

 

Just the title of this thread is an Oxymoron

 

I'm not an alll out EA82 hater. They are a great, free revving engine in stock form. And I do understand wanting to keep a car stock for collecting reasons. If you really want to keep the EA82T, just rebuild it to stock and don't modify it (maybe an intercooler) Definately don't up the boost or put a bigger turbo.

 

If you Mod it, for more HP.....the longevity will become very short. Less than 10k miles. Maybe less than 1k miles.

Edited by Gloyale
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the ea82 is weak for those improvement, and will not last forever with all of that you want put in it...

 

ea82 is strong, but only in with out modifications... even in my country somw guys put a litlle bigger turbos in loyales and blow up the engine in 2 months..

 

for the money is not worth it... for the memories of your car... I will rebuild the engine y take care of it for the rest of my life....

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I ran my EA82T with a TD-04L at 14+ PSI for about 20k miles. I also added more fuel with larger injectors, modified MAF, and TMIC.

 

It had a lot more power, and ran pretty good. Alas though, it was tired at 160k miles. Leaked some oil, a bit of blue smoke on startup too. I wanted more power and better mileage.

 

So I did the EJ20G swap for around $2500 total and I'm very happy. But I think a mildly modded EA82T with under 200 HP will be okay, just give it plenty of fuel. I'd say an EJ engine would be more cost effective in the long run.

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If you are looking at spending over $5k to have the EA82t built, you really need to look into doing an EJ swap. You can buy a complete JDM wrx front clip for that kind of money.

 

You do not need to do a 5 lug swap to run an EJ transmission. You can keep the exterior of the car looking completely stock while having double the power under the hood. The EJ AWD will drive a lot better than the Full Time 4x4 transmission, especially with more power. If you get the EA82 up to 180hp, you will find the inside front wheel spinning a lot on hard turns. All the power goes to the wheel with the least traction with the FT4x4.

 

With a WRX ecu and wiring harness that works with Open Source tuning, you have all the capabilities of Megasquirt with the diagnostic codes of a factory setup. An EJ engine will make much more power with better reliability. Plus the aftermarket is full of parts for EJ's, anything EA will be one off custom.

 

I can understand running an EA with modest mods and a conservative power level. It's easy, it's cheap, and it's already bolted in the car. When you go spending big money like you're planning, it no longer makes sense on a driving enjoyment vs money spent scale.

 

That out of the way, there's a few things about the EA82t setup I wanted to cover.

 

If you're doing the RX rebuild because it's high mileage and ticky, but it isn't burning oil, I wouldn't bother. Fix the oil pump seals and replace any failed HLA's but leave the engine in.

 

If you ditch the spare tire, get a cheapo 12v portable air compressor and a plug patch kit. All my years offroading my subaru I never carried a spare.

That buys you space for an early subaru water/air intercooler with the xt spider manifold.

 

The turbo oil drain has to be a straight shot back into the motor. Any restriction or hoses running all over the place will cause oil to back up inside the turbo. Turbo's don't have positive seals, it's a labyrinth setup, so any oil backpressure will cause oil to leak into the exhaust. The turbo's coolant is such a small heat source compared to the combustion chamber and exhaust port surface that it's inconsequential in the overall head temp.

 

An oil cooler would be a good idea, I don't know if the oil/coolant sandwich off an EJ will work or not but it might be worth looking into.

 

If you run megasquirt and eliminate the MAF you don't need a recirculating BOV, atmospheric dump is fine because it's now a speed density EFI system.

 

Look into water/methanol injection. It cools the intake charge and adds knock resistance and extra fuel so you can get away with running more timing on the same fueling map without the engine blowing up.

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I ran my EA82T with a TD-04L at 14+ PSI for about 20k miles. I also added more fuel with larger injectors, modified MAF, and TMIC.

 

It had a lot more power, and ran pretty good. Alas though, it was tired at 160k miles. Leaked some oil, a bit of blue smoke on startup too. I wanted more power and better mileage.

 

So I did the EJ20G swap for around $2500 total and I'm very happy. But I think a mildly modded EA82T with under 200 HP will be okay, just give it plenty of fuel. I'd say an EJ engine would be more cost effective in the long run.

 

Omg what!??! :eek: Who, where, how can this be done? Even if for between 2500 - 5000, that is awesome. I'd like the same for my XT6. Please...Pm if necessary. :clap:

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I've owned both the cars you are wanting to build. I wouldnt waste a penny on ANY EA82T engines/blocks. They are grenades with the pins pulled. The bottom end was not designed to handle 6 psi, let alone 17 psi.

 

You are going to be putting a LOT of money into a dinosaur engine. If you like turbo's and wanted to build an engine that would last (which is kind of an oxy moron with a forced induction engine) I would get ahold of a EJ22T. The bottom ends are some of the strongest subaru designed, they will hold 20psi boost if built right and there is a lot of information, tried/tested on the EJ22T

 

Building a EA82T now a days would be like buying an STi and putting a carb on it..

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Why megasquirt,Look into running a Power Commander as normally used on bikes,Simply a case of matching up the injector hookup for a four cylinder model,Early Subies use Bosch type injector hookups so a Power commander for say a BMW K100.K1100 or K1200rs will work.

Power commander(Dynojet) also now have their piggyback system available for Mitsubishi evo 10 and later WRX in standard replacement piggyback system,Much cheaper option and easy to tune.

Later power commander five versions are slowly being upgraded to have fuel and Ignition in one box.earlier PC3 usb models need an additional ignition box but both have an analog input option stock that can be used for boosted applications with a boost correction map.

Likely more reliable than a poorly made Megasquirt as if the Power commander fails simply unplug it to get home on the stock ECU.

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Thanks for the input, all.

 

A can of fix-a-flat doesn't really help if a tire blows out or eats a slag bolt (both of which I have experienced), so I still insist on carrying at least the T-type spare, which in my RX's case needs to continue living in the engine compartment (no point to having an awesome cargo area if a good portion is occupied by the ugly spare tire all the time).

As for the XT, it's irrelephant; if I were going to do an EJ swap, I'd probably do it to the wedge (complete with an STi 6-speed and 5-lug conversion). Not sure if I'd use a high-strung EJ20T or go balls-out and turbo an EZ30; in either case, a turbo is mandatory.

 

If the Europeans can get 136bhp from their XT Turbos, I should at least be able to get the same. I'm assuming the difference is simply fuel octane (our regular fuel is 91 RON/87 AKI; theirs is 95 RON/91 AKI) and maybe an extra pound or two of boost; with a charge cooler and 93 AKI fuel, I can likely get at least 140bhp with no other mods. This guy did: http://www.diyautotune.com/tech_articles/how_to_megasquirt_your_subaru_rx_turbo.htm

Building a stronger bottom end with forged pistons and rods and Delta torque cams should yield close to my target without putting extreme stress on the engine.

 

17PSI/200bhp isn't a make-or-break target, it's simply a target; if I fall short, no big deal. If I notice problems at 200bhp (knock, excessive EGT), I'll detune it to a safe point. If I end up replacing it anyway, I want a turbo that can happily provide 17PSI just in case I need it and my block can handle it. If not, hey, I'll turn it down. Really, that figure is boost at the turbo; I fully expect pressure to drop after it runs through the charge cooler, and am not trying to run more than about 12PSI through the engine. I've done enough searching on here to surmise that they don't like to handle too much.

 

In my searches, however, I've often noticed that either a.) people post these "I'm gonna build an EA82T with all this stuff" threads, and then the threads die for one reason or another (gave up, wrecked it, EJ swap, etc) so it's hard to tell if anything they did was to any benefit; b.) people get an EA82T and then talk about how they're going to deliberately blow it up before swapping in an EJ; or c.) people neglect the hell out of them or crank the boost without any corresponding mods and then complain about how terrible they are because the engine only lasted 10k miles before exploding.

 

To be clear, I love the hell out of the EJ series: they're high-performance and extremely rugged engines. My RSK with its EJ208 was probably the best car I will ever have. That being said, the EA82 is not FHI's best creation, but they're not as bad as most say (certainly better than most contemporary American lumps were), and are capable of decent power with enough support. I'm not planning on trying to best any STis or Mustang 5.0s or M3s or anything; just build a nice, fun, fairly quick car that's very close in form and function to its original specs.

 

So anyway, I answered a few of my mod questions:

 

*turbo line oil cooler: not really a good idea, as was noted previously and so I have read elsewhere. Maybe I can just get a replacement pipe with some fins on it or something to help cool it down, or an oil pump-mounted oil cooler; at any rate I'm not going to worry about it immediately.

 

*turbo coolant line redirect: I had it backwards: the supply is from the head, and the return goes to the thermostat housing, so that's pretty much moot.

 

*MegaSquirt: after hours of reading the manuals, I confirmed that an MS2/Extra will do everything that I want: sequential fuel injection, electronic boost control, wideband O2 sensor, MAP sensor with continuous barometric correction, and hot-switchable fuel/spark/boost tables. Plus I can still go with a distributorless ignition system (either wasted spark or coil-on-plug) should I get tired of the dizzy. The whole MS kit and accessories should cost less than or equal to $1k installed and tuned, which is heaps cheaper than any competing comprehensive engine management solution.

 

As for the engine build, I've decided to go in phases (which should help me build both cars for the price of just one long block):

My RX currently runs fairly well for the most part (at least, it will with a couple new HLAs), so it will be my MS testbed and also the recipient of the first custom A2W charge cooler I order. After I get a solid tune for it, I'll move to my XT.

My XT has, at the very least, a blown head gasket, low compression (~115PSI average, cold), and a cross-threaded spark plug. So, it will be the first block to be torn down and rebuilt with stronger bits. Once it's back in one piece, it will get a similar A2W charge cooler and a MS install configured with my RX's initial tune, which I'll then adjust to tune the XT to its limit.

After I find the limits of my XT's build, I can either accept them or address them in the RX's performance rebuild. Once I've got the new block in, the RX will receive what I shall dub as the penultimate tune, and then I can focus on body work (if I haven't had it done in between engine rebuilds).

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I could easily be wrong but i didnt think the EA's had sequential fuel injection. make sure when researching the megasquirt that you verify that its sequential, or that you properly set it up for sequential. like I said, been years so I dont remember exactly, but you should find out for sure.

 

I think 140-150 hp is a decent target. that is still a 30% increase in horsepower and doing that is a pretty major deal. thats similar to building a 300-400 hp small block chevy. Start with all the basic non internal mods.

 

intercooler and air intake system

fuel system and ignition system

exhaust

 

id still go for an exhaust temp sensor as well, to help monitor whats happening. if your set on running an engine management system, do that as a first step so you can start tracking data and changes.

 

pretty much none of these will hurt the car, just maximize what it can do. you can put a huge turbo on there, but it can only cram in as much as can be spit out the tailpipe. doing these mods may even give you a decent amount of power, but they will make anything you do later actually add its full potential. start there and get a baseline reading to start from.

 

as for motor work, custom ground cams would be the first thing I would try. simply moving the power curve around might give you what you want without stressing the other parts of the motor. if you decide to really go for it, id use N/A pistons for 9.0+ ratio, and run less boost. keep in mind that is a huge jump in compression (turbo was in the 7's if I remember right), which is a main reason some builds dont run high psi.

 

the small VF turbos spin up quick, running something larger might create a bunch of lag. another benefit is a small VF should be pretty cheap, even if you replace it in the end your not out much.

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I had a thought about the ea82t and its pretty simple move the stock turbo or one slightly bigger to the end of the exhaust like a remote mount turbo system

 

It would cut down turbo,boost,and oil temps. And with the turbo at the back you dont really need an intercooler. But there might be a bit more lag..

 

And some random knowledge of mine 83 l6 nissan 280z(iirc) has the same style injector with more flow.

 

THE EA82T i want to see 150hp lol:popcorn:

 

And this might have been a typo but my haynes says the xt6 has the same compression as the ea82t 8.5:1 (i could be wrong)

Edited by AKghandi
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To the OP, I wish you luck. I've always seen all the nay - sayers on here regarding the 82T, and I've even seen all the for sale 82T's with blown headgaskets to boot, but I've always admired them and I want to get my hands on one so bad.

 

I say go for it, and see what happens. 150 out of an ea82T would be pretty nice.:drunk:

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It's not nay-saying when there are obvious consequences for actions. If I tell you slamming your fingers in a door is going to hurt and you call me a nay-sayer and do it anyway, it makes me wonder about your mental condition.

 

Building an EA82t and trying to squeeze power out of it is the financial and emotional equivalent of intentionally crushing your fingers. There's a reason no one else is doing it, and it's not because they aren't pioneers.

 

JWX and WJM especially used to be into the ea82's. WJM passed away recently, but he probably pushed harder to build the best ea82 than anyone else. The story again and again was "the next engine will hold together because we did this to it". His power was 165hp/225tq to all 4 wheels.

 

Then they had the "miracle motor" #5 which held together for a surprising amount of time (80k miles) until a coolant hose blew off and it cooked. Just like every EA before it and a couple after.

 

I have an 86 EA82T that runs great when the ECU works and floods itself to the point of dropping valve rockers out when it goes into failure mode. When I get around to dealing with that car it will come out and be replaced with a real engine. There's no reason to stay with a troublesome and archaic platform when swapping in a much better one is so easy.

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Firstly, subarus are batch fired, but that's ok, mega squirt can so this.

 

Next, I've had mega squirt on an ea82t. Worked well, fun to play with, waste of time.

 

Thirdly, everyone is right. Ea82ts are not good. Total junk. That said I just personally built another one to get some good power. Carb block for higher compression. Legacy turbo. Spider intake and WRX intercooler. Maybe push 12 psi boost through it. Will it last? Through the winter hopefully.:Flame:

 

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i happen to be one of those guys that are dumping around 5k into an ea82t. 1300 of that was all machine work. pistons are a very weak spot. i've blown ring landings on two sets.... here is what i've got in there now.

 

wiseco forged pistons (factory spec)

acl bearings

paeco head studs

oversized ss valves

revtech valve springs

delta regrind cams

 

had the block decked, fully balanced internals, resurfaced the heads and seated the valves. once i get it in and running i'm dropping in evo IIX injectors i think they are(info is somewhere) and not sure what tuning system i am going to use yet. got a twe header & down pipe (brand new!!!) with td04 flanges to run the rex turbo. i'm sitting around the 5k mark right now... and it's not even in the vehicle yet. and i still dont' have my fuel stuff.... so it is expensive. i'm not sure how long it will last but hopefully last to whoop on some rigs. I have no clue what i'm going to end up with for power. but as far as daily driving i'm only going to tune it to run about 9-10 psi to make it last. i've also done the 5 lug swap, 6 puck clutch, fmic, lowered on ground control kit, 88dl trans(shortest gears), 2.25 turbo back exhaust, high flow cat and ebay special can! if it dies, oh well... i'll just build a gc! i've always wanted to build the ea82 but do it with good parts so it didn't just go :pop: right away. i wish you the best of luck. keep it cooled and keep it fueled! oil cooler as noted, i'm moving my turbo further from the head and that will help a lot as well. i'm hoping to have the time to drop the motor in soon!:Flame:

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  • 9 months later...

ive recently aquired a parts car (lifted 86 gl10) with full 3" turbo back ex, wrc ic and a bigger turbo. I personally pulled this car from commission due to a lack of structural integrity. the funny part is this thing beat a boosted 240...in 4 hi. Ive always been on the nay side of this debate, but i have an ea82t that runs lots of boost and hasnt popped. lets re hash the knowledge folks....pics please

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Spending all that time and effort on an Ea82T that will make 140-150 HP and last for 50K miles isnt worth it when a BONE STOCK naturally aspirated EJ22 makes 140 HP and will live for a good 250-300K makes zero sense what so ever.Heck a frankenmotor will make 160-180 HP without the complexity of a turbo.If you must have a turbo get a EJ205 and be done with it.The EA82T was not designed for high power.Nothing in the engine is robust enough to handle the pressure.Say you dump 5 grand into built internals it will still blown up because the block is crap.EA81s and Ea82/Ts have a 1/2" coolant crossover cast into the block.An EJ has a 1 1/2" coolant crossover pipe.While the small crossover is good at 70 HP it starts to fall short at 100 HP.So a EA82T will never run cool at least not without a ton of mods and custom fabrication work,On top of that the block isn't strong enough to sustained power.Just because it HAS a turbo DOES NOT make it a WRX.

 

Look at volvo turbos from the 80's, they have a 2.0 iron block inline 4 and the make something like 150 HP.Getting them to 200+ HP takes alot of work,and volvos are known for having super stout engines.The normal EA82 can't cope with the heat generated (due to that small coolant crossover) and you expect the additional heat and stress from a turbo to somehow make that better?

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