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I'd like to try to make a side by side buggy.

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I'd like to make a side by side buggy out of a Subaru.  I've wanted to do this for a long time and have a few questions, but don't know enough to truly even know what to ask.  I'd appreciate any help you can give me or if you can direct me to a previous forum that would be great.  If I have something to go off of I can usually duplicate it.

 

What kind of donor car should I look for? I'd like to have something that's fuel injected, unless there is a specific reason to not.  For a side by side would I have gearing problems, (too high geared)?  I'm hoping to make it street legal but it would be intended strictly for off roading.  I intend on it being mostly tubed framed. 

 

 

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Don't even attempt to try and build something. Just buy a Subaru GL and take some weight off of it. And read around more. There are some hack jobs out there, but an older member of the board made a rhino, as well. I would search google if i were you. It will net way more information .

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people always call my buggy a side by side drives me nuts[ it's a Subaru people ] anyway get one made want to see it I think the justy running gear's are the lightest

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Don't even attempt to try and build something. Just buy a Subaru GL and take some weight off of it. And read around more. There are some hack jobs out there, but an older member of the board made a rhino, as well. I would search google if i were you. It will net way more information .

 

Sweet82?

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...but the older stuff is physically smaller and weigh less.Not to mention they dont have the EA82.Nuff said.

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I have googled the topic and this has been the best site by far. I will continue to look for the rhino on the forum.

 

I had considered just getting a fair car and lightening it up but haven't seen anything I real like yet. but still looking. I do favor the tube style but don't know if I really want to put that much time in to it that is why I mentioned mostly tubed frame.

 

As far as the Justy about  how much liter would it be? would it have the dualrange? would be quit a benefit. Could I add more engine to it later if needed?

 

The GL would start out with more horse power so this may still a benefit power to weight ratio.

 

As I have said I don't know enough to know what to ask.

 

 

Ivan I love the buggy. But what is not to love.

 

Thanks Rob

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This was my original plan for my $500 Legacy.  I specifically bought it with the 4EAT auto, and feel like that's the way to go for a buggy build. No clutch to burn up, and when you factor in the reduction of the torque convertor you have a lower crawl ratio than a 5spd D/R.  The power of the EJ22 and greater wheel selection in 5x100 bolt pattern are other advantages over an older donor. Weight of the donor car is not an issue in my opinion when you're planning to chop off 75% of it anyway.

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This was my original plan for my $500 Legacy.  I specifically bought it with the 4EAT auto, and feel like that's the way to go for a buggy build. No clutch to burn up, and when you factor in the reduction of the torque convertor you have a lower crawl ratio than a 5spd D/R.  The power of the EJ22 and greater wheel selection in 5x100 bolt pattern are other advantages over an older donor. Weight of the donor car is not an issue in my opinion when you're planning to chop off 75% of it anyway.

1.the 4eat sucks offroad,it doesn't like hills or offcamber offroad.Also it has a an open center diff so if you lift ONE tire you loose drive.The 5spd DR doesn't have problems with hills or offcamber,It doesn't have a center diff so 4wd means that it 50% of the power goes to each end of the car regardless of what the ground is doing.

2.The wheel selection in 5x100 sucks compared to the wheel selection in 6x5.5/140.With 6x140 you might even find wheels with decent offroad rubber already attached to them.

3.The EJ struts limit the max tire size you can run unless you do a strut bottom lift.

 

The best situation is to mix and match parts from various gens of subarus ,its ok they are just giant lego sets.

For example:

EA81(81-84 +hatches +brats) are the smallest physically and the rear suspension flexes great.However, the front suspension doesn flex,the transmission sucks,and the engine is carbed.

EA82(85-94 loyales) have decent front suspension,decent transmissions,and reliable and robust fuel injection systems,but the engine itself is CRAP.

EJ stuff has a good engine and some aftermarket support, and a DR transmission if imported from austrialia.the 4eat is ok offroad as long as you don't climb steep hills, do offcamber stuff,etc.No low range, and open center diff.

 

The best offroader will be a mix of the various gens:

EA81 hatch(smallest car period), EA82 5 speed DR,EA82 front suspension,engine can either be a EA81 pushrod engine with EA82 fuel injection or EJ series.

However, a EA82 body car makes a decent starting platform because it already has most of the components for off road,just needs an engine swap.Not to mention that EA81 vehicles are getting hard to find.However,it is physically bigger than EA81 so it weighs more and and is more likely to incur body damage on trails.A EA82 wagon is like a limo compared to a EA81 hatch.

EJ vehicles dont have any offroad credentials other than rally stardom.They are bigger and heavier than either EA option,the have no low range,they have an open center diff,the the suspension does not flex at either end in stock form but parts exist to fix at least the rear.

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Have you wheeled a car with a 4eat? I have, and an auto is a true advantage, especially for hills. As I said you get equivalent final drive due to the reduction out of the torque convertor as you do with a dual range, and there's no slipping the clutch or taking obstacles at an unsafe speed. The center clutch is easy to defeat, either electronically so you can lock it with the flip of a switch, or permanently with a little welding as I have done.
6 lug mod aside, there are plenty of stock subaru wheels in 15" and 16" sizes, with the proper stock offset, that you can mount the most common A/T and M/T tires to. I was even looking into light tractor and heavy SxS ATV tires that would fit the 14" steelies my Legacy came with. And there are just as many aftermarket options in the 5 lug pattern as well.

I will agree that a strut bottom lift like I did is out of reach for someone without a little engineering skill and a TIG welder, but Outback and Forester struts are dime a dozen. When you get to a set of tires that are too big for the longer struts on a Legacy or Impreza, an EA82 powered car would be gutless pushing tires that big anyway.

 

1.the 4eat sucks offroad,it doesn't like hills or offcamber offroad.Also it has a an open center diff so if you lift ONE tire you loose drive.The 5spd DR doesn't have problems with hills or offcamber,It doesn't have a center diff so 4wd means that it 50% of the power goes to each end of the car regardless of what the ground is doing.

2.The wheel selection in 5x100 sucks compared to the wheel selection in 6x5.5/140.With 6x140 you might even find wheels with decent offroad rubber already attached to them.

3.The EJ struts limit the max tire size you can run unless you do a strut bottom lift.

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I have found the look of what I want. There are two and they were built by the same guy so I think. He is on this sight. they are the Hondaroo and the Buggyroo.

 

I am thinking of chopping the soob in two stages and seeing if I can finish it in the style of the Buggyroo.

 

So now I need to figure out what donor to start with and to hopefully find. It seems that the majority thinks it should be a car with a ea82 with a dualrange tranny in it. Dose any one see a down side to this and what cars can I find this combination in? Im also on the fence whether to go automatic or Manual. It would be used as a mountain machine and rarely or never in the dunes.

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1.the 4eat sucks offroad,it doesn't like hills or offcamber offroad.Also it has a an open center diff so if you lift ONE tire you loose drive.The 5spd DR doesn't have problems with hills or offcamber,It doesn't have a center diff so 4wd means that it 50% of the power goes to each end of the car regardless of what the ground is doing.

 

The 4eat is not an Open center diff.  In fact...it doesn't have a center diff.  It has a Multiplate, Hydraulic, transfer clutch setup....which when working properly, is capable of full 50/50 locked transfer, just like a true 4wd.  This makes it superior to a 5spd single range....and comprable to a 5spd Dual Range.

 

It is the EJ 5spd "AWD" that has an open diff, fitted with a limited slip Viscous Coupler(4kg)......which do kinda suck for real offroading (unless fitted with 20kg VLSD pack)

 

Biggest drawback to 4eat is that when it goes.....it's gone.......but that is true of a Clutch on a 5spd too.....so pick your weak link and watch it.  That and the weight.  4eat weighs over 300 lbs vs. around 150 lbs for 5spd.

 

Definately get a trans cooler.

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5 speed DR weigh 150 lbs?Holy carp.I thought they only weighed like 75 or so.I feel strong :)

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I have found the look of what I want. There are two and they were built by the same guy so I think. He is on this sight. they are the Hondaroo and the Buggyroo.

 

I am thinking of chopping the soob in two stages and seeing if I can finish it in the style of the Buggyroo.

 

So now I need to figure out what donor to start with and to hopefully find. It seems that the majority thinks it should be a car with a ea82 with a dualrange tranny in it. Dose any one see a down side to this and what cars can I find this combination in? Im also on the fence whether to go automatic or Manual. It would be used as a mountain machine and rarely or never in the dunes.

 

 

The less something weighs the better.Also when they get lighter the loss of gearing isnt as bad of issue.I drove an ea81 based buggy with 31" tires and it got around pretty good.By comparison 31" tires on a full bodied EA81 or even EA82 is a gutless wonder.

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After some thought it needs to end up a buggy. Two seater probably it may have to be a four to take the kids.

 

I do like the smaller vehicles so the Justy would be a great donor. I don't want to mix and match at least for now. So I am nervous that the engine would be a little small.  so I will more than likely go with a little larger car.

 

I have only owned one automatic in my 30 plus years of driving and it gave me trouble. There for I have true concerns about an automatic but I think I will go with one. if I do I will more than likely rebuild it and then it should out last me.

 

With the things that you all have said I think I will start looking for something with the ea82 fuel injected. With dualrange in it with that in mind what year and body style do I need to look for. And can I get a plush ride in a buggy?

 

 Ivan and other buggy owners  do you have any photos of your buggy build I may study.

 

Thank you all Rob.

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Being that you're in SLC, just what kind of cars do you have to pick from?   When I lived there in 93, I almost never saw any Subarus from the 80s, what was there must be pretty rusty by now.   Do you have the means to source a car from out of state that might be in better condition?

 

This was the only car I could find near you older than 1990 thru craigslist.   http://saltlakecity.craigslist.org/cto/4666791284.html

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Craig's list Is not very big in slc. Ksl is the way to go and I was able to find 4 soobs 90 and older. This point having been made are you saying that the dule range is not available after 90?  

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Craig's list Is not very big in slc. Ksl is the way to go and I was able to find 4 soobs 90 and older. This point having been made are you saying that the dule range is not available after 90?  

 

correct.

 

last year for dual range was the 89 GL

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I am beginning to see the uphill battle on getting a useable car. at least with a duel range. I have spent my day off and been reading the forum and came across sweet82's Rhino stocker posts no pictures. reading other peoples posts and looking at there pictures of there stocker I hope to get the blue prints for this build. I have emailed sweet82 in hopes of some input and hopefully obtaining some picks to see if this would be what I want to try to under take.

 

Any input is highly appreciated. Rob

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I am beginning to see the uphill battle on getting a useable car. at least with a duel range. I have spent my day off and been reading the forum and came across sweet82's Rhino stocker posts no pictures. reading other peoples posts and looking at there pictures of there stocker I hope to get the blue prints for this build. I have emailed sweet82 in hopes of some input and hopefully obtaining some picks to see if this would be what I want to try to under take.

 

Any input is highly appreciated. Rob

 

Might be able to find him

 

I believe he lives near Salt Lake.

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After searching the craigslists all around SLC I see what you mean about finding DR cars.You may need to come all the way up to washington to get a DR car,either that or buy a single range car and buy a DR transmission from somewhere.

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