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FerGloyale

03 outback rear suspension on EA81 - T-bone 2.0

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Transmission carnage pics.  I had hoped it was the reverse idler that stripped....no such luck, it was the teeth on the upper shaft that broke.

48123278293_2536f25846_k.jpgIMG_3790 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48123346062_342576d9ea_k.jpgIMG_3789 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48123277018_a6b098d92f_k.jpgIMG_3791 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

So thankfully I've got a spare upper shaft sitting here in a box.....I think the unit it was in blew the pinion shaft behind an EJ25.  I pulled the D/R gearset to sell a board member in Alabama a while back.  Saved the rest of the shaft/gearset just for an occasion like this.

48123342057_8464546e8b_k.jpgIMG_3792 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

I did have to swap the D/R gears from my current broken trans, onto the new shaft.  No pics of that.  It's just a big C-clip.  There is a tiny ball that located the spacer, but it's all obvious and easy if anyone needs to do this repair themselves, don't be daunted.

48123273858_388cd19987_k.jpgIMG_3793 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

 

I will put up more pics of the reverse mod when I get to it.

For now, here's part #'s for all the D/R 5 spd seals.

 

Front outputs :  8067 30031/30032    Right and Left respectively.

Rear output seal:  8067 35070

D/R shifter seal :  8067 15020

4wd selector shaft seal, rear : 33194 AA001 (superseded from AA010)

4wd selector shaft seal, front: 33193 AA000

gear Selector shaft seal : 8067 18100 (superseded from 18040)

extension case gasket :  44225 7000 

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Pics of the reverse spacer/blocker.  

Started with a 3/4 brass nut from hardware store, it was also about 3/4 " thick to start.  

48133705738_edef71555a_k.jpgIMG_3799 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Cut it nearly in half, after drilling out the center to 13/16 inch to fit revere idler shaft.

48133671476_efd6b22891_k.jpgIMG_3800 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr 

Then sanded cut face until it measured .235"  

48133668511_80f0a906de_k.jpgIMG_3801 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Here it is mock up installed on the reverse idler shaft.  This is where it will ride when not in reverse. 

48133693818_20ab574ed1_k.jpgIMG_3804 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

And when reverse engaged

48133695833_6df2729325_k.jpgIMG_3803 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

 

And more carnage pics.  Good thing the reverse failed, because upon dismantling transmission, I found this.  Ring gear bolts backing out

48133709153_aa585c4e4b_k.jpgIMG_3797 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Inside the case  

48133679246_bae8e17861_k.jpgIMG_3796 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Took the whole carrier to the vice, unbolted and cleaned the crap out of the ring gear bolt holes and bolts.  Reinstalled to factory torque value (49 ft/lbs) with generous amount of red loctite on all bolts.  Sorry no pics.

It's coming together........Seals should be in at dealership (Corvallis Subaru, formerly John + Phils ) this afternoon.

 

Edited by FerGloyale

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I would make sure when you assemble it that the reverse idler gear still slides a little past the other reverse gears.  Not as far as stock but if not it will want to push out of reverse under load.

 

If you keep having that problem with the ring gear bolts you should either safety wire them or make some two hole tabs out of thin sheet metal.  Torque the bolts down and then bend the ends of the tabs around the bolt flats to keep them from coming loose.

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1 hour ago, pontoontodd said:

make some two hole tabs out of thin sheet metal.  Torque the bolts down and then bend the ends of the tabs around the bolt flats to keep them from coming loose.

 

I thought the front ring gears had that already....

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10 minutes ago, Numbchux said:

 

I thought the front ring gears had that already....

His doesn't, my dual range doesn't, I haven't had many other 5MTs apart.

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5 hours ago, pontoontodd said:

I would make sure when you assemble it that the reverse idler gear still slides a little past the other reverse gears.  Not as far as stock but if not it will want to push out of reverse under load.

 

If you keep having that problem with the ring gear bolts you should either safety wire them or make some two hole tabs out of thin sheet metal.  Torque the bolts down and then bend the ends of the tabs around the bolt flats to keep them from coming loose.

The spacer let's the reverse idler selector shaft to slide fully to the detent, but takes up the slack in the tab that actually moves the idler gear.  I don't mind holding the shifter If I have to, but I think it should be good.

I have seen the safety tabs on 4EAT ring gears, and I think in some rear diffs.  But this EA82 D/R doesn't have them.  Proper torque and Loctite should work.  This trans has 200k+ miles already and the last 20k have been behind the EJ22 doing spoob like this.  

Inevitably I will 4.44 4EAT, or T-case this thing.  So it's good enough for now.

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24 minutes ago, FerGloyale said:

The spacer let's the reverse idler selector shaft to slide fully to the detent, but takes up the slack in the tab that actually moves the idler gear.  I don't mind holding the shifter If I have to, but I think it should be good.

 

That's what I thought but the teeth on mine started twisting/bending and then you can't hold it in reverse under load.  Maybe you'll have better luck than I did.

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4 minutes ago, pontoontodd said:

That's what I thought but the teeth on mine started twisting/bending and then you can't hold it in reverse under load.  Maybe you'll have better luck than I did.

I'll take a pic after shafts installed.

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Awesome effort FerGloyale! 

As for the front diff, no safety retainer clips etc on the L series 5 speed box or any of the EJ boxes I’ve played with. 

That bent shaft is impressive! Sure it wasn’t smashed on a rock (although I think the Gen3 rear end has a lower control arm to bend first). Any vibration experienced? 

And that rear shaft removal trick, you’re swapping the rear axle with the shaft through the rear swing arm hub mount hole, have I got that correct? If so that’s an awesome find, I would not have thought of doing that for a shaft replacement on the Gen3! 

Cheers 

Bennie

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15 hours ago, pontoontodd said:

His doesn't, my dual range doesn't, I haven't had many other 5MTs apart.

Huh, I must be confusing them. I've messed with so many different diffs/transmissions over the years. Maybe it was the front diff in my 4Runner I'm thinking of.....

 

 

Carry on :P

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3 hours ago, el_freddo said:

Awesome effort FerGloyale! 

As for the front diff, no safety retainer clips etc on the L series 5 speed box or any of the EJ boxes I’ve played with. 

That bent shaft is impressive! Sure it wasn’t smashed on a rock (although I think the Gen3 rear end has a lower control arm to bend first). Any vibration experienced? 

And that rear shaft removal trick, you’re swapping the rear axle with the shaft through the rear swing arm hub mount hole, have I got that correct? If so that’s an awesome find, I would not have thought of doing that for a shaft replacement on the Gen3! 

Cheers 

Bennie

 

Yes you've got it straight about pulling the shaft, with bearing attached, straight through the trailing arm hole.  The CV boot just barely slips through with factory axles.  It's the way you have to do it when the splines are seized up in the bearings, which seems to happen frequently.

I suppose aftermarkets with larger CV cup this would not work.  But with factory, makes for easy swap out.  I'm going to get about a dozen spares from the wreckers........Pull them this way and you get the bearing and CV for just the price of the CV axle.  Don't even need to remove E-brakes, just pull the ABS sensor (12mm bolt on top) or it's tip will be broken.

As for the bent shafts.........Both the one that snapped, and the one that didn't had the same, long arcing bow.  Neither had scrapes or marks from hitting rocks.  It was a pretty dry day, and I can see tell tale bash marks on places like the trailing arm brackets, and rear diff mount clearly, but there are no marks like that on either axle.  I really think the bend is from 250 miles of street driving with brand new, sticky, 31" mud tires on the welded rear end.

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17 hours ago, el_freddo said:

 

That bent shaft is impressive! Sure it wasn’t smashed on a rock (although I think the Gen3 rear end has a lower control arm to bend first). Any vibration experienced? 

 

 

Yeah the front and rear arms hang down alot further than axles.  

Here's proof.  

48111011693_f95932a821_k.jpgIMG_3779 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

These will be changed to heavy wall tube arms soon.  Or not, maybe I'll just carry cheap, light and easy junk yard spares!

Here is the bent axle before removal, there isn't a bash mark on it.  You can also see from this angle, the axle sits higher than the suspension mounts and arms, and will travel further up "in" to the space between them on compression, so only a, thin, tall, odd rock could reach it.

48110968536_97b9dfccd0_k.jpgIMG_3780 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48110967721_ff4b46642e_k.jpgIMG_3781 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Edited by FerGloyale
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Hi-jacking my own thread here.

Finally got back to the XT6 project car I've been stalled on.

48162038327_68ace18fc8_k.jpgIMG_3815 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Took advantage of a nice day to to fire it and drive it up into the shade for the rear diff swap.

48162071587_4eaa23c6e8_k.jpgIMG_3817 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

The car started obviously with the ER27 6cyl.  But I've replaced that with a fully rebuild from the crank out EJ251.  I also used the matching 4.44 auto trans from the donor 01 Outback the EJ came from.  Air suspension delete using Legacy front struts and XT4 rear shocks and springs.  Cybrid electric steering replaced with conventional EJ25 steering pump.

But I've been driving it around the yard in FWD, because I had not swapped in a 4.44 rear diff.

So here it is.  Had to swap the spider gears into the 4.44 diff, as that ratio never came with external bolt in stubs.  Sorry no pics of the spider swap just filling hte diff and stamped 4.44 on the cover.

48161992986_27270724c3_k.jpgIMG_3818 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48162061627_b91f1ceede_k.jpgIMG_3819 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Terrible picture of the dropped 3.7 stock diff.

48161982601_fa700dedab_k.jpgIMG_3821 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

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Hi-jacking my own thread again.

Spent the day yesterday with what began as a brake pad swap, but turned into this.  Sorry for bad pic

48177278511_fd028fd487_k.jpgIMG_3825 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

I had been wanting and gather parts for this little endeavor for quite a while.  Lateral links swap, and spacer lift for the top of the struts.  I had also been toying with the concept of a "rear end tuck"  by using Standard legacy cradle in place of Forester.

48177276831_c83dc05c1f_k.jpgIMG_3826 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48177274756_d136dbc9c5_k.jpgIMG_3827 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

2 out of 3 goals accomplished.  And for the third, the cradle swap, I discovered good info.  I had thought like Leg Vs. Outback that there was a difference in the cradle height between Legacy and Forester.  In Outbacks, there is a spacer, I had thought that spacers worth of height would be built into the Forester cradle.  But Forester body must be built different and uses a nice, tucked up cradle no spacer, no extra height.  Sadly, there is not in terms of height or much else. Diff rear bolts on both cradles are exactly 4-3/4" below the mounting point on the unibody rails.  So there was no good cause to swap the cradles.  I went ahead and just swapped the lateral arms.  Since I had deleted the rear swaybar, the brackets on the Forester links were just hanging down for nothing.  The rear 1st gen Legacy links are stronger and don't have anything hanging down.  The front links from the legacy are also stronger than he stamped steel forward arm from the forester.

Pics are Legacy cradle at bottom, Forester cradle at top.  Painted black arms are 1st Gen Legacy in position comparing to the Forester counterparts.

48177271636_2706fe4318_k.jpgIMG_3828 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

And here is the final result, after the "brake Job" was done.  1" Front lift spacer, 1-1/2" Rear spacer.

48177263556_d205a08dae_k.jpgIMG_3830 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48177267426_ba4889e281_k.jpgIMG_3829 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

 

 

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And now back to the main event.

5 lug knuckles, with Impreza brake rotors + brackets, swapped for EA slider upper slide pins.  New Balljoints.

AND the big reveal........Modified 2011 Outback front struts fitted with 03 Outback rear springs!  

The '11 fronts and the '03 outback rear shocks have the same travel, and distance from spring perch to top, so the springs  should be just the right length,  And the rump roast of the 03 is pretty heavy, should hold my little EJ22'd EA body pretty well.

48206055511_10ef4fcea9_k.jpgIMG_3833 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Close up of the spring perch clearance. It only works with the knuckles tipped all the way "out" on the camber bolts.  Should be fine though as it's going on an EA81 body.  In fact I may need to slot the mounting tabs to tip the wheel out away from the strut even more if there is too much negative camber.  Either that or build adjustment into the new front lift blocks for the tophats.  

48206037431_d3c96084c2_k.jpgIMG_3838 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48206049796_7d615dd4d3_k.jpgIMG_3834 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

If these springs don't handle the weight of being in front, I can at least now use narrower springs, there are options for 4 runners that should fit nicely.  But I am hopeful these outback springs will be just about right.  I don't want the front too stiff.

48206092762_4bf088231c_k.jpgIMG_3837 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Nextup, Lengthen and beefup XT6 front control arms!

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Just had to share the ridiculousness of the day.

Making a cardboard mock up of the control arm mods to visualize where/how to cut/weld/extend the XT6 arms.

Didn't intend to make anything so funny or dirty, but once it happened, my wife and I could not stop laughing for the rest of the night.  I spit out beer twice laughing so hard.

48215511681_4b6c1ff007_k.jpgIMG_3854 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

You're welcome.

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S'more pics of the modified control arms.

48219012507_5a6cb05f23_k.jpgIMG_3856 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48219009217_a759c545d1_k.jpgIMG_3857 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48218954836_fbf61fd9e2_k.jpgIMG_3859 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48219002147_f5b64515ed_k.jpgIMG_3860 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48219018736_40773fc6d4_k.jpgIMG_3863 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48219051992_d04a6955e6_k.jpgIMG_3870 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48219007246_b109347feb_k.jpgIMG_3868 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Making the brackets for the second shock mount.

48219065947_835ab8a049_k.jpgIMG_3864 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48219011706_71ea279cdb_k.jpgIMG_3866 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48219009526_801a44db9d_k.jpgIMG_3867 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48219009526_801a44db9d_k.jpgIMG_3867 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

There is still trimming the edges and grinding, smoothing out.

48219005011_9d41b63410_k.jpgIMG_3869 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Here is a side by side of an old factory length EA82 arm, with my old second shock bracket on it.  Note on the new, longer arm, that the shock mount is moved further forward so the axle doesn't hit the shock.  I almost forgot and put it were the old one was, which I think wouldn't work with the balljoint/axle pushed forward.

48219000251_2e296f1f42_k.jpgIMG_3871 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48219046867_bcad2544f7_k.jpgIMG_3872 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48219043452_c8da5ca2b2_k.jpgIMG_3873 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

48218992556_6f26d0cc9c_k.jpgIMG_3874 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

I need to get a new tank of Oxygen and Acetylene for my torch.   I want to heat and bend before welding around the back side.  

Also need to plate and weld the bottoms of the shock area with a slider.  Neat that it worked out the drop pieces from the square tube center reinforcement, made perfect braces for the lower shock mount and the coming plate. 

48218991101_ab3df0a648_k.jpgIMG_3875 by Dans Subaru, on Flickr

Edited by FerGloyale

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Great custom work there man. And how you figuring out like on custom shocks how you know what would be good lenght and travel and how much it would go down and up and that springs will be enough. I so envy that freedom to just do what you want try things and test later.

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