Crossthread Ed Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 I have 1987 GL 5 speed manual wagon I want to be able to tow behind my 35' Motorhome. I want to be able to attach bumper mounts to receive the feet of the tow bar. Has anyone done this? I read on a 2014 FMCA reply that the camber is wrong on these old gen Subies and that does not allow the steering to return to center after a turn. This guy stated it was a well known issue back in the day.... Any input on this ? His solution was to install eye bolts in the floor on each side of the steering wheel, attach heavy duty rubber bungies thus assisting the return to center. He was then going to fiddle with the caster to see if he could correct the issue. There was no following update. I just scored a Road master 5000 tow bar the foot receivers are set up for a Chev Cruz Toad. It's 5K rated overkill for but a good deal. Thanks Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FerGloyale Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 I towed an 84 gl sedan, with no engine, behind my Forester using a tow bar. No problems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skishop69 Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 (edited) I can confirm that the steering will not always return. If you make a 90 degree turn or sharper, the wheels will stay. I tow my Brat behind my camper when we go camping and I leave the steering wheel locked. This is also not ideal, but after having to fight the other issue, it's how I went. It does add extra wear on the control arm bushings, ball joints and tires, but as little as I do this, it's not a big deal. I only have 4 turns from my house to the freeway and once there, it's all smooth turns. I check the front end every time and my alignment is dead on which it has to be or it will fight the tow bar in a straight line. Edited June 13, 2019 by skishop69 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
czny Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 Buy or rent a two wheel tow dolly. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKWIKwgSk1U Used ones from U-Haul, etc may still be serviceable after a little maintenance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparkyboy Posted June 13, 2019 Share Posted June 13, 2019 (edited) The L body subarus have a reputation for goofy camber because it's very easy to get a 2" "lift" you can just about do it with a stack of washers on the strut towers and pieces of wood between the body and subframe. That causes a cambered out duck toe look. I knew a guy years ago that pulled a factory ride height loyale behind an rv with a v bar and he had no complaints. I'll say this, my 86 gl has a "chintzy" 2" homemade lift with hardware store brackets and I have no problems, steering wise. Mine is also power steering delete, but I have no problems with the front wheels returning to center. I'm fact under heavy throttle it whips back too quickly if I am careless with my grip unless one of my tires loses traction. Open diff up front you see! Isn't the wheels not returning to center during towing a common problem on awd cars only? Now those are a pita to tow behind, you have to disconnect the driveshaft, or connect the stupid battery to your rv alternator to put the 2wd fuse in if equipped, but that will wear out duty solenoid c? I digress... Yea, keep it old school, Happy travels! @Crossthread Ed I love the handle, is there a story behind it? Edited June 13, 2019 by sparkyboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossthread Ed Posted June 14, 2019 Author Share Posted June 14, 2019 Thanks for the speedy replies Everyone. Good start of a thread regarding Old Gen Tow Bar issues and Optuons.This confirms this issue. Seems the tow bar option is a PITA. I would need to also do some front tow bar to Suby bumper / bracket fabricating while trying to maintain the stock bumper and skin appearance. What have you guys done? I have been on the fence regarding Tow bar VS Car Dolly. I have a Vstar 1100 that I would like to also travel with and would need to put a front deck across the front of the dolly. Storage of the dolly is the issue VS Tow bar. sparkyboy, the handle is from my Dad when I was 14yo.He had a 56 VW bug project in the backyard I decided I would help out on while he was at work. I forced some bolts into the 36 HP block..... and the rest is history ! He schooled me well afterwards. LOL Thanks All 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferp420 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 i flat towed the hay out of my loyale with no issues the steering always returned to center without issues i have thousands of miles with my toad i tow from the the factory tie down not from the bumper i have a cheap tow bar with modified brackets to fit the tie down points the same set up works on the imp also with out issue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossthread Ed Posted June 19, 2019 Author Share Posted June 19, 2019 Thanks for the speedy replies Everyone. Good start of a thread regarding Old Gen Tow Bar issues and Optuons.This confirms this issue. Seems the tow bar option is a PITA. I would need to also do some front tow bar to Suby bumper / bracket fabricating while trying to maintain the stock bumper and skin appearance. What have you guys done? I have been on the fence regarding Tow bar VS Car Dolly. I have a Vstar 1100 that I would like to also travel with and would need to put a front deck across the front of the dolly. Storage of the dolly is the issue VS Tow bar. sparkyboy, the handle is from my Dad when I was 14yo.He had a 56 VW bug project in the backyard I decided I would help out on while he was at work. I forced some bolts into the 36 HP block..... and the rest is history ! He schooled me well afterwards. LOL Thanks All Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FerGloyale Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 (edited) 11 hours ago, ferp420 said: i flat towed the hay out of my loyale with no issues the steering always returned to center without issues i have thousands of miles with my toad i tow from the the factory tie down not from the bumper i have a cheap tow bar with modified brackets to fit the tie down points the same set up works on the imp also with out issue my experience too. Although I built a custom bumper. Stock beam is easily replaced/beefed up by adding a piece of 3" channel. Bolted towbar to that. Skin could be added back on, although I chose not to for my needs. Edited June 19, 2019 by FerGloyale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hanover Fist Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 On 6/13/2019 at 2:54 PM, sparkyboy said: you have to disconnect the driveshaft, or connect the stupid battery to your rv alternator to put the 2wd fuse in if equipped, but that will wear out duty solenoid c? I digress... Never heard of this. Nor did I think to try that. Is this a safe hack? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sparkyboy Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 (edited) ^^ This would be for automatic awd models only. There is a fuse under the hood to put the car in 2wd only so you can use it to tow a small trailer, or to flat tow the car in an emergency. Key must be in on hence the quickie 14.1v coming from the tow car. For a manual trans the only option to be flat towed without damaging the drivetrain is to remove the driveshaft from the rear diff, but leave the center support in place so the fluid doesn't spill all over. @Hanover Fist you don't have to worry about any of that cause your sube is 4wd=cool. my rv (1978 g30) is wired to charge the deep cycle battery for the 110v converter while the engine is running, I would assume this is common? I only know about duty solenoid c because when I was young and ignorant, new to subarus basically the driveshaft in my mom's beater 99 obw was failing so I drove her for a long time in 2wd. That issue was how I discovered this lovely forum, I promptly replaced the front half of the driveshaft for a $30 junkyard piece...my first independent subaru repair 5 years ago! Duty solenoid c can cause all kinds of awd related havoc if it fails and it requires digging into the trans to fix so I got lucky on that one! Food for thought on the subject of yanking subarus around I guess...if it were me and the v bar gave me problems, a two wheel dolly would be my route, that way the miles on the odometer aren't artificially jacked up! Cheers boys, Happy towing! Go somewhere like CA and enjoy the odd looks. 80s roos are a rare sight there! Edited June 19, 2019 by sparkyboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FerGloyale Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 6 hours ago, sparkyboy said: 6 hours ago, sparkyboy said: For a manual trans the only option to be flat towed without damaging the drivetrain is to remove the driveshaft from the rear diff, but leave the center support in place so the fluid doesn't spill all over. Driveline removal is only for Dolly towing where front is off the ground. Totally unnecessary any MT Subaru can be flat towed. Flat towing hte rear driveline will just get dragged behind like it always does, all the gears inside the trans spin together, but leave it in 2wd rather than selectable 4wd. Newer AWD, MT trans also can flat tow, center diff does it's job just rolling along. Technically you could even dolly a selectable 4wd with driveline in place, you would be trusting the selector lever to stay in 2wd, and also only the rear output would spin, and it doesn't get lubed unless the main shaft and pinion shaft spin, so not good for any distance more than a few miles. 6 hours ago, sparkyboy said: 6 hours ago, sparkyboy said: ^^ This would be for automatic awd models only. There is a fuse under the hood to put the car in 2wd only so you can use it to tow a small trailer, or to flat tow the car in an emergency. Key must be in on hence the quickie 14.1v coming from the tow car. This doesn't work. Without the engine running, there is no fluid pressure so the Duty c does nothing key on or off, fuse in or out. it can't regulate pressure that isn't there. They can be flat towed also just fine. all 4 wheels rolling together in "N" is fine. Again, removing driveline or disconnecting somehow the rear end is only for DOLLY towing where front wheels off the ground and stationary, and rear is rolling. That is a big no no for AT, no matter what you do, becasue there is no fluid to lube hte plates as the front pinion sit's still, and the back output turns, the stack of plates will overheat and burn up very quickly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossthread Ed Posted June 21, 2019 Author Share Posted June 21, 2019 On 6/18/2019 at 7:53 PM, FerGloyale said: my experience too. Although I built a custom bumper. Stock beam is easily replaced/beefed up by adding a piece of 3" channel. Bolted towbar to that. Skin could be added back on, although I chose not to for my needs. Like your 3" channel option. Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossthread Ed Posted June 21, 2019 Author Share Posted June 21, 2019 On 6/18/2019 at 8:09 AM, ferp420 said: i flat towed the hay out of my loyale with no issues the steering always returned to center without issues i have thousands of miles with my toad i tow from the the factory tie down not from the bumper i have a cheap tow bar with modified brackets to fit the tie down points the same set up works on the imp also with out issue How did you use the front tow eyes? Sounds like a great Mcgyver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferp420 Posted June 22, 2019 Share Posted June 22, 2019 i have u shaped brackets that bolt to the tow bar and then to the tow hooks on the car very simple i can tow from the bumper too but always use the tie down points 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crossthread Ed Posted June 29, 2019 Author Share Posted June 29, 2019 On 6/21/2019 at 6:22 PM, ferp420 said: i have u shaped brackets that bolt to the tow bar and then to the tow hooks on the car very simple i can tow from the bumper too but always use the tie down points Could you please take a pic and post it? I attempted to attach a pic but it was larger than the 2MB limitations.... I'm trying to visualize the u shaped brackets tow bar to the car tow hooks/ eyes. This seems more practical and alot less hassle than removal /disassembly of my front bumper beam and skin in order to do the 3" channel mount and modification of the skin. Thanks Ed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferp420 Posted July 4, 2019 Share Posted July 4, 2019 On 6/29/2019 at 9:01 AM, Crossthread Ed said: Could you please take a pic and post it? I attempted to attach a pic but it was larger than the 2MB limitations.... I'm trying to visualize the u shaped brackets tow bar to the car tow hooks/ eyes. This seems more practical and alot less hassle than removal /disassembly of my front bumper beam and skin in order to do the 3" channel mount and modification of the skin. Thanks Ed ill get those pics asap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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