turbodog Posted March 1, 2021 Share Posted March 1, 2021 since I'm going way over budget anyways, and I figured if I'm spending this much, I may as well do everything I can to make it actually last. I've known about this sort of thing in the past and at the time it was thousands of dollars to get it done, now it seems I can do an ea82 for under $500. and one of the biggest banes of the ea82 head is the exhaust route threw the port travels so far and makes so much heat. If the ports get a good plasma coating there would be almost no heat getting transferred into the head, there's also something about being able to build up areas where there could be cracks! hint hint, lol. heres an interesting article if anyone wants to look into this as well, id love to hear some thoughts on it, and if anyone on here has had experience! https://dsportmag.com/the-tech/education/quick-tech-thermal-barrier-coatings-for-more-power/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferp420 Posted March 2, 2021 Share Posted March 2, 2021 its just another ceramic coating these guys spray the ceramic coating on while its hot instead of spraying it on cold and heating it up to cure it sounds gimicy to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbodog Posted March 2, 2021 Author Share Posted March 2, 2021 5 hours ago, ferp420 said: its just another ceramic coating these guys spray the ceramic coating on while its hot instead of spraying it on cold and heating it up to cure it sounds gimicy to me its quite different though. the cold on bake cured method is still basically paint, and getting it hot can ruin it, also it cannot handle paint solvents. plasma coating is more down to a molecular level of attachment to the metal, it wont come off, and its resistant to heat and solvents, I've seen it done, where after a dyno pull you can literally touch the exhaust and it would be cool to the touch (with both sides coated) its incredible, cost was the only big reason not to in the past Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carfreak85 Posted March 3, 2021 Share Posted March 3, 2021 That D-Sport article is suspect. They show fancy looking graphics and charts, with no attribution or explaining how they got the numbers presented. This leads me to believe (using my journalism background) that all they did was interview a TBC company, borrowed some "data" from those companies, and published the article. In fact, a quick scan of the article shows mention of SwainTech Coatings. Now, to be fair, SwainTech is THE BEST company you can find for this sort of thing, anyone else is just a pretender. The uppipe on my WRX has their White Lightening coating and while I'm sure it helps (I never did any pre/post testing) I would NEVER touch that pipe when hot. These coatings are thin, and even the best TBC isn't magical. You can't cheat the laws of physics, and (using my vehicle design engineer background) there is little chance that SwainTech's coating will prevent an EA82T cylinder head from cracking under extreme use. The root of the problem is the design of the heads, hence why FHI revised the casting twice during production. I have seen White Lightening pill, bubble, and flake, but at a MUCH slower rate than other ceramic coatings. I had my COBB Inconel uppipe coated in 2012, and it's not flaking yet, but has pilled where I had a minor coolant leak drip onto the pipe. Best/cheapest way to up the output is a big intercooler, a mint cooling system, and to crank up the boost. Anything beyond that (custom pistons/rods, head porting, etc.) gets expensive quickly. There's a reason these engines aren't plentiful these days, and it's because they weren't particularly reliable, even when new... OK, all that said, it's your money and your car. I'd love to see someone push the limits with an EA82T, just be aware that with such a compromised cylinder head design and such a low specific output, you will quickly reach the point of diminishing returns in terms of output and reliability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted March 3, 2021 Share Posted March 3, 2021 (edited) As carfreak explained - it's just not going to magically stop the heat from getting into the heads. Especially under sustained boost. It *might* show a gain in the delta time before saturation, but it's not going to affect the ultimate temperature. That's going to be down to combustion temps. If you want it to last, run it on E85. With the LINK you now have the ability to do that safely. You simply need the Ethanol content sensor and you can do a full flex fuel tune. E85 runs cooler, and is essentially impossible to cause damaging detonation. And if you REALLY want to ensure it never gets hot - run Meth injection or just tune it on straight Methanol. I've seen 1000 HP Methanol cars that you could touch the cylinder head after a full power dyno pull. GD Edited March 3, 2021 by GeneralDisorder 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbodog Posted March 4, 2021 Author Share Posted March 4, 2021 7 hours ago, carfreak85 said: That D-Sport article is suspect its just kind of an overview ish of the idea. ive been doing much more research into it, its the only reason im bringing it up... and like i said, im already well past the cost to return rate... 4 hours ago, GeneralDisorder said: If you want it to last, run it on E85. With the LINK you now have the ability to do that safely. You simply need the Ethanol content sensor and you can do a full flex fuel tune. E85 runs cooler, and is essentially impossible to cause damaging detonation. yeah, thats looking like a good idea too... though im not really looking for ultimate power like everyone keeps assuming, im looking for the MOST power on 8 psi, not whatever i can get on 20 psi or whatever, lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carfreak85 Posted March 4, 2021 Share Posted March 4, 2021 (edited) Running on E85 is a great idea that would not only cut cylinder temps (reliability +) but with the appropriate injectors and pump, you could make more power without much work outside of tuning. Only downside is availabilty, tuning for lower than 85% E, and the slight dip in fuel economy vs. gasoline, but a worthy trade IMHO. That said, the easiest and cheapest way to make power on a turbocharged engine is with boost. While staying at 8 psi and upgrading everything else to find gains is noble, it's the wrong way to start eating an elephant. Edited March 4, 2021 by carfreak85 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbodog Posted March 5, 2021 Author Share Posted March 5, 2021 21 hours ago, carfreak85 said: While staying at 8 psi and upgrading everything else if i dont give myself some sort of cap to the madness i dont think the engine would last at all, lol. im not really on a big power binge these days, ive kinda gotten a lead foot in the worst way, more power just means i go faster.... and i cant afford more tickets at the moment (insurance is already over $500/mo) so, less max power good, lol. i had to get rid of my superbike cause i cruised that at over 140 everywhere... my legacy gt... i cruise that at 110..., i feel like if i ej'd my L series then i would likely cruise over 120... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeneralDisorder Posted March 6, 2021 Share Posted March 6, 2021 With the LINK you can do a full on flex fuel tune the can accommodate for any percentage of Ethanol automatically. I would keep it extremely conservative on the pump gas side and make all the power on E. That's our usual methodology. GD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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