nelstomlinson Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 I'm finally getting around to installing the new short block I got for my '02 Legacy, and I just realized that the short block did NOT come with the necessary gaskets.Rock Auto has ITM and Enginteck kits for ~$90, and AJUSA for ~$250. Are any of those likely to be adequate? What's a good source for good stuff? Ideally I'd like to get head gaskets that will last. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forester2002s Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 Can't help with gasket kits. But I highly recommend that you get the MLS (Multi Layer Steel) Head Gasket, Subaru #11044AA642. It'll last for ever... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daskuppler Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 I would get OEM. I installed the FelPro MLS on my 02 251 about 60k ago and have had no problems, but FelPro supposedly has some issues with Japanese vehicles. I also used FelPro intake, exhaust, and valve cover gaskets. The valve cover gaskets failed, everything else has been solid. Go OEM for the water pump gasket, tubing belt, tensioner, and idler pulleys. I just did the timing kit, it ran me about $500 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted December 20, 2022 Author Share Posted December 20, 2022 @forester2002s, the subie website tells me that's for a later model? Does that fit my 2002, also? https://parts.subaru.com/p/Subaru__/Engine-Cylinder-Head-Gasket/49223394/11044AA642.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forester2002s Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 1 hour ago, nelstomlinson said: @forester2002s, the subie website tells me that's for a later model? Does that fit my 2002, also? https://parts.subaru.com/p/Subaru__/Engine-Cylinder-Head-Gasket/49223394/11044AA642.html That MLS gasket is intended for turbo engines, but it fit my 2002 EJ251. It seals tight, and the engine runs fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathan909 Posted December 20, 2022 Share Posted December 20, 2022 (edited) I bought the Enginetech full-rebuild kit for my '99 EJ25 (DOHC) a few years back, and just for yuks, used the head gaskets supplied in the kit - I wanted to see how they'd stand up compared to the MLM gaskets we all know are the Right Thing. I got one year out of them before they leaked out, causing me to pull the heads and put in an MLM set. So the HGs in their kits are clearly crap, and I don't think I can recommend their head bolts either - some I got were, um, "less than straight". So the Enginetech kit is a perfectly reasonable - and very economical - kit, as long as you just toss the HGs and get HQ MLMs (incidentally, of late I've been buying Mahles from Rock - and they carry the Fuji Heavy Industries (Subaru) logo). Do it that way and you can get the quality where it matters (the HGs) and save a lot of money over a premium kit. Edited December 21, 2022 by jonathan909 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 Resurface heads, clean and lubricate the bolts and holes/threads and use Subaru head gaskets. I rarely get kits, I use Subaru MLS OEM or Fel Pro gaskets except when I need a custom thickness for a custom EJ then it’s cometic if necessary If you want to just get the parts needed: head gasket, intake and exhaust manifold, valve cover, spark plug tube, crank seal, cam seals, oil pump oring, thermostats gasket and water pump gasket. And engine coolant crossover orings I’ve never used anything but Subaru OEM and fel pro sometimes. I wouldn’t install anything else except cometic when I need a custom thickness for a custom EJ. Mahle, Beck Arnley, etc doesn’t have to always use the same supplier. Prior post says you’re good to go now. it just may not always be that way, I’ve seen suppliers change for the same brand and part number. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted December 21, 2022 Author Share Posted December 21, 2022 Thanks for all the help. I'm going with the Subaru #11044AA642 head gaskets, and I'll try the enginetech set for the rest. It claims to have MLS head gaskets too, but I'd rather not take a chance on that. Bad intake or valve cover gaskets are a smaller problem than a bad head gasket. I'm planning to take the heads up to the machine shop in Fairbanks next time I go up there, hopefully after the temps get back a little closer to zero. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted December 21, 2022 Author Share Posted December 21, 2022 Ordered Felpro headbolts, again, don't want to take a chance on the serious stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathan909 Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 (edited) About the head bolts: Even though people in the business of selling them say that they have to be replaced, they don't. Re-use them unless they're obviously damaged (e.g. corroded threads). Edited December 21, 2022 by jonathan909 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathan909 Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 23 minutes ago, nelstomlinson said: I'm planning to take the heads up to the machine shop in Fairbanks next time I go up there, hopefully after the temps get back a little closer to zero. How is it for you up there, brother? We woke up to -40 this morning, and a few miles up the road (Sundre) it was -42 (not counting wind chill, of course). But we're due for a Chinook, so we'll be back up around 0C for a few days around xmas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted December 21, 2022 Author Share Posted December 21, 2022 I'm hearing it's hit -40 in Fairbanks finally. We're getting wind and almost -30F. The cold came very late this year, and we've gotten more snow than we wanted. Probably going to have to wait a while for the Chinook to hit us, daytime highs slated to be well below zero as far as the weatherguessers can guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted December 21, 2022 Author Share Posted December 21, 2022 I don't know the history of this engine, these headbolts may have been reused before, may have been overtorqued, who knows? From the pictures, I'm going to have to get some metric 12 point sockets for those headbolts. Darn. I am _not_ trying to accumulate more metric stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idosubaru Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 (edited) 55 minutes ago, nelstomlinson said: I don't know the history of this engine, these headbolts may have been reused before, may have been overtorqued, who knows? From the pictures, I'm going to have to get some metric 12 point sockets for those headbolts. Darn. I am _not_ trying to accumulate more metric stuff. Replacing them is nice just to avoid cleaning them up, that's annoying. Subaru headbolts aren't TTY so there's no need to replace them unless they're rusted/damaged. Another option is to chase them with a 11x1.25 die. That will clean them and confirm the threads. https://www.ebay.com/itm/325066150971 I've seen repeat failures of new Fel Pro headbolts on engines I didn't work on. I'd guess it's more of an issue with the type of person replacing the bolts than the bolts themselves. For instance someone who ignores well known Subaru approaches to HG and just does it like they're grand daddy did it, which happens to include replacing the bolts. Although it is a stretch to assume Fel pro uses the same quality grade raw materials, machining and quality cotrol as Subaru OEM. I'd install used Subaru bolts before any aftermarket. I doubt the bolts are an issue but just providing additional options in case it's helpful as you dig in. Edited December 21, 2022 by idosubaru Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathan909 Posted December 21, 2022 Share Posted December 21, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, idosubaru said: Replacing them is nice just to avoid cleaning them up, that's annoying. Subaru headbolts aren't TTY so there's no need to replace them unless they're rusted/damaged. Another option is to chase them with a 11x1.25 die. That will clean them and confirm the threads. ...except if corrosion has actually removed portions of the threads. That's what had happened to the first of the H6s I did this summer, and I very reluctantly reused them because I was in a rush and under a lot of pressure. I knew they'd hold okay despite the voids - just a few mm of missing thread here and there - but didn't anticipate how much it would affect my ability to accurately torque them. The creak was unbelievable. So I'm just grateful it's holding together and I won't do that again. Edited December 21, 2022 by jonathan909 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted January 1, 2023 Author Share Posted January 1, 2023 The crank nose pulley and harmonic balancer are both pretty well ruined. The pic shows the crank nose pulley, with the woodruff key turned sideways. The key is chewed up, and it wallered out the keyways in the crank, pulley and balancer. Where do I find a new pulley? What part name or number do I search for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1 Lucky Texan Posted January 1, 2023 Share Posted January 1, 2023 maybe crank sprocket? becareful not to damage the tabs in the back - they are needed for the position sensor. I bet @GeneralDisorder or others can better advise you how to proceed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted January 1, 2023 Author Share Posted January 1, 2023 The tabs on the back are the least of the worries, that damaged keyway is way beyond usable. Don't know if it's clear in this pic, but the keyway is wallered out to the point that it will slop enough to feel on the new crank nose. I think maybe the damage was caused by the crank nose bolt being loose? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted January 1, 2023 Author Share Posted January 1, 2023 I might have answered my own question: the manual calls it a crankshaft sprocket, and searching Subaru, I came up with a part number of 13021AA16A. Looked up that part number on fleabay and saw 24 teeth and the right timing tabs on the back: six tabs, symmetric but unevenly spaced. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nvu Posted January 1, 2023 Share Posted January 1, 2023 56 minutes ago, nelstomlinson said: I think maybe the damage was caused by the crank nose bolt being loose? Yes, exactly because it was loose. Tighten to 133ft-lb, treat the procedure like headbolts. Oil up the bolt, clean out crankcase threads, try to torque in big 60 degree sweeps and avoid creaking. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted January 2, 2023 Author Share Posted January 2, 2023 @jonathan909, we saw nighttime lows of -48F before Christmas, and friends near the river saw -58F and their #1 heating oil gelled up. Back to +15F now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jonathan909 Posted January 4, 2023 Share Posted January 4, 2023 On 1/1/2023 at 8:04 PM, nelstomlinson said: @jonathan909, we saw nighttime lows of -48F before Christmas, and friends near the river saw -58F and their #1 heating oil gelled up. Back to +15F now. Ouch! Around here it warmed up as predicted and has been hovering around 0C - and predicted to stay there for a while. But I've lived here too long to be fooled into thinking that it feels like an early spring... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted January 29, 2023 Author Share Posted January 29, 2023 Y'all were right about the Felpro head bolts: they're garbage. The heads are between 14mm and 15mm, the threads are rough as if they're galvanized. I reused the originals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nelstomlinson Posted January 30, 2023 Author Share Posted January 30, 2023 The engine is back together, and we've dug the car out of the snowbank and gotten it into the shop to thaw out. We'll try to get it installed and tested tomorrow. What sort of oil do y'all recommend for the break in period? I'm figuring some cheap, non-synthetic 5W-30 for 500 miles, then an oil change with more dino oil and give it about 2000 miles before switching to synthetic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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